British Gillettes

[UngerWoo]

I'm hoping someone with more knowledge than me can give me a rundown on at least some of the British versions of Gillette razors.

Over the last couple of months, I've added a #20, #16, #21, #88 and #58 (on the way) to join the #66 I already had. Every one of these razors is great. I get close shaves with zero irritation. And although most of these razors are a little beat up, they are beautiful pieces of history. They are a pleasure to use. If I had to pick a favorite, it might be the #21, but I love them all.

My understanding is that my #20 is just about the same as a #15, and a #88 is a duplicate of a #77. Do the other razors that I have duplicate other razors in the Gillette line?

In your opinion, what other British Gillettes do I need to experience?

 

[UngerWoo]

#15 is open comb and #20 is close comb. definitly not the same razor

The razor I bought and was told it was a #20 is an open comb TTO.

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php/167917-Difference-between-Gillette-15-and-20

 

[mblakele]

Also take a look at Numbered_British_Gillette_Information on the wiki.

 

[MacDaddy]

The No. 77 and No. 88 sets were the same two-piece NEW razor in a Bakelite or metal case respectively. The Populars were the same way; the only real difference between them were the cases and finishes on the razors.

The long and the short of the British Aristocrats is that there were four main generations (with some minor variations within):

1. Crimped handle, thick guard plate, open comb
2. Crimped handle, thick guard plate, guard bar
3. Rocket handle, thick guard plate, guard bar
4. Rocket handle, thin guard plate, guard bar

The numbers really refer to the sets and not the razors, and in many cases the sets seem to have spanned generations of razors so it's really more the case that you'd look at to determine which set you're dealing with.

The No. 15 set was an Aristocrat in a metal case, while the No. 20 was the same exact razor in a leather-covered case. The No. 19 set was the same as the No. 20, but was gold-plated. At least the No. 15 set came in both an open-comb and guard-bar variant. The No. 21 set was the same razor in a slightly different "Bostonian" style case, and may have only come along after the guard bar took over. I'm not 100% sure there.

The No. 16 and No. 22 were different casings of the same third-generation Aristocrat, with the Rocket-style handle and thick, flat-bottomed guard plate. The No. 22 seems to have carried over into the fourth-generation with the thin, stamped guard plate, which was the same as what was used in the No. 66 and No. 70 sets.

I could be wrong, but Achim's got a number of sets labeled as No. 16 sets on his site that I would bet were actually different numbers. My guesses are that this one is actually an older No. 22 (this ad scan shows the No. 16 and No. 22 as contemporaries just in different cases), this one I think was more likely a third-generation No. 15, and this one was whatever the gold version of the No. 21 was numbered (which I don't know off the top of my head).

Hopefully that all made sense, as my wife is rushing me off the computer to get to the dinner table.

 

[ERVARGASNY]

How about the No.19 Gold Version of the No.20 and Also No.47 Knows as the British Popular TTO OC as well.

There are Several Other Sets that are Numbered Knows as Tech Sets.

Hope that info helps you some )

 

[Ace McCool]

The long and the short of the British Aristocrats is that there were four main generations (with some minor variations within):

1. Crimped handle, thick guard plate, open comb
2. Crimped handle, thick guard plate, guard bar
3. Rocket handle, thick guard plate, guard bar
4. Rocket handle, thin guard plate, guard bar

The numbers really refer to the sets and not the razors, and in many cases the sets seem to have spanned generations of razors so it's really more the case that you'd look at to determine which set you're dealing with.

Can somebody please add the above from MacDaddy to the British Gillette Wiki? This is the first time I have seen this info spelled out so easily and it should be saved to help others!

Thanks to whomever does it.

 

[alex2363]

The razor I bought and was told it was a #20 is an open comb TTO.

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php/167917-Difference-between-Gillette-15-and-20

The No.#15 set came in both an Open Comb and Guard Bar styles.

 

[alex2363]

Heres some pics i got from B&B/Tommyg's post:

4 Gillette British Aristocrats(#22,#66Fr.,#66(53) and #16

 

[ERVARGASNY]

There is also the No.58 and 59 sets, I think theyare brit's ?

