Worst DIY job to tackle??

[Columbo]

I no longer paint or hang drywall, but was quite good at it when I did. Invisible seams and patches, even though I hated mudding. And even full skim coating, which has become a bit of an art. I think I have forgotten all the little tricks I once knew. Ninety percent of good painting is good prep. And never believing in one-coat coverage.

And electrical work I enjoyed greatly. Designing and installing the circuits and all that it connected. And then watching the inspector smile and quickly issue the approval. I enjoyed studying the NEC after it became the norm. I still peruse the NEC from time to time to see what new wiring burdens they are dropping on the poor tradesmen.

Back in the day, no one ever even thought about box fill and through-hole bundling calculations, let alone knew about GFCI or AFCI, inductive coupling concerns, or tamper-proof outlets. I grew up in a home with unpolarized, ungrounded outlets. And I managed to survive through it and the HV tube electronics we plugged into it … sometimes right next to a sink.

Still, electrical is the one big DIY thing that causes expensive wall openings and “repairs” on resales, if no permits were pulled, and no inspections done. Bad electrical is what causes fires, electrocutions, and death when it goes wrong. That inexperienced homeowners do these things without due guidance or inspection I will never understand.

But very old plumbing I always avoided like the plague. It is prone to seizes and breaks, and parts are often unobtainable, requiring much more extensive repairs and downtime. Those jobs I always left to the older professionals with the van full of ancient parts. That, and I won’t allow plastic supply pipes in my home, other than the two feet coming through the basement wall from the well.

 

[nortac]

Plumbing under the house in a tight crawl space. My home was built in the '60s and building codes were not strictly adhered to. I have acidic well water and there was no water neutralizer in use when we bought the house in the late '80s. And our neutralizer has had it's own issues. Bottom line is that the copper pipes are paper thin due to the acidic well water. A pin hole leak developed right at the edge of a compression fitting (from a repair less than 2 yrs ago) where the well water supply connects to the house, so that spot gets the most water flow as it supplies the whole house. When I cut out the old repair, the pipe walls were half as thick as new copper pipe. I suck at soldering, especially upside down in a tight crawl space. Subsequently, my soldering job was not water tight and today I have to go back and try to stop the leak with "Oaty Fix-it Stick" epoxy resin. I've tried to re-solder three times, but the area in question is up against a large beam under the house and getting the proper angle of attack for soldering is impossible. I realize that this is a temporary fix, if it works at all, but I'm afraid that the whole copper water supply is a ticking time bomb.

 

[Whisky]

Still, electrical is the one big DIY thing that causes expensive wall openings and “repairs” on resales, if no permits were pulled, and no inspections done. Bad electrical is what causes fires, electrocutions, and death when it goes wrong. That inexperienced homeowners do these things without due guidance or inspection I will never understand.

I think I’ve mentioned this here before, but I ran a service call once where the entire house had been “wired” with orange 16g extension cords. Whoever did it just cut the ends off and used it like Romex. When the new homeowner moved in they started having all kinds of electrical issues, imagine that. Luckily the person that did it also didn’t staple the cord to the studs so we were able to pull it out and pull in new Romex easily.

 

[Mojo88]

Plumbing under the house in a tight crawl space. My home was built in the '60s and building codes were not strictly adhered to. I have acidic well water and there was no water neutralizer in use when we bought the house in the late '80s. And our neutralizer has had it's own issues. Bottom line is that the copper pipes are paper thin due to the acidic well water. A pin hole leak developed right at the edge of a compression fitting (from a repair less than 2 yrs ago) where the well water supply connects to the house, so that spot gets the most water flow as it supplies the whole house. When I cut out the old repair, the pipe walls were half as thick as new copper pipe. I suck at soldering, especially upside down in a tight crawl space. Subsequently, my soldering job was not water tight and today I have to go back and try to stop the leak with "Oaty Fix-it Stick" epoxy resin. I've tried to re-solder three times, but the area in question is up against a large beam under the house and getting the proper angle of attack for soldering is impossible. I realize that this is a temporary fix, if it works at all, but I'm afraid that the whole copper water supply is a ticking time bomb.

My brother-in-law was a master plumber rigger. He drove my sister crazy with his fixes. Your problem reminded me of one of his temporary fixes. The dishwasher supply line had a leak, so he cut out the bad part and slid a piece of hose over the good parts and attached them with worm gear pipe clamps. He passed away and several years later the plumbing company that replaced the dishwasher saw it. The plumber commented that it shouldn’t have been done, but it worked. It might work for you. I thought about a shark bite, but with the different diameters, I don’t know.

