Do you school hapless eBay sellers when they have something valuable and don't know?

[_MementoMori_]

I suppose I might make some enemies with this post depending on how you feel about this. Let's say, for example, that an eBay seller has something ultra desirable like a mint Toggle or Double Ring, but he lists it simply as a "Vintage Gillette Safety Razor." You know... you just know that it's only a matter of time before someone decides to capitalize on this seller's ignorance and shoot them a low-ball offer for the razor.

I mean, when you don't know what you have and someone offers you, say, $75 for a much more valuable razor, you're probably going to flip out and end the auction for that price. You'll be happy with your perceived "profit" until maybe one day you find out that your razor could've gone more in the neighborhood of $400 - $500.

This kind of thing bothers me, and I see it all the time. I don't like to see people taken advantage of. I will normally contact sellers with items like this and just let them know what they have. I caution them that any under-the-table offer, no matter how seemingly high, will undermine the true value of their item. I try not to say things like "It's worth $400," because then they may fixate on that amount and relist with that as a B-I-N or reserve. I simply let them know they have a valuable item, and that they should research its current value before proceeding.

Well... that's it. Either sympathize with me or crucify me... but it's how I feel.

 

[Greybeard]

I don't do it every time, but I have let sellers know what they specifically have and in general terms whether it's collectable.
I kind of leave it up to them to research it once they know what they have.

I do feel it's taking advantage of an uninformed seller to offer a lowball BIN, but that's just me. As long as it's within the rules, I can't be upset with those that make the offers.

 

[_MementoMori_]

As long as it's within the rules, I can't be upset with those that make the offers.

Yeah, I absolutely agree. It's the lowball offers on auctions that don't even have a "Buy-it-Now or Best Offer" option that kill me. And that is clearly circumventing ebay's rules, I think.

 

[Mark1966]

Great question David, one I've been pondering a lot after winning a desirable razor (#66) that I subsequently found out that other B&B members were watching

I've corrected eroneous listings on a number of occasions 'vintage razor from early last century' on a Super Speed or Slim Adjustable - usually that is just the seller not knowing what they have.

My approach to desirable items is to contact the seller indicating that my preference is that they let the auction run to best realise the value of the item but if they are looking for an early finish with a BIN price or if they receive a BIN offer to let me know as I may be able to match or beat it. This is what happened with the #66.

I'm still not sure that I'm entirely happy with this approach but it is better than watching auctions be cancelled because the item is mysteriously 'broken' or 'sold elsewhere'. Knowing that people do m ake low ball offers and that sellers do take them it seems to me a fair balance.

Very interested in the views of the gentlemen here

 

[BBrad]

For every low starting price but valuable razor listed on eBay there must be 50 overpriced or misrepresented razors of low value. Trying to inform the seller is a noble gesture, but often times it goes unappreciated. I gave up a long time ago trying to help those who don't want help.

I have to hold faith in the fact that water seeks its own level . . . and for the most part, a razor will sell for at least its reasonable worth. Even if I find something that looks much more valuable than its listing would lead one to believe, I still bid my maximum amount that I am willing to pay. Sometimes I win, and sometimes I don't!!

I both buy and sell on eBay and have seen the best (and worst) of both sides.

Anybody who cheats another deserves all the bad karma that comes their way!

 

[Legion]

I'll sometimes correct them if they are obviously advertising something wrong (Calling a slim a Fatboy, etc) but if a razor is just undervalued....

I'll just try to buy it. Am I evil? Maybe.... But I figure if I have spotted what it is, chances are a bunch of you all have as well, and it will get bid up to it's correct price anyway. I never shoot low ball offers or try to talk sellers into ending auctions early. As a seller I know how annoying it is.

 

[Greybeard]

Yeah, I absolutely agree. It's the lowball offers on auctions that don't even have a "Buy-it-Now or Best Offer" option that kill me. And that is clearly circumventing ebay's rules, I think.

