Kanayama has arrived!

[cb91710]

Wow!

Super fast shipping from Denmark. I ordered from JNS on 8/3 at about 4pm, which would have been 1am on Saturday in Copenhagen...
It arrived today. Just 6 days from ordering and really only 4 working days.

This is the "Llama" brand 2196, Best Razor Strop Co, Tokyo Japan, "Gear.M.Co Tokusei"

The thickness of the leather/suede component tapers from about 2mm at the clamp to just a smidge under 5mm at the Barber's cut. I'd almost want to call it a "log" taper... it does not begin a noticeable taper until the midpoint, but it's still barely measurable. 75% of the taper is in the last 20% of the length.

Curious...
When using the suede, should I just flop the canvas over the end and deal with the twist, find a way to tuck the canvas above the strop, or does everyone just remove it?
I remembered one review where the user was not complimentary toward the canvas element and commented that it killed his HHT.

I haven't even taken it to the den yet, but this thing is slicker than greased snot! I can already tell it is going to have ZERO draw!

 

[Kentos]

Nice! There is definitely a sensation under the razor on my Kanayama. Draw is minimal, but it's not like stropping on ice IMO. It's quite pleasurable.

 

[cb91710]

So what about the canvas?
Should I just stash it with the Mountain Mike's 3" in the closet and use only suede until it's time to pull out the CrOX-loaded Illinois 127?

 

[Kentos]

I would use them and see. I really like the suade for post shave stropping, and linen is nice preshave, although I never tried Kanayama's linen.
On my tri strop I just let the linen hang off to the side as I move to the inner leather, then swivel it all around for the "money strop"

 

[cb91710]

I tried letting it hang off the side and it's too stiff and heavy compared to the thin end of the leather and torqued it over.
I ended up tucking it under the door of the chest to hold it up, then removed it from the clamp.

 

[Kentos]

I did read some where that the linen needs some working over before it gets all nice and soft. I'll look for that thread later.

 

[Wid]

I also have the 2196 but only have 2 elements to mine, leather and linen.

 

[Doc226]

Boom-Chikki-Boom-Boom

 

[Gamma]

I have the 8000 - the linen is seperate.
I use the back side of the suede that faces out, and while it's an interesting surface to work on, I'm not totally in love with it.
I tried the suede's inner surface (that faces the back-side of the cordovan) and was less than pleased.
If anyone here uses that inner surface, please let me know what I'm missing.

I really like the linen - I hand-worked it to release some of the stiffness when I got it. I still do from time to time.
I have a few different linen hangers, and a few cotton ones too - the Kanayama is by far the best, albeit the most difficult to work with.
For me - I find that the cordovan serves best after I've had a shave on the razor. I still prefer to strop on very heavy HH right after honing.

The 8k is an excellent strop, but if I had to pick one and only one leather strop to use I'd stick to my 3" Ambrose HH.

 

[cb91710]

I also have the 2196 but only have 2 elements to mine, leather and linen.

Mine is only two belts, I just assumed that the back side of the leather was the suede element (and it seemed to work great).

 

[hokahay]

The 2196 is a user grade strop built for specific retailers. It is in the 10000 range. It consists of a leather and a linen. There is no suede component. The back of the leather like any strop is not meant for stropping.

Let me quote a Greybeard post and one from Jim R. for a complete breakdown of the strops.

"From doing research before I picked up my first Kanayama, this is what I gathered.

The feel of a Kanayama is unique. The feel appears to be the same with all the models except that the thicker strops have less flex.
The linen component is the same (except for length) for all models of Kanayama. The linen on new Kanayamas is supposed to be slightly softer than the previous linen used.
There is only one suede/secondary leather component and it is made from horsehide. All Kanayama finish components are supposed to be made from shell.


