Remington 870 Express vs Wingmaster

[Commander Quan]

Does anyone know exactly what the difference is between these two models? I know the stock's materials are different, and many claim the Wingmaster has a more refined action, but nothing I have read has been definitive on any other differences.

I have a 50 year old 16 gauge Wingmaster, which was an heirloom, and enjoy shooting clays with it, but 16 gauge shells are becoming harder to find. I'd like to purchase a 12 gauge, and am wondering if there are other differences that would make the Wingmaster a better value 50 years from now.

 

[Crixus]

I do know the Wingmaster is considered to be a more refined instrument than its more common cousins the 870 and 870 Express. The 870 line is the "Wingmaster for the masses." You will have to do some more searches to find the differences other than the obvious furniture upgrade.

If you are asking if a Wingmaster purchased today would be worth more in 50 years than an 870 purchased today, I would feel confident saying yes. The 870 is a great little pump, but there are a gazillion of them out there. There will be lots more of them to pick from in the future than there will be Wingmasters. Plus, the Wingmaster already has decades and decades of cred going for it. Lore is worth something.

 

[dreadpirate]

I believe the Express is the low-end model. That being said, I have one and like it! But at the time I bought the 870 Express, I had very little extra money to spend. If I were buying an 870 model today, the Wingmaster or Wingmaster Classic Trap (depending on what you want) would be it.

 

[petr]

Wood. Bluing. Finish. Fit. Front bead. Wingmasters are a part of Americana. One of my favorites.

 

[ia_james]

Wood. Bluing. Finish. Fit. Front bead. Wingmasters are a part of Americana. One of my favorites.

This is it, essentially. The smoothness of the action can be reproduced in an Express with lots of cycling or some gunsmithing. After that, it's up to you how important the bluing and wood are.

 

[the_ogre25]

Are the trigger assembly's of the Wingmaster metal versus the plastic Express? I have an Express with many rounds through it and the action is very smooth, that said I want to pick up a Wingmaster someday.

 

[MrMurphy]

Far as I know Wingmasters, like Police Magnums, have steel or aluminum where Expresses have plastic parts. Thus the added cost.

They are also on the receiving end of more QC and time in assembly from what I remember, and have a smoother initial action. MUCH better finish. The 870 Express works, but the Wingmaster is simply nicer overall. Think of it as a completely stripped stock Jeep Wrangler vs a Rubicon.

 

[swcarter]

Far as I know Wingmasters, like Police Magnums, have steel or aluminum where Expresses have plastic parts. Thus the added cost.

They are also on the receiving end of more QC and time in assembly from what I remember, and have a smoother initial action. MUCH better finish. The 870 Express works, but the Wingmaster is simply nicer overall. Think of it as a completely stripped stock Jeep Wrangler vs a Rubicon.

I think that explanation and the others just preceding it are about right. I have Wingmasters in 12, 16 and 20 and like them all for different reasons. Sharp looking and good operating shotguns. I know friends who have the Express models and they don't seem to suffer any. They appear to be good, solid shotguns that operate really well - and better the more you use them. I got the Wingmaster versions because I had to cash to spend at the time and thought the upgrades were worth it but I don't really see how you could go wrong either way. The model 870 seems to have surely stood the test of time.

 

[UncleScott]

Both are fine guns, the Wingmasters just have a few more refinements:

The Express:
A rougher, unpolished finish inside and out. More burrs.
A rough black finish.
A hardwood or synthetic stock.
Cheaper, impressed checkering.
A black bolt.
A plastic trigger group.
The new style magazine assembly with plastic parts and the "dimples".
A rougher bore in the barrel.
Uses some MIM, (moulded steel parts) in critical areas, like the extractor.

The Wingmaster:
A much smoother, polished finish inside and out. No burrs.
A polished blue finish.
Walnut or synthetic stocks with choice of gloss or satin finish.
Better quality checkering.
A chrome plated bolt.
An aluminum trigger group.
The old style steel magazine assembly, no dimples.
A much smoother bore.
No MIM parts are used in any critical area.

I've had my Express since they first came out in the late 1980's and it has been a great gun with no problems. But i still have to say that the wingmaster is just a better looking gun.

 

[Commander Quan]

Thanks guys. The supply issue is one of my biggest concerns, and I just happened to stumble upon 16 gauge Remington Game loads on sale at Dicks, and bought all they had...all 5 boxes.