Actually if there are no bids and there's more than 24 hours left for the auction to run, then it's legal for the seller to change the auction to a BIN. That's something I choose not to do as either a seller or buyer due to personal standards.

I get peeved when there are already bids and the auction is pulled. Usually it's the seller deciding to sell to someone who's made a surreptitious BIN offer and circumventing the rules.

 

[Greybeard]

I'll sometimes correct them if they are obviously advertising something wrong (Calling a slim a Fatboy, etc) but if a razor is just undervalued....

I'll just try to buy it. Am I evil? Maybe.... But I figure if I have spotted what it is, chances are a bunch of you all have as well, and it will get bid up to it's correct price anyway.

An auction is a different story to me. It's not one person trying to gain an advantage and it's open to everyone. It lets the market set the price and more often than not it's fair for the seller. If the selling price happens to be low, it's kismet.

 

[midniterambler]

i raised a similar question awhile back: http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php?t=147333. and there were some interesting responses. i like to let a seller know when he is "overselling" an item, but i don't inform them when they are "underselling" something; i figure if they don't sdo their homework on what they are selling, well then that's their risk. however i don't like to see them overselling, because that might mislead an inexperienced buyer into bidding higher on an item and then find out they were screwed, if they couldn't return it. happened to me on an item labelled "regent tech", which i bought and then quickly realized it was a 46-47 aristocrat. the seller did agree to cancel the sale, but only after some back and forth on whose responsibilty it was to know what they were selling/buying. most sellers are very appreciative of being informed, however a very few remain intransient in their listings. today i informed a seller that his "aristocrat" was a superspeed in an aristocrat case, and he responded very negatively.
so i'm sure this thread will get the range of responses, just as the previous thread did, and people will line up on different sides of the fence, as is true of most things opinion, rather than evidence, based.

 

[midniterambler]

I get peeved when there are already bids and the auction is pulled. Usually it's the seller deciding to sell to someone who's made a surreptitious BIN offer and circumventing the rules.

that is really irksome when it happens, and it happens more frequently than you would think.

 

[_MementoMori_]

I agree that with an auction, the market can be relied upon to set the price. I don't think sellers of high end collectible razors need to bother with reserve prices. Really, the only despicable evil being discussed here is members who contact the seller requesting an under-the-table sale for a lowball offer. No one is safe from this if the seller isn't aware of the value of his/her item.

Chances are, most people will jump at an offer that exceeds what they, in their ignorance, imagined their item might sell for. Then, of course, there are the sellers who are smart enough to realize that unauthorized B-I-N offers indicate that they have something of value.

 

[Slivovitz]

There was a thread a while back, which I'm not going to search for, started by someone who was annoyed with people who clue in clueless eBay sellers.

Personally, I don't care one way or the other. I'll take advantage of an unreasonably low price, given a chance, and have done so twice that I recall without any sense of guilt. I don't, however, resent kindly people who take the opposite position, and let the seller know what he's got. It's up to the seller to have some idea of what he's selling, but if you want to do a stranger a favor, there's nothing wrong with that. I just don't see it as a moral obligation.

 

[Slivovitz]

. . .Really, the only despicable evil being discussed here is members who contact the seller requesting an under-the-table sale for a lowball offer. . .

Oh, I didn't read your original post carefully enough. I agree that's wrong, although if I were selling something with a starting price of $10, and somebody made me an offer of $30, I'd become very suspicious.

 

[eyeguy]

Recently, an item I had been watching was removed & sold without using ebay at all. Because of that, I will tell every seller to let the auction ride it out to the end. It was my fault for not bidding early on, which I make a priority to do now, but I'm still gonna give them a heads up now from now on. BTW, it was nothing rare or anything like that, but its the principle of it.

 

[Den]

I'll take advantage of an unreasonably low price, given a chance, and have done so...without any sense of guilt. I don't, however, resent kindly people who take the opposite position, and let the seller know what he's got. It's up to the seller to have some idea of what he's selling, but if you want to do a stranger a favor, there's nothing wrong with that. I just don't see it as a moral obligation.

+1 Exactly the way I feel.