 

[Columbo]

I think I’ve mentioned this here before, but I ran a service call once where the entire house had been “wired” with orange 16g extension cords. Whoever did it just cut the ends off and used it like Romex. When the new homeowner moved in they started having all kinds of electrical issues, imagine that. Luckily the person that did it also didn’t staple the cord to the studs so we were able to pull it out and pull in new Romex easily.

That sort of crazy is why the NEC came about in the first place.

That was a fire waiting to happen! Glad you caught it.

 

[Mojo88]

I think I’ve mentioned this here before, but I ran a service call once where the entire house had been “wired” with orange 16g extension cords. Whoever did it just cut the ends off and used it like Romex. When the new homeowner moved in they started having all kinds of electrical issues, imagine that. Luckily the person that did it also didn’t staple the cord to the studs so we were able to pull it out and pull in new Romex easily.

We live in an area where the foam insulation companies target. The commercials are constantly on for adding additional insulation. They pull off a piece of siding and pump it in. I have often wondered if it affects wiring and plumbing. Did you ever see it, and was it a plus or minus with existing connections?

 

[Whisky]

We live in an area where the foam insulation companies target. The commercials are constantly on for adding additional insulation. They pull off a piece of siding and pump it in. I have often wondered if it affects wiring and plumbing. Did you ever see it, and was it a plus or minus with existing connections?

I haven’t worked as an electrician since about 2005. Foam wasn’t as big as it is now, the companies back then pumped shredded newspaper (cellulose) into wall cavities the same way. They’d mix in a fire retardant and mold suppressor. I never saw any issues with it other than it was so fine it would find its way out of or into any small opening. It was common to find electrical boxes completely filled with the stuff when homeowners would call due to a “burning smell.” It wouldn’t burn, but it would smolder.

New construction uses spray foam everywhere now with no issues. All junctions/wire connections should be inside an accessible junction box and shouldn’t be affected. I have no idea about the plumbing.

 

[nortac]

My brother-in-law was a master plumber rigger. He drove my sister crazy with his fixes. Your problem reminded me of one of his temporary fixes. The dishwasher supply line had a leak, so he cut out the bad part and slid a piece of hose over the good parts and attached them with worm gear pipe clamps. He passed away and several years later the plumbing company that replaced the dishwasher saw it. The plumber commented that it shouldn’t have been done, but it worked. It might work for you. I thought about a shark bite, but with the different diameters, I don’t know.

It seems that there are varying opinions on shark bite. On school of thought is that it should not be used on main supply lines, only on terminal connections. Others say it is OK. But I have seen it fail. Shark bite < compression fitting< soldered/threaded connections?

 

[Mojo88]

I haven’t worked as an electrician since about 2005. Foam wasn’t as big as it is now, the companies back then pumped shredded newspaper (cellulose) into wall cavities the same way. They’d mix in a fire retardant and mold suppressor. I never saw any issues with it other than it was so fine it would find its way out of or into any small opening. It was common to find electrical boxes completely filled with the stuff when homeowners would call due to a “burning smell.” It wouldn’t burn, but it would smolder.

New construction uses spray foam everywhere now with no issues. All junctions/wire connections should be inside an accessible junction box and shouldn’t be affected. I have no idea about the plumbing.

They still do the cellulose also and I wondered about that.

 

[Mojo88]

It seems that there are varying opinions on shark bite. On school of thought is that it should not be used on main supply lines, only on terminal connections. Others say it is OK. But I have seen it fail. Shark bite < compression fitting< soldered/threaded connections?

Now all I see is the propress system. We had a water heater replaced and that’s what was used. I guess time will tell.

 

[Whisky]

Now all I see is the propress system. We had a water heater replaced and that’s what was used. I guess time will tell.

It’s getting very popular. But like sharkbite, it relies on a single o-ring to make the connection watertight. When my water heater and water softener were replaced they used PEX with copper crimp rings.

 

[Columbo]

I haven’t worked as an electrician since about 2005. Foam wasn’t as big as it is now, the companies back then pumped shredded newspaper (cellulose) into wall cavities the same way. They’d mix in a fire retardant and mold suppressor. I never saw any issues with it other than it was so fine it would find its way out of or into any small opening. It was common to find electrical boxes completely filled with the stuff when homeowners would call due to a “burning smell.” It wouldn’t burn, but it would smolder.

New construction uses spray foam everywhere now with no issues. All junctions/wire connections should be inside an accessible junction box and shouldn’t be affected. I have no idea about the plumbing.

So here’s the irony. Adequate fire-stopping has been the standard in later electrical work for a while now. And while hard-stuffed fiberglas and rock wool will get you by in the cavity gaps and some perimeters (at least here), they still want all the through holes and riser drops foamed tight. Fair enough. And that’s what we did here.

