Advice On Removing a Chip

[The Don]

Good Morning Gents,

I would like your advice on how to go about removing a small chip that I somehow put into one of my razors. It's rather tiny; only visible to the naked eye if reflected in the proper light (but visible nonetheless). Much smaller than the one pictured in the link below. I discovered the chip when I was stropping the razor; it was causing a tiny, light scuff on the leather. I realized something must have been wrong, so I pulled out the scope and was able to see it clearly at 60x. I still don't know how this happened. I haven't dropped the razor, so I was thinking perhaps I had a small piece of debris on my strop.

The blade has only 5 or 6 shaves on it after being honed, and the rest of the edge looks fine at 60x. My questions are concerning the best course of action. In my arsenal I have a DMT DuoSharp 600/1200, a set of lapping films (12u down to 1u), and a coticule. I realize I'm going to have to remove some metal to get this fixed, but I don't want to over-hone. Should I take it all the way back to 600 and do a full progression? Should I run the edge on glass to start with a dull bevel?

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

Don

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php/299582-chips

 

[jpcwon]

I would say don't go back to the 600 unless absolutely necessary. You don't want to remove more steel than you have to. I would start at the 1200, reset the bevel, and see where you're at from there...There's a chance that if the chip is small enough, then resetting the bevel may allow you to "hone past" the chip....

I might not give the best advice on this as I've never used film, so what do you guys think; could he start on the 12u film to remove a chip, or should he go back to the 1200?

 

[professorchaos]

If you can't feel it in the TNT, you don't necessarily need to do anything about it. If you do feel it or don't wish to test it, hone it on your 1200 until it is gone.

 

[The Don]

I was able to feel it on the TNT; more importantly, I could see it putting a tiny scuff into the strop. I took it to the 1200 last night, but I couldn't get it all the way out. I am going to go back to the 600 tonight and finish the job. In situations like this, should I be putting any pressure on the blade?

 

[Doc226]

That should hone out just fine, 1200 should do it, don't be afraid to use a little pressure

 

[The Don]

I'll keep at it, but I'm fearful that I'm doing something wrong. I did use a bit of pressure, and I did make some progress on the chip, but it just seems to be taking a while. Maybe I'm underestimating the significance of the chip and the amount of metal that I need to remove.

 

[global_dev]

Is it a chip or edge deformation?

I would think a 4k could maybe take care of it, not that it's that far from 1k but just a thought.

 

[professorchaos]

Drop back to a 600 and you might create more work for yourself when you return to the 1200 than if you had stayed on it to get the chip out.

 

[Gamma]

What size is the Coticule, and how's its speed on slurry?

Out of your options - I like the Coti the best for what you have to do.

 

[RADisorder]

That should hone out just fine, 1200 should do it, don't be afraid to use a little pressure

How is it going with the chip?

 

[Kentos]

While we are all perfectionist here, I no longer much worry about small chips if the blade still gives good shaves. I would have tried stropping the snot out of it on canvas or linen to see it is took care of the scratching. If not a few laps on a finisher. If not, a few laps on koma slurry. If it still scratched by that time I would have been ticked and it would be back to a bevel reset

 

[buca3152]

I would hit the 600 til its gone then up from there. IMO the 600 scratches come out easy with lots of circles on finer grits.

 

[Slash McCoy]

The trick to removing chips is to use a coarse honing surface until the chip is JUST removed. If you are paranoid about taking off an extra micron of steel, then go with the coarse hone until the chip is NEARLY gone. That much steel had to go anyway, whether with a couple hundred on a 325, a hundred on a 220, or multiple thousands on a 12k Nani. You remove the same steel. The choice is do you do it in 5 minutes, or 5 hours? From that point, then, go to your 1.2k or 1k or whatever normal bevel setter until the chip truly IS completely gone, and then simply continue in your progression.

I will point out as another poster did that sometimes a small chip can simply be left alone. Eventually it will be gone. But if it is digging up your strop then you should probably do something about it.

12u film is not a good choice for major steel removal. It will eventually work, but it will be too slow for my taste. You could use 30u, or 600 to 1k grit sandpaper. Or even coarser sandpaper if a lot of steel has to go. 12u is a bevel setter but not an edge repair thing.

 

[The Don]

Thanks for asking, RADisorder. I got it nearly removed. I had to walk it all the way back to the 600; I may have tried a 325 if I had it in the arsenal. The chip is still visible on my 60x scope, but it is no longer damaging my strop, so I'm content. After setting the bevel, I tried to move to my coticule, but I am still struggling to learn that stone. I went back to the films, followed by pasted balsa and stropping, and I got a very nice shave out of the blade. My honing is far from adequate, but this was a very good learning experience for me.

 

[Brooksie967]

Well after the TNT you have to reset the bevel anyways, never understood the purpose of that test.... Best thing for chips is to ALWAYS work them out of the razor, microchipping is enough to ruin a shave. Get a jewelers loop or some other form of magnification and use that to understand what needs to be done to your razor. When testing the bevel there are a number of different things you need to look for, i'm sure it's been beat to death at this point but the bevel should have one uninterrupted surface that reflects light at the same angle. The bevel should also be properly cut into the steel of the razor and defined by a solid line at the point the bevel meets the rest of the steel. The bevel has to meet at a single point from each side of the blade.

The only way I'll ever check a bevel, no TPT no TNT, is visually inspecting it and checking to see if it will cut hair. I've yet to have this fail me.

 

[buca3152]

The trick to removing chips is to use a coarse honing surface until the chip is JUST removed. If you are paranoid about taking off an extra micron of steel, then go with the coarse hone until the chip is NEARLY gone. That much steel had to go anyway, whether with a couple hundred on a 325, a hundred on a 220, or multiple thousands on a 12k Nani. You remove the same steel. The choice is do you do it in 5 minutes, or 5 hours? From that point, then, go to your 1.2k or 1k or whatever normal bevel setter until the chip truly IS completely gone, and then simply continue in your progression.

I will point out as another poster did that sometimes a small chip can simply be left alone. Eventually it will be gone. But if it is digging up your strop then you should probably do something about it.

12u film is not a good choice for major steel removal. It will eventually work, but it will be too slow for my taste. You could use 30u, or 600 to 1k grit sandpaper. Or even coarser sandpaper if a lot of steel has to go. 12u is a bevel setter but not an edge repair thing.

I feel the same way as you do. Why kill yourself with a 4k or so for 6 hours when you can get it out with a 325 or 600 dmt. The moderators on the other site seem to think that low grit hones "kill" edges but yet admit to using them themselves. Somehow their edges are golden using them but others should steer clear.

 

[RADisorder]

Thanks for asking, RADisorder. I got it nearly removed. I had to walk it all the way back to the 600; I may have tried a 325 if I had it in the arsenal. The chip is still visible on my 60x scope, but it is no longer damaging my strop, so I'm content. After setting the bevel, I tried to move to my coticule, but I am still struggling to learn that stone. I went back to the films, followed by pasted balsa and stropping, and I got a very nice shave out of the blade. My honing is far from adequate, but this was a very good learning experience for me.

It sounds like you're on your way. Since it shaves well, it sounds like that should be the end of it unless you just can't resist tinkering. I have zero honing experience, but appreciate hearing these stories before I start.