 

[Kraken]

You all have some interesting thoughts here. One thought I had while reading this is, suppose any of us were in an antique store and noticed a double ring in good condition in its case listed for sale for $50. Would you tell the shop owner that his razor is worth much more than what he is asking? Or, would you quietly make your purchase and head to the door with a large smile on your face? I think the ebay sellers actually have an advantage over the shop owners because there is a larger market to review their item, recognize it, and drive the price up to what its value may be.

I don't have an answer to the hypothetical but just some thoughts.....

 

[danparker77]

I haven't tried to to contact a seller and offer a "low-ball" BIN price. However if I walked into an antique store and found one heck of a deal I wouldn't argue with the clerk about wanting to pay him more. It was priced for what he wanted. I know an auction is different but if a seller does there research they could always just put it up as a BIN.

kraken beat me!

 

[squirrel_nut_zipper]

A while back, I auctioned off a cased rhodium Executive set that I researched the probable value of before I listed, and from what info I gathered, I learned that these are somewhat rare sets that will most likely sell in the $200-$300 or better range. I had a proper listing title with the correct name and correct information in the description to clearly show that I knew what I was selling. Nonetheless, a bottom feeder hit me up early in the auction to end the listing and sell to him for $100.

The moral of the story is, certain types will take their shots regardless of how knowledgeable a seller appears.

 

[Topgumby]

I've struggled with this issue before, and have acted on both sides of it.

That's to say, when the shop owner has $5 on two reasonably nice garden variety razors, and I asked, "How much for both?" I have plunked down the $4 he came up with as a figure and not commented. The razors are probably "worth" ten times that. I slept well after that deal.

Yet, what if I offered $40 for a razor "worth" four hundred bucks? I don't know I'd sleep as well. Illogical? Probably.

I recognize that even a transaction made in ignorance is within the bounds of the law. I've seen newly widowed women unload the firearms recently belonging to the dearly departed husband at a slight fraction of the true value when I was working in that biz. Why should razors be any different?

Yet, it does somehow bother me when you see the not infrequent "I just scored this Fat Boy for five bucks!" posts right next to the post lambasting an Ebay seller for offering a BIN of $100 for a beater example of the same razor.

The first post elicits a bunch of "nice score!" responses, the second might contain a tale of somebody trying to educate the seller to "protect the new shavers" and a whole bunch of responses decrying rip-off artists.

Is the guy who sells a rube a common razor for way too much money on a public internet auction site, where a little research would tell the true tale, a cad to be scorned, while the shaving enthusiast who picks up the cased Aristocrat at the estate sale for a song merely a lucky dog?

What if the internet rube was a snotty, wealthy youngster with money to burn, and the estate sale was held by a kindly lady desperately trying to scrape by, too old and bereaved to bother with researching the razor that was presented to the love of her life? What if the lady is a jerk who poisoned the old coot? Does it matter? Does it only matter if we know?

 

[_MementoMori_]

As for the hypothetical question that was posed - I would gladly pay the $50 and walk out with the razor. No questions asked.

However, I don't think that this is a comparable analogy to what we are discussing. If a seller who is ignorant of the value of a high end razor posts a B-I-N listing with a low price, and I'm lucky enough to see it first, I'll snatch it up without a moment's hesitation. What we're discussing here, though, is an open auction where, ideally, the market will set the price and the final sale will be accurate to current values.

We do not and cannot know what the seller hopes to make on the item. Of course, he/she wants to make as much as possible, and he/she is relying on the market to determine that price. The people who circumvent the rules of an open auction and make lowball under-the-table offers make it impossible for the market to determine the price of the item (if the offer is accepted).

An equivalent analogy, as far as antique stores are concerned, would be something like this: I'm standing at the counter haggling with the owner over the sale price of a razor. He is open to offers and we are working on coming to an agreement. Out of nowhere, a shifty-eyed fellow walks up, interrupts our conversation, and makes an offer that the owner accepts. I realize this isn't a perfect analogy, but it's close.