- Thread starter
- #21
Hmm…hadn’t thought of that.
Shaving Against the Grain
- Thread starter gitapik
- Start date
Maybe I'm an outsider, but I only do two passes. With the grain first pass, then against the grain for the second pass, but always with the grain on the second pass around my mouth and chin. I have a cleft chin and will always cut it if I try ATG or XTG.
Absolutely. I've got some smooth comfortable shaves with my Rockwell 6C by finishing up with the R2 plate on those 3 or 4 problem areas that we all seem to have.
I only do WTG and XTG during my shave, (both safety razor and straight), except an ATG skim third pass on my cheek area.
For me I get a great shave, (at least for my mug).
For me I get a great shave, (at least for my mug).
- Thread starter
- #25
I have a bit of a cleft to my chin…but have so far only had three mishaps there. This one being the worst.
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- #26
I’m beginning to think that way. Just avoid the red flag areas on the third pass.
I concur wholeheartedly gitapik….Besides, there is always tomorrow’s shave.
Everyone beat me to the points but to reiterate...
1. Less pressure (and then possibly play with angle). Almost all bad nicks and cuts have been when I've got the pressure wrong, a few based on angles, but wrong angles, for me, usually is a matter of weeper or razor burn.
2. If you haven't check out the growth patterns in the problem areas. I had a neck spot that was a bit of a ***** until I realized it was growing sideways.
3. Go for a very light ATG skim, or, just reserve it for the non-problem areas.
4. If you have an adjustable, switch up the settings for the ATG
5. Play around with blades. Playing around with razors too, but personally I'd go mad if I had to swich between razors, been there done that, I now own a Slim to stop that problem.
As mentioned, everyone else already beat me to the punch, and I don't do ATG every shave, maybe every fourth/fifth one? But these are the things that have made a difference for me, so thought it was worth repeating.
1. Less pressure (and then possibly play with angle). Almost all bad nicks and cuts have been when I've got the pressure wrong, a few based on angles, but wrong angles, for me, usually is a matter of weeper or razor burn.
2. If you haven't check out the growth patterns in the problem areas. I had a neck spot that was a bit of a ***** until I realized it was growing sideways.
3. Go for a very light ATG skim, or, just reserve it for the non-problem areas.
4. If you have an adjustable, switch up the settings for the ATG
5. Play around with blades. Playing around with razors too, but personally I'd go mad if I had to swich between razors, been there done that, I now own a Slim to stop that problem.
As mentioned, everyone else already beat me to the punch, and I don't do ATG every shave, maybe every fourth/fifth one? But these are the things that have made a difference for me, so thought it was worth repeating.
Nothing wrong with finishing with an electric and I sometimes do just that after two passes. Or sometimes exclusively electric if I'm short on time. My usual morning routine though, is a 3 pass DE shave, followed by a - very quick - once-over with an electric, varying between foil and rotary. The third DE pass can then be with the lightest touch, without having to mow down Every. Single. Hair. And I shave wet with an electric, with exactly the same software I use with my DE shave, so I don't have to change anything except what I hold in my hand, and it adds maybe a couple of minutes to the shave. Because I found that, even with the best technique (50 year plus shaver here), the best blade and the best razor, I will miss areas with my DE. Or leave longer stubble. You will too. Everyone will, somewhere - under the nose, corners of the mouth, beside the ear, under the chin, angle of the jaw. You just will (hence "buffing," "J-hook," "Gillette Slide," et al). And if I chase them down with a blade and a fourth pass, I'm likely to nick myself, or leave irritation. An electric touch-up eliminates all of that. A two pass shave is fine, or a three pass with the before mentioned misses, because 1) you'll get a perfectly socially acceptable shave that will last all day, and 2) when you apply aftershave your skin will rehydrate and mask any shaving defects. But a perfect, uniform, irritation-free true BBS is available to the average Joe with average skills with the above technique, every day.
Thats a hard area to get right. The angle is hard to see, so it comes to feel. I’ll ride the bar and feel the angle from there. If you ride the bar too much, no harm done. You just didn’t cut anything. If I’m running a little behind on a work day, I just skip ATG and be happy with a socially acceptable shave.
