Muhle R89 or R41 and some further advice for a newb

[Oliwerko]

Hi there you lot!

I'm new to 'serious' wet shaving, which has to be said first. What also has to be said is that I did quite a substantial research, so I'm not 'completely' new to everything

Second, I'm looking to buy a DE razor and I narrowed the search down to Muhle. Now the thing is that I don't know whether to go for a tooth comb or for the safer (and milder?) closed comb.

So far I've only tried my grand-grandfathers OC old razor, which I found to be too mild, forcing me to put pressure and do several passes. The shave is very good. Not great, but good. But the process wasn't really enjoyable as I had to do at least 5 (at least 2 ATG) passes at some places.

What I'm looking for is the closest shave possible. I don't mind a learning curve. I want a tool that works. I can, and will persevere in learning. Even with this old razor I can see I want to.

Now, I've read that the R41 is definitely not for beginners, is aggressive and so on. Is that true? Is it so aggressive that I will bathe myself in blood when I try to use it? Do I definitely need to start with a milder thing?

What about the R89? I've only read that it's superb. Does it provide a very close shave?

Thanks for any advice, it's very appreciated!

PS: I'm thinking of using Derby blades and Vulfix cream. Good? Bad?
PSS: A very nice place you have here!

 

[mcgils]

Welcome. I got an R41 and promptly traded it to someone that felt comfortable using it. I have the EJ DE89 and the Merkur 34C. I'll stick with those for a while. I think that the R89 is the same head as the DE89.

 

[Broccoli Man]

Welcome to B&B! Mühles are great razors and you can't really go wrong with any of them so far as quality is concerned. But as you probably know, the R41 and R89 are polar opposites in terms of aggressiveness. I can only speak based on my experience, but a lot has to do with your skin/beard type and technique. If you're still relatively new to wet shaving, the R41 is a pretty bold choice. It is a truly top-notch razor in the right hands, but speaking from personal experience, it isn't necessarily the kind of razor you want to use while you're still figuring out the basic methodology of DE razors. I bought one fairly early in my wet shaving career and it almost put me off altogether. Having said that, it will certainly provide the closest shave possible once you learn how to tame it. If you take it slow and make a conscious effort to limit blade pressure, you can probably avoid a bloodbath, but it will definitely punish you for mistakes more than just about any other razor I've ever used.

The R89, on the other hand, I loved from day one and still use on a fairly regular basis. It's the only razor I like so much, I actually have two. For me, it strikes the perfect balance between mildness and efficacy. My skin is relatively sensitive, so I tend to gravitate toward the less aggressive end of the spectrum anyway, but I've never had any trouble getting a BBS result from the R89. Unless you have exceptionally resilient skin and/or supreme confidence in your technique, this is the one I would recommend to start with. I think you'll find that paired with a Feather blade (which seems to be the consensus pick for sharpest DE blade money can buy), it will give you as good a shave as the R41 and be a lot more forgiving to boot.

Basically, it comes down the fact that the R41 is a very divisive razor to which some pledge eternal devotion and others avoid like the plague. It would be a shame to buy it as a first razor and find you fall into the latter camp. The R89, on the other hand, some find it too mild for their taste, but I don't know anyone who utterly detests it. I think nearly everyone can agree that it's a highly effective razor that would be a much safer bet for someone still learning the ropes. And I don't mean that in a condescending way. I've been wet shaving for a couple of years and I still don't reach for my R41 unless I have plenty of time to concentrate on the shave. But my R89 is an all-time favorite and I'd recommend it to anyone of any skill level.

 

[Broccoli Man]

Oh, and to answer your other question, I think Derbys are OK to start with, as they are a fairly forgiving blade (though definitely not the sharpest), but Feather and Astra are my personal favorites and have a pretty good reputation generally. Personna Reds also get a lot of love around here. Can't comment on Vulfix cream, as I've never tried it, but I'm a big fan of their brushes.

 

[nvpliers]

If the EJ DE89 uses the same head as the Muhle 89, then I essentially own and shave with both the 89 head, and the Muhle R41. I like them both very much. They are opposites as far as the level aggressiveness goes, as stated by others. I like the 89 for everyday use, but when I need to break out the heavy artillery to tackle heavier growth, the R41 gets the nod. Both will give you a very close shave, although the 89 is more forgiving. Now that's not to say the 89 is unable to handle heavier growth, because it can and has. It's just a matter of efficiency. Good Luck.

 

[dreadpirate]

I use to own a Muhle R41 and IMHO, I would not recommend this as a first DE. The R89 would be a good way to go. Or even a Merkur 34C.

 

[crfcom]

There may not be anything wrong with your grandfather's OC. The blade you're using is part of the equation. What blade are you using? A sharp blade can make a big difference as can beard prep. I wouldn't just assume the razor is the problem.
As to the question you pose, you are getting some good advice, I think. The R89/DE89 is a wonderful head. Even if you end up buying more aggressive razors down the road, you will probably always have use for the 89 head. It responds well to many different blades.

 

[Agravic]

Welcome fellow newbie!

I would recommend you go with the R89 now, and practice practice practice. It will make the R41 easier to rein in and enjoy when the time is right.

I speak from my own experience, but of course YMMV. Good luck!

 

[Viseguy]

Sounds like you're a candidate for the R41. Give yourself several weeks -- maybe even a month or two -- to mount the learning curve. If it ends up being too much razor, consider a Fatip or Joris as a more aggressive alternative to the R89. Good luck!

 

[Oliwerko]

Thank you all for valuable advice!

Most of you said what I thought but wasn't sure about it, now I am. I think that even though I may have enough respect and patience for the R41; it's a bit steep hill to climb, and I'll probably go with the R89.

I'll get a bunch of Feather and Derby blades. We have Wilkinson ones available at the local store, so that's another thing I can try later.

re. crfcom - I know, I just don't have anything else to begin with, and I don't want to be carrying this ancient thing with me so I'm looking to buy my own anyway. But you are right, and I'm in no way blaming the razor.

I'm really curious what the shaving experience with this thing will be