Gillette Pocket Edition...

[lradke]

Hello!

I was wondering what would be too much to pay, for an old Gillette Pocket Edition razor. It seems to be in good condition and comes with the case. Also, is the said razor the same as the American Button Company ones?

Thanks!

 

[thirdeye]

It's hard to say. Pictures?

 

[theinternot]

The ABC one will have an ornate handle and matching case. I have an OLD Type Pocket razor I just picked up and was researching this the other day.

 

[amishmotorboat]

If it's the same one I just saw on eBay, it's not the right razor for the case. I just saw one that is an incorrectly dated fat handled tech in an ABC case.

 

[Blue-EyedSon]

It really is hard to say without seeing some photos. My understanding is that there can be a difference between an Old Type Edition and an ABC Pocket Edition. As the internot said, the ABCs typically have an ornate design on the handle. Actually, 4 of the 5 designs are ornate. One of them is basically plain. So, the presence or absence of an ornate handle is not necessarily determinative. If you can post some photos, then it would really help out.

 

[theperfectstorm]

It really is hard to say without seeing some photos. My understanding is that there can be a difference between an Old Type Edition and an ABC Pocket Edition. As the internot said, the ABCs typically have an ornate design on the handle. Actually, 4 of the 5 designs are ornate. One of them is basically plain. So, the presence or absence of an ornate handle is not necessarily determinative. If you can post some photos, then it would really help out.

You're a grad student Brian. Do the research.

http://mr-razor.com/Rasierer/Gillette Rasierer.htm

 

[T Rick]

I was wondering what would be too much to pay, for an old Gillette Pocket Edition razor

50¢ more than whatever my max. bid is .

Just kidding, I have no idea which one you are looking at (or if it's even at auction). There is a large variance in prices, depending on which model (there were I think 7?) which plating (silver or gold), if the set is complete, and overall condition of all the pieces (including the case, inside and out).

I've seen some go as little as $30 (maybe less?). I've seen nice examples go for over $100, and I can imagine certain examples of harder to find sets in pristine condition, with outer box etc. etc. might go above $200 possibly even to $300? (This would be extreme and rare IMHO).

We had a Member here who recently found an Empire set (with correct case, and this is one of the more desirable of these AFAIK) in an antique store that was asking $60. Everything I've seen since goes to that probably being a bargain, even with some brassing/plate loss as he described it.

You might get some help doing a search on the BST for those that have sold, as well as a completed items search on eBay.

 

[bythbook]

also - there is an auction on dbay (or was - I'm not watching this one anymore) for a gold ABC - that has the wrong blade case & wrong head(!) for the razor - no serial #, long pointy studs/knobs/pins (whatever).

the seller didn't want to hear it - said the absence of the serial # indicated this razor was from the very earliest days of Gillette - pre-#.

So... be careful. Ask questions.

Have fun!

don't let your meatloaf.

 

[Blue-EyedSon]

You're a grad student Brian. Do the research.

http://mr-razor.com/Rasierer/Gillette Rasierer.htm

Good form, sir. I'll attempt a better answer that can be adjusted where needed by those with more knowledge in the area. Unfortunately, my other inquiries take me in many other directions than researching safety razors, which I wish I had more time to look into.

So...Here are my thoughts.

The ABC razors were made by the American Button Company for Gillette. Three of the four designs had ornate engravings on the handle: A floral motif (http://wiki.badgerandblade.com/index.php/Image:ABC_Razors_2.jpg), a filigree kind of pattern often called "Empire" (http://wiki.badgerandblade.com/index.php/Image:ABC_Razors_1.jpg), and a Scroll like design sometimes called "Shell" (http://wiki.badgerandblade.com/index.php/Image:ABC_Razors_4.jpg). There was also one made with a slightly fluted design on the handle (http://wiki.badgerandblade.com/index.php/Image:ABC_Razors_3.jpg ).

While each of these razors had a corresponding case to match the design on the razor, the razors were sold and available to order in whatever combination somebody wanted. Thus, one could have an Empire razor in a Floral case. If such a set is found, there is not really any way of telling if it is an original set or a mismatched one because they could be "mismatched" originally.

All of these razors, which were made by the American Button Company for Gillette, are considered "Old Type Pocked Editions" because they did not have the "New Type" head, which came out in 1921.