I take ATG everywhere 'except' the chin. Only with and across grain. Very close no irritation. I've had some real bleeders on my chin shaving against and since my technique has gotten better I don't find I need to do it
- Thread starter
- #32
Good stuff. Getting excellent input on this thread. Just what the doctor ordered. Thanks, guys!
Great advice above!
Some points to consider:
1. Mapping your beard may show what you are doing with each pass, especially in the problem areas.
2. ATG is definitely not required. You might do better with two XTG passes in different directions.
3. Technical issues, especially poor razor angle or pressure, are likely causes of the problem.
Stick with this and you will get the results you want!!
Some points to consider:
1. Mapping your beard may show what you are doing with each pass, especially in the problem areas.
2. ATG is definitely not required. You might do better with two XTG passes in different directions.
3. Technical issues, especially poor razor angle or pressure, are likely causes of the problem.
Stick with this and you will get the results you want!!
ATG is often the pass required to achieve a perfect BBS. I use fairly aggressive razors, so down/WTG and up/ATG work for me. I rarely do horizontal XTG passes at all.
A little food for thought.
Which handle is your Rocca? The reason I ask is there may be a weight variance between the R89 Grande (84g) and the Rocca (80g - 120g). You could also just swap heads and use your daily handle for consistency. I use the same (wooden) handle between my R89, ATT Windsor Pro, and R41.
I perform ATG practically every shave (R41 inclusive), unless I'm pressed for time. The density of lather for that 3rd pass needs to be of quality. If it's thinning or drying and ATG is a must, nothing wrong with an additional swirl or two to elevate the lather, especially in the sensitive areas. There's also nothing wrong with using the "pre-shave" for your final pass. I've put into use a hybrid WTG/ATG for my 2nd pass and a standard ATG for the 3rd. In the past, I have gone 2XTG and followed up with a BIC Metal for the ATG. BIC Metal is still about the only way I can get the pesky whiskers immediately under and to the side of my nose.
While I trial blades and while I was early form in my DE shave technique, I'd keep their use to 3 then bin. Ensures that I pretty much always have a fresh blade as @Happy Jack suggests.
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That's the classic SEM micrograph (source and razors unknown), but here's a more recent colorized one:
And the reason some Dermatologists recommend an electric sometimes if you are prone to ingrown hairs. The sharp, angled cut of a hair shaft cut by a blade can actually curl under and penetrate the skin, where the "softer" cut by an electric is less prone to angle into the follicle, in addition to being cut in general higher (because of the intervening foil), rather than at or below the skin surface (which tends to encourage ingrowns). From the rotary SEM you can see the hair shafts have more of a square cut (and actually pretty clean) by the action of the rotary blade, producing a blunt end at or above skin level.
I keep a goatee so I don’t have to worry about my chin and upper lip…
Best of luck finding a solution….lots of great suggestions here. I guess I’m one of the lucky ones, I can go any direction on my face and neck without getting irritation (unless I get careless of course).
Milder razor or electric razor could work. I use my electric on occasion if I miss a spot…works great as a finisher.
Best of luck finding a solution….lots of great suggestions here. I guess I’m one of the lucky ones, I can go any direction on my face and neck without getting irritation (unless I get careless of course).
Milder razor or electric razor could work. I use my electric on occasion if I miss a spot…works great as a finisher.
30+ years using electrics and I always got ingrown hairs. It would happen with both foil & rotary razors! And all my machines are top of the line for each brand/type.That's the classic SEM micrograph (source and razors unknown), but here's a more recent colorized one:
And the reason some Dermatologists recommend an electric sometimes if you are prone to ingrown hairs. The sharp, angled cut of a hair shaft cut by a blade can actually curl under and penetrate the skin, where the "softer" cut by an electric is less prone to angle into the follicle, in addition to being cut in general higher (because of the intervening foil), rather than at or below the skin surface (which tends to encourage ingrowns). From the rotary SEM you can see the hair shafts have more of a square cut (and actually pretty clean) by the action of the rotary blade, producing a blunt end at or above skin level.
Switched to DE and I never again got an ingrown hair. I've read about others with the same results.
So apparently the dermatological recommendation is very much YMMV!
Correct. If we were all alike, we'd always get our underwear confused.
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