As mentioned before try riding the cap. Combine this with short strokes. Between those strokes concentrate on keeping that angle. This worked wonders for me. Just slow down and what ever you do don't confuse short strokes with choppy ones.
Razors with wide/forgiving blade angle?
- Thread starter mousecop
- Start date
Gillette Heavy aka Redtip
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Great efficient and mild razor.
I'm not sure more gap or blade exposure is what would serve you best. If you want a comfortable shave, its easier to accomplish with a mild, and yet still effective razor.
A post war Gillette Tech or the RR Tech II/DE1 I think would serve you well. They both use the same head, only the handles differ.
RazoRock DE1 Safety Razor – ItalianBarber
RazoRock Teck II Safety Razor – ItalianBarber
The RR Tech II is a copy of the post war Gillette Tech.
My jawline and neck is hard to shave and I've recently used a post war Gillette Tech with a fresh Feather blade. That shave consisted of 3 full passes, then another four clean ups on my jawline and neck. Thats a lot of passes and yet when I was finished, my skin I felt like I hadnt even shaved and I had a very close BBS finish.
I used a Gillette English Tech for years and found it to work, but horribly boring.
Boring yeah, but theres comfort in that. I sometimes find the milder razors frustrating. I dont like needing that many passes, or that much time to shave, but they are nice to go back to now and then.
I have a made in England Gillette Old Type clone that saves me around one full pass for the same BBS finish. Its just as comfortable to use and a little more efficient. It shaves exactly how you might think an OC Tech would shave.
Its a fantastic razor, especially for the $5 I paid for it! It can still be frustrating at times needing more than my usual 1 1/2 to 2 1/2 passes, but that kind of comfort is difficult to go without.
- Thread starter
- #27
If the NEW LC I am going to try doesn't work, where did you get your Old Type from? Just curious. Thanks!
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Caveat: Rarely do I shave with more than one pass, my whiskers aren't particularly wiry, I only own a handful of razors.
Gillette Tech's already been suggested. However last night was my first and only shave with a RR SLOC, ($15). Trying to find a workable angle was silly. It worked in any reasonable position. Audible feedback was clear as was tactile. Ended up with a remarkable shave out of the gate, no irritation whatsoever. Really surprised since it looks like it eats face for dinner.
Gillette Tech's already been suggested. However last night was my first and only shave with a RR SLOC, ($15). Trying to find a workable angle was silly. It worked in any reasonable position. Audible feedback was clear as was tactile. Ended up with a remarkable shave out of the gate, no irritation whatsoever. Really surprised since it looks like it eats face for dinner.
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I have found that the key feature for me is blade rigidity (ie. the blades that are held in place the tightest). When the blade doesn't move (also called flick or chatter), I get much less irritation.
In my experience, the razors I've used with the least chatter/most rigidity are:
1. Razorock Game Changer
2. Fatip Testina
3. Fatip Retro Open Comb
4. Gillette Old Type
5. Razorock Old Type
6. Razorock Teck II
7. PAA Bakelite OC Slant (tightened)
8. Merkur 25C
9. Razorock SLOC
Of those, the Game Changer, Testina, and Razorock Old Type gives me the closest shaves with the least amount of irritation. The Fatip OC, Gillette Old, and PAA BOCS are significantly more aggressive and tend to get more use during travel or after skipping a few days. I found the Razorock German 37, Ming Shi, Lord L6, Nanjie TTO, EJ DE89 to have more chatter or a smaller window that made for too many passes or discomfort of some type.
As someone prone to irritation, I would point out that razors are just 1 variable, and it's been a long journey to find really close and comfortable shaves. So, I'll just add my $.02 on soaps, blades and prep.
First, I noticed some of the biggest gains in comfort based on improved prep. A good face wash/scrub (for me Dove and a dedicated face wash cloth) were key to lifting and hydrating the hairs before my shave. It's a couple extra minutes, but you only get 1 face.
Second, not all unscented soaps are created equal. I find most perfumes, any tallow, or any lanolin will cause me to have noticeable irritation (for example, I can't get irritation free shaves with Latha Unscented because of tallow - despite multiple attempts). My personal favorites for unscented vegan (typically glycerin based soaps) are:
1. Ogallala Bay Rum Unscented
2. Soap Commander Integrity
3. Vander Hagen Unscented
(honorable mention: Proraso White, Razorock Lavender)
Third, blades matter A LOT. This is probably the most personal choice, but a short list of go to blades for me that are super smooth, but still relatively sharp: Personna Reds, Rapira Platinum Lux, Astra SP, Nacets, Gillette Greens, Polsiver SI, and Treet Black Beauty.