 

[alex2363]

The No. 77 and No. 88 sets were the same two-piece NEW razor in a Bakelite or metal case respectively. The Populars were the same way; the only real difference between them were the cases and finishes on the razors.

The long and the short of the British Aristocrats is that there were four main generations (with some minor variations within):

1. Crimped handle, thick guard plate, open comb
2. Crimped handle, thick guard plate, guard bar
3. Rocket handle, thick guard plate, guard bar
4. Rocket handle, thin guard plate, guard bar

The numbers really refer to the sets and not the razors, and in many cases the sets seem to have spanned generations of razors so it's really more the case that you'd look at to determine which set you're dealing with.

The No. 15 set was an Aristocrat in a metal case, while the No. 20 was the same exact razor in a leather-covered case. The No. 19 set was the same as the No. 20, but was gold-plated. At least the No. 15 set came in both an open-comb and guard-bar variant. The No. 21 set was the same razor in a slightly different "Bostonian" style case, and may have only come along after the guard bar took over. I'm not 100% sure there.

Yes, the #15 and #21 were similar designed heads.
#21

#15

The No. 16 and No. 22 were different casings of the same third-generation Aristocrat, with the Rocket-style handle and thick, flat-bottomed guard plate. The No. 22 seems to have carried over into the fourth-generation with the thin, stamped guard plate, which was the same as what was used in the No. 66 and No. 70 sets.

It is kinda hard to distinguish unless its closer in person look.

(#22,#66Fr.,#66(53) and #16

I could be wrong, but Achim's got a number of sets labeled as No. 16 sets on his site that I would bet were actually different numbers. My guesses are that this one is actually an older No. 22 (this ad scan shows the No. 16 and No. 22 as contemporaries just in different cases),

It does seem to point to a black cased # 22 and not a # 16.

I think was more likely a third-generation No. 15, and this one was whatever the gold version of the No. 21 was numbered (which I don't know off the top of my head)

Hopefully that all made sense, as my wife is rushing me off the computer to get to the dinner table.

It looks like a #16, what makes you think otherwise?

#16

 

[alex2363]

There is also the No.58 and 59 sets, I think theyare brit's ?

Yes, here from B&B's own and most beloved Mr Razor

 

[alex2363]

How about the No.19 Gold Version of the No.20 and Also No.47 Knows as the British Popular TTO OC as well.

There are Several Other Sets that are Numbered Knows as Tech Sets.

Hope that info helps you some )

1946

British Tech set No26 with "used blade box" brown bakelite Made in England

1943

Service Set No 11 "N2" on Blade Made in England

1943

Service Set No 11 "N2" on Blade Made in England

| width="10" |
	1946 British Tech set No26 with "used blade box" brown bakelite Made in England

1948

Australian Tech Set No77 51g, 8.2cm Made in England

1951

Tech Set No32 Made in England

 

[UngerWoo]

Lots of good information here. Thanks to everybody.

 

[DrAwkward]

<snip>

The No. 15 set was an Aristocrat in a metal case, while the No. 20 was the same exact razor in a leather-covered case. The No. 19 set was the same as the No. 20, but was gold-plated. At least the No. 15 set came in both an open-comb and guard-bar variant. The No. 21 set was the same razor in a slightly different "Bostonian" style case, and may have only come along after the guard bar took over. I'm not 100% sure there.

<snip>

I thought the #15 was always OC and the #21 was the same as the #15 but SB. If the #15 came in both OC and SB, is that also true of the #21? So, the #15 and #21 were really the same razor? My understanding of the British Aristocrat universe has been turned upside down!

 

[MacDaddy]

this one I think was more likely a third-generation No. 15

It looks like a #16, what makes you think otherwise?

Remember, the number doesn't refer to the razor, so the razor can't look like a number anything. Gillette numbered the sets and when they put the same razor in a different case it was a different set. So my thinking here is that if the set that Achim's got there was originally sold that way by Gillette, given the case it's in, I would think that they'd have likely just considered it a continuation of the No. 15 set into the third generation of British Aristocrat, exactly like they did when they carried the No. 15 designation over from the first generation (open comb) to the second (guard bar).

If the #15 came in both OC and SB, is that also true of the #21?