Even if I have to pay a little more for them, I can buy a lot of 16 gauge shells for the cost of a new gun. As infrequently as I shoot I should be able to stock up when I find them, and have enough on hand for when I need them, although, I'm hoping to get out more

If the opportunity arises and the funds are in order I'll pickup a 12 gauge Wingmaster but for right now I'll keep using the old gun.

After starting this thread I pulled the gun out to look at it, and it is actually from 1952, the second year Remington made the 870.

 

[Crixus]

Derrick, I would definitely hang on to a 60 year old Wingmaster. My first shotgun was a bolt action 16 gauge from Sears that had a big Poly-Choke on the end. It's a nice gauge that's still pretty popular in Europe. You'll always be able to get loads for it if you plan ahead. If you run completely dry in TinyTown, USA you'll probably be out of luck. You'll just never be able to take advantage of those promotional prices that 12 and 20 gauge target loads sell for occasionally, but so what.

You have a piece of Americana shotgun lore and in one of the rarer gauges to boot.

 

[eightysixCJ]

They are also on the receiving end of more QC and time in assembly from what I remember, and have a smoother initial action. MUCH better finish. The 870 Express works, but the Wingmaster is simply nicer overall. Think of it as a completely stripped stock Jeep Wrangler vs a Rubicon.

I'm not sure they're similar to base Jeeps vs Rubi's where Rubis are on the same chassis with a better drivetrain and options. Express guns have noticeably less finish work and plastic or rough birch stocks. I have a late eighties/early nineties 870 ex. 2 3/4" that I've hunted waterfowl for years with. It's no comparison to my Citori but has worked fine and I don't mind it sloshing in the bilge. From what I've seen, the wingmaster is better finished, more polished, and probably has more steel vs cast aluminum parts than the exp. IMO the express is a solid starter pump and offer similar performance to the express with lower aesthetics.

Tom

 

[swcarter]

Thanks guys. The supply issue is one of my biggest concerns, and I just happened to stumble upon 16 gauge Remington Game loads on sale at Dicks, and bought all they had...all 5 boxes.

Even if I have to pay a little more for them, I can buy a lot of 16 gauge shells for the cost of a new gun. As infrequently as I shoot I should be able to stock up when I find them, and have enough on hand for when I need them, although, I'm hoping to get out more

If the opportunity arises and the funds are in order I'll pickup a 12 gauge Wingmaster but for right now I'll keep using the old gun.

After starting this thread I pulled the gun out to look at it, and it is actually from 1952, the second year Remington made the 870.

The supply of shotshells for the 16 was the only problem I encountered when I first got my Wingmaster. I purchased the 16 more out of nostalgia although I like the guage. I solved the problem by buying by the case from my gunsmith but the availability is still pretty limited as you indicate.

 

[stobes21]

Have you considered reloading your 16ga shells? All of the components except for the wads and the hulls aren't gauge specific so you should have a much easier time keeping sufficient stocks on hand. You'll save substantial money per box of shells over factory loads and a decent reloader will cost you quite a bit less than a new gun.

 

[gaseousclay]

the Express is Remington's budget rifle to my understanding. go with the Wingmaster

 

[Crixus]

the Express is Remington's budget rifle to my understanding. go with the Wingmaster

I'm sure you meant to say budget shotgun.

 

[gaseousclay]

I'm sure you meant to say budget shotgun.

oops, yep, I meant shotgun

 

[Commander Quan]

Have you considered reloading your 16ga shells?

Yes, I have thought about it, but I would have to do significantly more shooting to justify reloading.

 

[Crixus]

You know you can get all the 16 gauge ammo you want online. Pick out the different loads you might need over the next five or six years and get them from the same vendor. All size shot, steel shot, Hevi-Shot, buckshot and slugs readily available. That will keep your mandatory ground shipment fee to a minimum.

 

[The Nid Hog]

That fifty year old Wingmaster must be a thing of beauty. In the '80s, I had a couple dozen 870s in my armory (Marine sea duty) and they were already pretty old. The Navy was very generous with their training budget and those guns had seen a tremendous amount of use. Even so, they required the least maintenance of anything I had and they were as smooth as could be. You're a lucky guy.