But the inspector knowingly nodded and laughed when I mentioned to him, “you know all that orange fire-stop foam is flammable.” Then we both laughed again about it as he slapped the approval sticker on the subpanel box.

Sometimes the code just replaces one headache with a new one. Hopefully, the foam manufacturers have fixed that one. And thankfully, AFCI breakers were still optional here then, as many of them hated some electronics not so long ago. Nothing is as inconvenient with guests as pressing the on button on the TV or stereo, and all the lights turn off.

 

[DesertIguana]

Worst dirty job I had was when I was working in machine shop.

My department was slow so I was told I could go home with four hour pay, or go help the “OILERS”.

Those were the guys were the only who degreased machines, and replaced the cutting oil in machines.

It was dirty nasty work one shift of doing made me say never again.

 

[Columbo]

New construction uses spray foam everywhere now with no issues. All junctions/wire connections should be inside an accessible junction box and shouldn’t be affected. I have no idea about the plumbing.

I forgot to mention, but right about the time we both stopped doing this work, Tyco finally came out with NEC-approved in-wall NM splice kits. No junction box required.

I wish they had come out with it sooner, as I remember with distain all the junction boxes I had to install over the years where only a simple extension splice in an existing cable was required.

The only thing about these splice kits I don't like is that they use spring lock connectors; I will always prefer wire nuts or a screw, and still have bad memories from arcing backstab outlets installed in the 1960s.

 

[Whisky]

I forgot to mention, but right about the time we both stopped doing this work, Tyco finally came out with NEC-approved in-wall NM splice kits. No junction box required.

I wish they had come out with it sooner, as I remember with distain all the junction boxes I had to install over the years where only a simple extension splice in an existing cable was required.

The only thing about these splice kits I don't like is that they use spring lock connectors; I will always prefer wire nuts or a screw, and still have bad memories from arcing backstab outlets installed in the 1960s.

I’ve seen those in wall splice kits but would probably never use one, call me old fashioned but I want the wires twisted together at least 4 rotations and a wire nut to secure the whole thing.

 

[Mojo88]

I no longer paint or hang drywall, but was quite good at it when I did. Invisible seams and patches, even though I hated mudding. And even full skim coating, which has become a bit of an art. I think I have forgotten all the little tricks I once knew. Ninety percent of good painting is good prep. And never believing in one-coat coverage.

And electrical work I enjoyed greatly. Designing and installing the circuits and all that it connected. And then watching the inspector smile and quickly issue the approval. I enjoyed studying the NEC after it became the norm. I still peruse the NEC from time to time to see what new wiring burdens they are dropping on the poor tradesmen.

Back in the day, no one ever even thought about box fill and through-hole bundling calculations, let alone knew about GFCI or AFCI, inductive coupling concerns, or tamper-proof outlets. I grew up in a home with unpolarized, ungrounded outlets. And I managed to survive through it and the HV tube electronics we plugged into it … sometimes right next to a sink.

Still, electrical is the one big DIY thing that causes expensive wall openings and “repairs” on resales, if no permits were pulled, and no inspections done. Bad electrical is what causes fires, electrocutions, and death when it goes wrong. That inexperienced homeowners do these things without due guidance or inspection I will never understand.

But very old plumbing I always avoided like the plague. It is prone to seizes and breaks, and parts are often unobtainable, requiring much more extensive repairs and downtime. Those jobs I always left to the older professionals with the van full of ancient parts. That, and I won’t allow plastic supply pipes in my home, other than the two feet coming through the basement wall from the well.

My son lived in a home that was built in 1909. They had an old toilet in the basement that needed to be replaced before they sold it, so he called me. When we pulled it the flange was screwed in to the concrete with two sheet metal screws. In addition to that it the floor had a crown. Fortunately the Oatey system worked and we were able to get it in level with a couple plastic shims. If he had called me sooner we would have floated the floor and redone the tile. In addition to all that mess it was cast iron with an old shut off. Old plumbing is a pain. It did pass inspection.

 

[Old Hippie]

I think the worst ones are the emergencies. You're never prepared for them; you can only hope you've got enough stuff and brains on hand to put in a stopper that holds until you get back from the hardware store.

After the washer died a couple of weeks ago and we got everything all cleaned up and rebuilt (and a new washer) we had a little accident in the kitchen the other day with a full bucket of water. The wet/dry vac got another workout. Fortunately it was a relatively easy cleanup; floor runner took most of it and I got that outside in a jiffy. Vacced it off and put it back with a fan on it for a few hours; all good. I could use a little peace and quiet...

O.H.