(Honorable mention: Permasharp, Dorco 301, Voshkod, Derby Extra)
Finally, post shave is often ignored, but closing your pores with a splash of cold water, using a quality toner (my go tos are Thayers Aloe or Witchhazel or Latha Unscented) will help a lot. Following that up with a moisturizing face lotion or balm is also a great way to protect the skin and reduce irritation (I always seem to go back to Nivea Shave Balm).
Anyway, I hope that helps and you get some great shaves.
PS: there are some really great razors that I've heard are very rigid and easy to find the angle (I have not used these, but they are widely recommended). A non-exhaustive list in no particular order:
Timeless SS (.68 or .95)
Karve (especially B-D)
Muhle R41
ATT M2/R2
Rex Ambassador
Parker Variant
Rockwell 6s (especially 3/4)
Razorock Wunderbar
Razorock Mamba (milder)
As always, YMMV. Cheers.
In my experience, the razors I've used with the least chatter/most rigidity are:
1. Razorock Game Changer
2. Fatip Testina
3. Fatip Retro Open Comb
4. Gillette Old Type
5. Razorock Old Type
6. Razorock Teck II
7. PAA Bakelite OC Slant (tightened)
8. Merkur 25C
9. Razorock SLOC
Of those, the Game Changer, Testina, and Razorock Old Type gives me the closest shaves with the least amount of irritation. The Fatip OC, Gillette Old, and PAA BOCS are significantly more aggressive and tend to get more use during travel or after skipping a few days. I found the Razorock German 37, Ming Shi, Lord L6, Nanjie TTO, EJ DE89 to have more chatter or a smaller window that made for too many passes or discomfort of some type.
As someone prone to irritation, I would point out that razors are just 1 variable, and it's been a long journey to find really close and comfortable shaves. So, I'll just add my $.02 on soaps, blades and prep.
First, I noticed some of the biggest gains in comfort based on improved prep. A good face wash/scrub (for me Dove and a dedicated face wash cloth) were key to lifting and hydrating the hairs before my shave. It's a couple extra minutes, but you only get 1 face.
Second, not all unscented soaps are created equal. I find most perfumes, any tallow, or any lanolin will cause me to have noticeable irritation (for example, I can't get irritation free shaves with Latha Unscented because of tallow - despite multiple attempts). My personal favorites for unscented vegan (typically glycerin based soaps) are:
1. Ogallala Bay Rum Unscented
2. Soap Commander Integrity
3. Vander Hagen Unscented
(honorable mention: Proraso White, Razorock Lavender)
Third, blades matter A LOT. This is probably the most personal choice, but a short list of go to blades for me that are super smooth, but still relatively sharp: Personna Reds, Rapira Platinum Lux, Astra SP, Nacets, Gillette Greens, Polsiver SI, and Treet Black Beauty.
(Honorable mention: Permasharp, Dorco 301, Voshkod, Derby Extra)
Finally, post shave is often ignored, but closing your pores with a splash of cold water, using a quality toner (my go tos are Thayers Aloe or Witchhazel or Latha Unscented) will help a lot. Following that up with a moisturizing face lotion or balm is also a great way to protect the skin and reduce irritation (I always seem to go back to Nivea Shave Balm).
Anyway, I hope that helps and you get some great shaves.
PS: there are some really great razors that I've heard are very rigid and easy to find the angle (I have not used these, but they are widely recommended). A non-exhaustive list in no particular order:
Timeless SS (.68 or .95)
Karve (especially B-D)
Muhle R41
ATT M2/R2
Rex Ambassador
Parker Variant
Rockwell 6s (especially 3/4)
Razorock Wunderbar
Razorock Mamba (milder)
As always, YMMV. Cheers.
The R41 was redesigned in 2013 ( I believe with a wider cap to reduce exposure) and is very civilized since then. Most of its bloodthirsty reputation was based on the 2011 design. Last Black Friday, I bought a current R41 head from Maggard's and found it to shave (for me) similar to a Maggard V3A or a Fendrihan Mk. II.