But, to make things a little more confusing, there were "Old Type Pocket Editions" that were not made by the ABC. Some of these even had similar designed cases, but lacked the ABC imprint on the bottom. See, for example, the second set in a previous post I put up : http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php?t=114847. More typically, though, are other kinds of Old Type Pocket Editions that had more simple cases (http://mr-razor.com/Rasierer/Old Type/1920s OldType Canada.JPG). These Old Type Pocket Edition razors had the ball end on the handle and checkered grip such as pictured in the link above.

To clarify:
1) "Old Type" refers primarily to the head design of the razor to distinguish it from the "New Type" (see http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php?p=1490636#post1490636 , for the distinction).

2) "ABC" refers specifically to razors made by the American Button Company for Gillette, all of which are Old Type Pocket Editions.

3) But, not all Old Type Pocket Editions were made by the ABC.

Again, I'm not an expert in these razors and wish I had time to look into this more, but this is what little knowledge I've managed to amass in my short time of being interested in these razors. Hopefully others can chime in and correct me where I'm sure I'm wrong. Perhaps, it would be good to get some sort of guide to identifying Old Type Pocket Editions and American Button Company razors.

In terms of pricing, it can be all over the place. What others have attested to has been my experience as well. Really nice sets can be really expensive. Not as nice sets can be had for much less.

 

[Oldguy]

Nice answer, Brian. I see you take a challenge very seriously.

Len

 

[lradke]

Here is the link of what I am asking about:


Please let me know! Thanks!

 

[bythbook]

Here is the link of what I am asking about:


Please let me know! Thanks!

not s'posed to link to live auctions....

 

[Hoos]

That would appear to be an ABC Pocket Edition without the blade case (based on design and the appearance of the teeth on the guard). It would be good to ask if there's a serial number on the guard so you can date it more accurately.

The ABC cases had the King Gillette signature/patent info on the bottom.

The pocket edition cases that had similar designs but were not made by ABC had either a flat, plain bottom or the bottom had three square indentations in it.

One thing I'm not sure about is the seller's statement that "the box has a dark greenish black finish". Not because I doubt him. I have one like that - it's not silver or gold and really doesn't polish up well. It might be the more uncommon "gunmetal" finish. But I honestly do not know that as a fact.

 

[bythbook]

gunmetal is almost a lacquered black, isn't it?

looks to me that the plating/finish is entirely gone on this. Is your not-silver, not-gold case shiny?

see, from Mr-razor: ABC - gunmetal?

????

...

One thing I'm not sure about is the seller's statement that "the box has a dark greenish black finish". Not because I doubt him. I have one like that - it's not silver or gold and really doesn't polish up well. It might be the more uncommon "gunmetal" finish. But I honestly do not know that as a fact.

 

[lradke]

not s'posed to link to live auctions....

I am sorry about that, I didn't know

Thanks for the help advice!

 

[Hoos]

I'll have to check Waits when I get home. I thought the gunmetal gray cases had the same patterns as the gold/silver ABCs. Honestly (and not doubting Achim at all), I've never seen a completely smooth metal case for the ABCs.

I also thought the ABCs only came with the small, flip lock - not the push button.

 

[bythbook]

I have smooth cases in both gold and silver - I have what I believe is a (former) gunmetal case in shell pattern - much/most of the lacquer has been rubbed or polished away. I have one case with the flip latch (I read somewhere those were the earliest) - the rest have push latches.

I'll have to check Waits when I get home. I thought the gunmetal gray cases had the same patterns as the gold/silver ABCs. Honestly (and not doubting Achim at all), I've never seen a completely smooth metal case for the ABCs.

I also thought the ABCs only came with the small, flip lock - not the push button.

 

[Oldguy]

I'll have to check Waits when I get home. I thought the gunmetal gray cases had the same patterns as the gold/silver ABCs. Honestly (and not doubting Achim at all), I've never seen a completely smooth metal case for the ABCs.

I also thought the ABCs only came with the small, flip lock - not the push button.

The ABC cases with the patent dates on the bottom came in both the latch and push button. The latch version was the earliest. The ABC push button version has the same thickness as the latch version. It also has four small rivets on the front to hold the push button bottom and top mechanism. The bottom pair of rivets is widely spaced apart. The cases made by Gillette are thicker and only have two rivets. Every set made by ABC was also made in gunmetal, a sort of black lacquer over brass. But they are not nearly as common as the gold or silver.

Len

 

[lradke]

I inquired as to the serial number on the razor and it is: 585685

I don't know when this is from, but I will look.

 

[lradke]

I inquired as to the serial number on the razor and it is: 585685

I don't know when this is from, but I will look.

1906, unless I am mistaken.