There are two grades of leather. The 10,000/20,000, the 30,000/40,000, and the 50,000/60,000 use one grade with the only difference between the 3 groups being the thickness of the leather. 1/2 to 1 mm difference between each group starting at 2 - 2.5mm with the 10,000/20,000. The 10,000/20,000 may be more prone to cupping/stretching over time due to the thinness of the leather. I haven't read of any owner experiencing either problem.
The 10,000, 30,000, 50,000 are 24" long, the 20,000, 40,000, 60,000 are 26" long.
The 70,000, 80,000, 90,000 use a supposedly better grade of leather with the 80,000/90,000 being thicker than the 70,000.
The 70,000 comes with linen only. The 80,000/90,000 are tri-strops with linen/suede/shell.
The 70,000, 80,000 are 24" long. The 90,000 is 26" long.


The 35,000 and 55,000 strops were made specifically for Easternsmooth. They were slightly wider, without the gold stamps and used suede instead of linen as the second component.
The #3 strop was originally a special order made for one of Kanayama's retail customers that substituted the suede component for the linen. The thickness of the leather appears to be definitely thicker than the 10,000/20,000 but not quite as thick as the 30,000/40,000.


The 4 digit codes (e.g. 2196) appear to be models that are made for specific retailers, or for Kanayama brands for specific market segments, or custom configurations (such as strops with handles). The thickness of the 2196 is in the 10,000 range. The 6300 is in the 30,000 range.
Last edited by Greybeard; 05-27-2012 at 07:01 PM.




Jim R. Northern Smooth
The Kanayama strops are all made of high quality cordovan leather, hand selected and finished by Yoshimasa Naomi. The different models are based on leather thickness/length. There are 2 grades of leather: #20000, #30000/#40000, #50000/#60000 and 70000/80000/90000 (for the #3/#4 and #5/#6, the first number denotes a 60cm strop, the second 66cm--for the #7/#8/#9, the #7/#8 are 60cm, #9 is 66cm).


The highest grade, the #7/#8/#9, are professional strops. They are made with the thickest, hardiest leather, meant to stand up to years of hard use every day by busy barbers, but with the same smooth, luxurious finish of all the strops. In addition, the 8/9 models are tri-strops, adding a second, slightly napped horsehide leather element [wrl: think suede-like] as an intermediate between the linen and the fine cordovan finisher.


The thinnest strops, the #10000 and #20000, are entry-level strops. Over a few years time, they may begin to stretch or warp under normal use. The midlevel strops are of course a balance between price and thickness (and thus, durability).


For a normal user, Yoshimasa-san recommends the #30000/#40000 as the best all-around strop. The #50000/#60000 leather is good for the heavy user, the edge hobbyist or honemeister. The professional strops are just that--professional grade, for the heaviest user (or for the perfectionist/completist...)"

 

[cb91710]

I wish I had known that before ordering. I trusted JNS since they seem to be one of the go-to places for stones and I couldn't find anyone else actively selling from Yahoo/Google searches since Eastern no longer offers them. A lot of reviews, but little details.
The translated descriptions on what was found made it difficult to tell what was what.

Looking at Aframestokyo (finally found a reference here after I had ordered) it looks like the #3 is only Cordovan and suede.
The $200+ packages come with the linen component.

 

[hokahay]

JNS was selling what they advertised.

I suggested the #3 when you were looking as the best deal. And it has the suede component and a leather. For $104.00.

Now you have a 2196 that is leather and linen. Buy a #3 now then you'd be similar to an 80,000 with an extra leather. The 80,000 and 90,000 at Aframestokyo are each really two separate strops as greybeard described. The first strop is like a #3 with leather and a suede. The second strop is a linen alone.

I have a 2196, a #3, a 6300 and an 80,000. The leather/suede components of the #3 and the 80,000 compared look almost the same to me. THey are all as new and unused. I use my Tony Millers!

 

[cb91710]

JNS was selling what they advertised.

I suggested the #3 when you were looking as the best deal. And it has the suede component and a leather. For $104.00.

Kinda... I had already ordered at that point.
I ordered when reading Doc's "How many shaves" thread... posted up about the purchase shortly after, but we may have had a bit of back and forth between the posting and my purchase.

Buy a #3 now then you'd be similar to an 80,000 with an extra leather. The 80,000 and 90,000 at Aframestokyo are each really two separate strops as greybeard described. The first strop is like a #3 with leather and a suede. The second strop is a linen alone.