- Thread starter
- #32
Oh wow I was unaware of this. I will definitely be thinking about picking one up now and just skip the Gillette Old type
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jackgoldman123
Boring and predictable
In what I posted earlier, I just wanted to give my story as my experience with DE89 is similar to yours. What my story tells is that there is more to shaving than range of working angles. For example Tech worked well even though it is milder and having a more narrow range. Also, R41 with wider range worked well, while at that point of my journey DE89 did not work. I was a newbie at that point and I do not know what factor caused this. Blade rigidity might have been a such factor.
While R41 was my favorite razor for a long time, I have a growing love for ultra mild razors. Despite the more narrow range, they do not irritate my neck.
You've gotten a lot of good advice in this thread. The Old is very nice as well. And note the weasel words "for me" that I put in there. If you wait a day or two you may see others disagreeing with me. But at about $27 for the R41 head to put on your DE89 handle, it's price competitive with a lot of other choices. Can't beat Mike's $5 Old find, though.
The Single Ring my nephew sent me. The rest came from an 'antique' shop in a little one stop sign town about 20 minutes from me.
If you see any places like that stop and check. You never know what you might find.
This is what I found there and they have more.
L-R. Made in Canada Gillette Old Type. British Clone with a Fat Tech handle. Post war Canadian Tech. M1(1967) Slim.
The Brit clone and Tech were a mismatch so I bought both. The Canadian Old Types are harder to come by so I didnt pass it up. Who can pass up $5 razors? lol
I was back there last weekend and they still have a few, but the other Tech with a Fat Handle is now $25. I should have bought it when I was there the first time but I dont need two Techs. The one I have is actually the 4th one I've had in the last year.
Do yourself a huge favor. Dont pass over the Gillette Old Types. They are simply great razors. If I could only keep one of the razors I own it would be my Single Ring, but that British clone is a really nice shaver.
When looking at the Gillette Old Types, which are quite common and rarely expensive unless you're looking at Single Rings, just look for bent teeth. If they have bent teeth they've most likely been dropped. That can also bend the base plate too.
See my 1917 Single Ring below.
Before. Notice the corners of the cap. Its been dropped and the corners rolled over. Those 'feet' stopped the cap from properly securing the blade against the base plate. That allowed the blade to chatter between cap and base.
At the advice of @rudyt I filed those 'feet' off. That took all of 30 seconds with a metal nail file. Then I gently worked the baseplate on a hard flat surface, actually the side of my desk haha, with a plastic hammer.
After.
Again, notice the corners of the cap. It now securely locks the blade down. The base plate could still use a little work, but as it is right now its a simply fantastic razor and I might even prefer it over my Fatip Grande.
The vintage Gillettes are, in large part, solid brass. Brass is easy to work if you use a little care and understand what you're doing. Bent teeth however, need to be annealed before you straighten them or they'll break off.
If you find a nice, straight, Old Type for the right price, buy it. You may never want another razor.
The Canadian Old Type by the way, is also the most rigid razor I have ever seen and it has, literally, no gap at all. The teeth in the comb under the blade are machined flat. The blade sits directly on them right to the blades very edge.
@Twelvefret
I'd take any Old Type over my SS, or Regent, any day of the week.
Dont let the condition of any old brass razor stop you. Especially if its straight. Brass is easy to work and even easier to clean. Someone, @Chan Eil Whiskers, even managed to find a cased straight Old Type for $12 if I remember correctly. No one wanted it because it was 'dirty'.
I'd take any Old Type over my SS, or Regent, any day of the week.
Dont let the condition of any old brass razor stop you. Especially if its straight. Brass is easy to work and even easier to clean. Someone, @Chan Eil Whiskers, even managed to find a cased straight Old Type for $12 if I remember correctly. No one wanted it because it was 'dirty'.
I've got three. The first photo is a razor dated 1916. You can see someone took a pair of pliers to the ring. The ball end type are not dated. One has the thin cap and the other the thick.
To fix those marks, I'd spin it between my thumb and finger with some wet sandpaper. Watch closely as you do it, wet paper cuts fast. 600grit should do the trick and the marks will be gone in about a minute, as long as they arent too deep. They dont look that bad from what I can see.
A quick polish after and back to shiny new looking.
I did some minimal sanding with 4/0 steel wool. Then another remember commented the wrench marks made the razor interesting and I found I agreed. I mean, it is 102 years old after all.
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