Email I sent to 'Nancy Boy' about comedogenic ingredients

[Typesh05]

This is an email I sent to a company called "Nancy Boy" which I am sure many of you are familiar with. I was originally looking to purchase new shaving cream, but am now considering their face wash, and moisturizer. Curious to hear some members of B & B's thoughts.

"Thanks for your quick response. I have one more question.

I was referred to your products because I was complaining on a shaving forum (badgerandblade) that I was breaking out from the 'Proraso' shave cream I was using. Members hinted to avoid products that had comedogenic ingredients. Proraso was full of them; coconut oil, menthol, parfum, stearic acid, etc. I have very sensitive skin, and was looking for a better alternative.

Upon reviewing Nancy Boy shave cream I see that it also contains cocos nucifera oil (coconut oil). While I understand that almost every product out there is going to contain an ingredient or 2 that is comedogenic, I would like to hear your thoughts on the matter."

 

[luvmysuper]

This is an email I sent to a company called "Nancy Boy" which I am sure many of you are familiar with. I was originally looking to purchase new shaving cream, but am now considering their face wash, and moisturizer. Curious to hear some members of B & B's thoughts.

"Thanks for your quick response. I have one more question.

I was referred to your products because I was complaining on a shaving forum (badgerandblade) that I was breaking out from the 'Proraso' shave cream I was using. Members hinted to avoid products that had comedogenic ingredients. Proraso was full of them; coconut oil, menthol, parfum, stearic acid, etc. I have very sensitive skin, and was looking for a better alternative.

Upon reviewing Nancy Boy shave cream I see that it also contains cocos nucifera oil (coconut oil). While I understand that almost every product out there is going to contain an ingredient or 2 that is comedogenic, I would like to hear your thoughts on the matter."

A bit puzzling, as I had always thought that a product being comedogenic was a result of an accumulation of ingredients that caused comedones (acne / blackheads) rather than specific components themselves.
I am no soap maker, but doesn't soap need SOME type of oil, either vegetable or animal to actually BE soap? (perhaps the soapmakers can answer).
From this I took the comedogenic to mean that while Proraso, in its entirety may have caused your acne, another product with the same ingredients but in significantly different proportions or chemical sources may not.
Can anybody else chime in here? Perhaps one of our resident Chemists?

 

[Singerwithoutabeard]

just answering on "doesn't soap need SOME type of oil, either vegetable or animal to actually BE soap?" here.
I am no soap maker either, but still I remember some basics from chemistry lessons. (This information has been dormant for about 20 years, yet your question woke it up)
"Soap" -for my chemistry treacher- was a "chemical compound, made from "fatty acids" on one side, and a salt (or was it a "base" ?) of either potassium (K) or sodium (Na).
The "fatty acid" part can be found again in his lessons, when he taught us that "grease and fat" were chemical compounds of that same "fatty acids" with "an ester" (I think glycerol, but that's a specific ester, isn't it?)

So "fat" or "oil" has some common component(s) with soap, but chemically they are quite different thinhs.
Hey, "destop sodium hydroxide" has hal of its molecule borrowed from water, and the other half from kitchen/table/sea salt. Yet I'd rather wash my hands in water, no?
Same remark goes for hydrochloric acid.
So a (soapy) substance "made with olive oil" doesn't really 'contain oil'

Many a "soap" though, is "alkaline", where our natural skin is (mildly) acid. So real soap will damage the natural protection layer, and thus provoke your skin into a defensive strategy of ... generating extra protection.

 

[cvac]

Type, my skin is pretty sensitive and also prone to acne breakouts. I can tell you right now that you will be very hard pressed to find any decent latherable shaving cream that doesn't contain coconut oil and stearic acid.

They key is the amount of coconut oil. Proraso and other European drugstore/barbershop type creams that come in tubes have a greater proportion of coconut oil than the English creams for example. So if you want to cut down on the chance of breakouts due to your shaving cream, stick with the English creams like Trumpers, Taylor's, and Truefitt. Body Shop shave cream is also made in England to a similar formula. Also, like I said before in your last thread, make sure you rinse all the cream off your face in between shaving passes and after you are done shaving.

As for the face wash and moisturizer from Nancy Boy, I haven't tried them, but I would not recommend them if you have sensitive skin or acne prone skin after looking over the ingredients.

If you want products that are designed specifically for acne prone skin and sensitive skin my recommendation is to try Daniel Kern products. They make the only face wash and moisturizer I will use.

 

[luvmysuper]

just answering on "doesn't soap need SOME type of oil, either vegetable or animal to actually BE soap?" here.
I am no soap maker either, but still I remember some basics from chemistry lessons. (This information has been dormant for about 20 years, yet your question woke it up)
"Soap" -for my chemistry treacher- was a "chemical compound, made from "fatty acids" on one side, and a salt (or was it a "base" ?) of either potassium (K) or sodium (Na).
The "fatty acid" part can be found again in his lessons, when he taught us that "grease and fat" were chemical compounds of that same "fatty acids" with "an ester" (I think glycerol, but that's a specific ester, isn't it?)

So "fat" or "oil" has some common component(s) with soap, but chemically they are quite different thinhs.
Hey, "destop sodium hydroxide" has hal of its molecule borrowed from water, and the other half from kitchen/table/sea salt. Yet I'd rather wash my hands in water, no?
Same remark goes for hydrochloric acid.
So a (soapy) substance "made with olive oil" doesn't really 'contain oil'

Many a "soap" though, is "alkaline", where our natural skin is (mildly) acid. So real soap will damage the natural protection layer, and thus provoke your skin into a defensive strategy of ... generating extra protection.

I got you, and don't disagree with anything you said.
I guess my comment about oils was just the one you made, that soap needs either a vegetable oil or rendered fat as an ingredient in order to be soap. Not so much that the oils or fats REMAIN in their unchanged state during the soaping process, because obviously they don't.
I recognize that the basic soap making process of adding caustic soda to a vegetable oil or tallow changes the fatty acid to a different substance, and that really was my point. That soaps are made from either vegetable or animal "oils" and that the comedogenic issue is not necessarily related to a specific component (say coconut oil) but rather to the final product, which is more than just the sum of its parts.

 

[Typesh05]

Thanks for the responses; this is the response I got back from 'Nancy Boy'

"We've never had a complaint about someone breaking out from using either of the shave creams. Given the low concentration of coconut oil in the formulation, this makes sense to me."




This is the response I was expecting, but I still feel a little puzzled, and will continue my search for the right cream/soap.

 

[cvac]

Not sure what is so puzzling about the response. Like I said, good luck finding any latherable shaving cream that doesn't contain some form of coconut oil or coconut acid. They key is in the proportion of coconut in the cream.

 

[Typesh05]

cvac- i hear you...i checked out the daniel kern products and they look legit. the only thing thats holding me back is the mixed reviews. it seems like for some people their products are regarded as the best in the world, and other complain that it just dried their face out and made their skin worse.

mixed reviews seem common with almost all products however...

i think i will give it a try.

 

[RazorPete]

Comedones or white/blackheads are worsened by oil on the skin. Glycerol or glycerin in not an oil and generally felt not to exacerbate acne. Oil containing products that you keep on your face such as moisturizers, aftrshave balks, womens makeup or suscreens will cause more acne problems simply because they stay on your face. People with acne should look for oil free products for anything they put on their face. Non-comedogenic is more of an unregulated marketing term rather than a medical guarrantee so it's best to lookfor the term oil free instead. Something like a shave soap, which stays on your skin for just a short time before it is removed is less of a problem for acne compared to substances you leave on your skin.