So I'm missing something but what can it be......

[screaming_pig]

Hi guys,

Well after dipping a toe in to straight shaving I've decided to revise what hones I need.
As some of you may be aware I'm currently restoring my Grandpops straight, and inevitably I'll have to hone the beast to bring it back to life!
I have a few Japanese waterstones that I use to sharpen my knives and wondered if any would be usefull in razor sharpening.
I have a feeling after reading countless posts that I may need a Norton combo and chineese 12k but thought what the heck I'll ask first before laying out some of the green stuff
So here is what I have, from left to right...

1. combo 250/1000
2. 800
3. 1200
4. 6000
5. Leather strop pasted with crox
6. Nagura stones x2
Also i have a canvas/leather strop.

Well whats the damage, any of use here???

 

[SliceOfLife]

I'd get a 3k-5k stone to go between 1200 and 6000 and then a china 12k or barber hone.

Naniwa 3k, Norton 4k, Taipea 5k, Masahiro 3k

Any of those would work.

Alternately you could get a coticule.

You really dont NEED anything. You can shave off a king 6000 just fine. But going from the 1200 to 6000 grit will take a bit of time.

 

[screaming_pig]

aha so maybe just a c12k and I'm all set, didnt know whether the edge from a 6k would be fine enough and the leap from 6k to 12k might have been a little to steap?!
thanks for the info

 

[SliceOfLife]

Kings are rated in JIS, so a 6k king is 9-10k on the Norton scale.

 

[screaming_pig]

wow this just gets even more confusing, so what would the king 1200 be on the Norton scale of things?
Just ordered the chineese 12k, looking around for something in between like you sugested.

edit: just found these......any of them useful??
http://www.axminster.co.uk/product-King-Japanese-Fine-and-Polishing-Waterstones-20288.htm
http://www.axminster.co.uk/recno/1/product-Ice-Bear-Ice-Bear-Extra-Wide-Japanese-Waterstone-29755.htm
sorry for all the questions, really appreciate all of your help

 

[forum9]

I use an 800 grit to make the bevel and a 5000 grit to polish the edge. So the hones you have will do a fantastic job, just make sure they are lapped flat using wet and dry paper on a flat surface. I have never found a need for a hone in the middle and the honing is very quick especially on a hollowed blade. All stages of honing are important and if you screw up any stage, the edge will be poor.

When you develop the bevel with an 800 to 1200 grit hone, you should always check that the “V” edge is developed the full length of the blade.
Needless to say, you will use the full length of the blade at some point during a shave. Check it with a good quality 10x jewellers loupe or similar magnification.

When you sharpen the edge on your 6000 grit hone, the edge should feel tomatoe cutting sharp. It should catch and cut an arm hair. It sort of raspy stick sharp not quite true razor sharp.

Finally, you need to polish the edge on a finishing stone. The Chinese 12K is
a fantastic hone. It’s the bargain of the century. Some say its slow, but that’s a relative term quoted by professional honers to whom time matters. The Chinese 12K puts a delightfully smooth finish to just about any razors edge. I find it to be equal in quality to much much more expensive finishing hones.

The edge coming off the Chinese 12K will crop your arm hair if you are not carefull. It wil ping the edges off if you run it gently accross the tops.

Finally, 50 laps on a good smooth leather strop and the edge will be perfect.
Shiny and sticky sharp. Actually, it’s best to not touch it because this final edge is very delicate.

When the blade dulls, the canvas may reinvigorate the edge, if not, just revisit the the Chinese 12K.

If you get it right, your Chinese 12k and your strop will keep the edge sharp and shiny for many many years.

The 10,000 grit hone from Axminster is a good hone. It is faster than the 12000 grit Chinese hone. But the finish you get from a Chinese 12K is smoother, so save your money.

There is a guy who sells the Chinese hone on UK ebay and he describes them as lapped. I bought mine in America and it needed to be lapped before use. I used 800 grit wet and dry paper. It took about 10 minutes to smooth and flatten and edge the surface.

A few more tips.
Make sure all of your hones are lapped flat.
Keep the blade flat on the hone or strop at all times except on removal.
The lighter the stroke, the sharper the blade as you come to the end of the honing process.
Chromium Oxide is 50,000 grit. Some guys will put five or ten laps on a chromed bench strop or hanging strop inbetween the 12k and the leather strop. I think this gives a totally unnecessary turbo boost to the edge but at the expense of the cutting life of the edge. I use to do it, but I don’t any more. I find I can achieve the same degree of smoothness with my strop and that the pasted route is totally unnecessary. You will have to work this one out for yourself however, depending on your honing and stropping skills.

Good luck and I hope my advice helps.

 

[screaming_pig]

Forum9 I must say a massive thankyou for taking the time to explain the steps and what is required. Its helps a great deal for a beginning straight shaver like myself, I do have a jewellers loupe so will bring that out for the 'action'!
Once again many thanks.

 

[SliceOfLife]

King 1200 is ~1800-2000 on the Norton scale if I remember correctly.

 

[ouch]

aha so maybe just a c12k and I'm all set, didnt know whether the edge from a 6k would be fine enough and the leap from 6k to 12k might have been a little to steap?!

A jump from a 6K to a 12K is the same as a jump from a 1K to a 2K, or from a 3K to a 6K. It's a halving of the grit size.

 

[treydampier]

I have honed a fair share of razors and I think the Chinese 12K or another finishing stone in that rating is warranted. You may have to do up to 150 laps on it coming off the King 6000, but I think the shave would not be a good as some think. However, adding a finisher like the Chinese natural, Japanese Natural, Escher, Thuringian, or Naniwa 12K would make things optimum.
Its up to you, I agree you should try what you have and shave with it, if it works then save you money. If its uncomfortable, then purchase the finisher. In the end, what matters is the shave, not the method of how you get there.

 

[mattbikes1]

I must also thank you forum9, after much deliberation I ordered a c12k and a DMT 325 for maintaining and lapping respectively. I was figuring that I should lap the c12k first, but you have answered that and a few other questions too. Great thread Ian!