Read my mind. I ordered the #3 a couple of hours ago.

I use my Tony Millers!

Been wanting to get in on a TM for months, but every time I check his site, he's already booked up for that production run.
Last time he commented about emails, and it gave me the feeling that he was not even accepting emails for backorders at this point.

I really did like the feel of this 2196... and for the back not supposed to be used as a suede element, it really did feel good, both on the finger and the draw. The suede really is in good shape, with only some minor "ribbing" near the clamp end.
Had a really good shave from it.

 

[cb91710]

Caught a couple of comments on various forums about "break in", and in searching for what they were referring to, I found this from Jim R:

Ladies and Gentlemen,

<snip>

Also, some information about care:

A few people have been asking about breaking in or maintenance, including whether or not to use oil on their strops. Kanayama strops need NO breaking in, they are ready to strop on arrival. As for maintenance, the advice to rub your palm over the strop a few times that you see on the label? It's just for decoration. It probably won't hurt, but Naomi-san doesn't read a word of English, so it's just something he saw on a strop label decades ago and decided it looked nice.

Naomi-san's advice for maintenance is simple:
Whenever you feel it necessary (once or twice a year at most, or if the surface feels "off"--maybe more often in drier areas), lay the strop flat on a table, face-up.
Get a smooth, lint free cloth (like an old t-shirt, no terrycloth) and wet it with lukewarm water. Wring it out REALLY WELL, as in, it should really only be slightly damp.
Run the cloth ONCE over the face of the strop quickly, making sure not to stop and that no water touches the back or sides of the strop, where it will harden the leather. Remember, ONE TIME only. Be careful not to let any drops gather, or they will stain the leather.
Let the strop dry thoroughly.
If you still feel that the surface doesn't feel right, then repeat.

This should refresh a slightly hardened or aging strop.

Naomi-san does not recommend any oil, as over time the oil will start to oxidize and break down, damaging the conditioning of the strop.

<snip>

Thanks as always,
Jim and Tomomi Rion

So pretty much as straight from the horse's mouth as you can get...
Unwrap it and use it!

 

[Wid]

As for the 2196 being an entry level strop; that's OK with me as I like it just fine. I actually use my TM strop a lot more than the 2196 and it is very rare that I use it's linen side as to me the TM linen is much nicer to use.

 

[danjared]

Caught a couple of comments on various forums about "break in", and in searching for what they were referring to, I found this from Jim R:



So pretty much as straight from the horse's mouth as you can get...
Unwrap it and use it!

That's referring to the leather side, not the linen. You may want to look at this: http://www.coticule.be/the-cafeteria/topic/952.html

And this video that Bart made of mechanically breaking in the linen. I find that, after doing that, just using it and keeping on breaking it in that way helps to make it more flexible. Now, it's the best linen I've used.

 

[hokahay]

More "normal user" then "entry level". The leather is a little thinner. Out of the four I have, its difficult to say if one surface is "better" than the other by look and touch. The linen is certainly more coarse than genuine linen from Tony Miller. Tony's linen is the real deal and hard to come by in todays market. I use mine daily. And I have a brand new backup stored with my ammo and freeze dried liquor! It's all good.

As for the 2196 being an entry level strop; that's OK with me as I like it just fine. I actually use my TM strop a lot more than the 2196 and it is very rare that I use it's linen side as to me the TM linen is much nicer to use.

 

[hokahay]

That's referring to the leather side, not the linen. You may want to look at this: http://www.coticule.be/the-cafeteria/topic/952.html

And this video that Bart made of mechanically breaking in the linen. I find that, after doing that, just using it and keeping on breaking it in that way helps to make it more flexible. Now, it's the best linen I've used.

Great thread about linen! Thanks for the link.

 

[cb91710]

Interesting.... a lot of back and forth on the linen, the old vs new, and of course that thread was from 2010, ending almost a year ago, and some have commented that the linen has yet again been changed.

Definitely a lot of YMMV.