I don't know. It's possible that they only added the No. 21 set after the second generation Aristocrat with the guard bar. But it's also possible that we just don't have a record or examples of an open-comb version from the first generation.

 

[MacDaddy]

To maybe help illustrate my thinking here I put together this table. If anyone's got anything to add or modify I'd be happy to keep this up-to-date and add it to the wiki at some point once it's fully baked.

British Aristocrats (non-traveler sets)

Set No.	First Generation	Second Generation	Third Generation	Fourth Generation
14	Confirmed
15	Confirmed	Confirmed	Possible
16			Confirmed
19	Confirmed
20	Confirmed	Confirmed	Possible
21		Confirmed
22			Possible	Confirmed
66				Confirmed
70				Confirmed

Strange exceptions to the above

• What would otherwise seem to be a first generation No. 19 set in a much darker than usual leather case, but is matched with a carton that says it's a No. 15 set

Examples with completely unknown designations

• Gold-plated version of No. 21 set with a third generation razor
• Gold-plated version of No. 22 set with a third generation razor

 

[Ace McCool]

Thanks Porter!

 

[mblakele]

If Gillette made significant design changes without changing the set number, then the table at Numbered_British_Gillette_Information needs a serious overhaul. For example #15 in the current table is an OC, and does not mention handle design (USA-style crimped vs Rocket style). But if there were guard-bar razors in (later?) #15 sets, then that is not quite right. I imagine the patent numbers and weights also go more with design generations than set numbers?

For maximum utility I suggest two tables. The first table would key on set number, listing which razor designs might have appeared in it and what the case should look like and referring to known adverts or other source material. The second table would describe the design features of the razors, listing the right set number(s) for a given design. We might try to suggest rough dates for the design changes, too. There are some wrinkles in this scheme: plating might not be freely interchangeable, and some of the basic razor designs might have variations: aluminum handles, for example.

Gillette was a bit inconsiderate, selling these products in such dizzying variety. They might have given some thought to the frustrations they were piling up for future collectors.

 

[Bostrin]

The No. 77 and No. 88 sets were the same two-piece NEW razor in a Bakelite or metal case respectively. The Populars were the same way; the only real difference between them were the cases and finishes on the razors.

The long and the short of the British Aristocrats is that there were four main generations (with some minor variations within):

1. Crimped handle, thick guard plate, open comb
2. Crimped handle, thick guard plate, guard bar
3. Rocket handle, thick guard plate, guard bar
4. Rocket handle, thin guard plate, guard bar

The numbers really refer to the sets and not the razors, and in many cases the sets seem to have spanned generations of razors so it's really more the case that you'd look at to determine which set you're dealing with.

The No. 15 set was an Aristocrat in a metal case, while the No. 20 was the same exact razor in a leather-covered case. The No. 19 set was the same as the No. 20, but was gold-plated. At least the No. 15 set came in both an open-comb and guard-bar variant. The No. 21 set was the same razor in a slightly different "Bostonian" style case, and may have only come along after the guard bar took over. I'm not 100% sure there.

The No. 16 and No. 22 were different casings of the same third-generation Aristocrat, with the Rocket-style handle and thick, flat-bottomed guard plate. The No. 22 seems to have carried over into the fourth-generation with the thin, stamped guard plate, which was the same as what was used in the No. 66 and No. 70 sets.

I could be wrong, but Achim's got a number of sets labeled as No. 16 sets on his site that I would bet were actually different numbers. My guesses are that this one is actually an older No. 22 (this ad scan shows the No. 16 and No. 22 as contemporaries just in different cases), this one I think was more likely a third-generation No. 15, and this one was whatever the gold version of the No. 21 was numbered (which I don't know off the top of my head).

Hopefully that all made sense, as my wife is rushing me off the computer to get to the dinner table.

I think the 22 and 66 are different casings, each with a stamped base plate. The 16, 22 and 66 have the same TTO mechanism, British-style, wherein the knob moves toward the handle. But, the 16 is heavier, with the flat, machined baseplate.

 

[BRITD]

Over the last couple of months, I've added a #20, #16, #21, #88 and #58 (on the way)

This #58? http://www.ebay.ca/itm/221283333297?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649#shpCntId