Who Here Shaves Off Diamond Paste?

[Twelvefret]

It depends on who the offending people are addressing. If it's a person who cannot get a good shave and they think they know more about how to sharpen a razor than someone else trying to help, your comment is relevant.

If you choose to go the route of attempting to find the perfect stone pile to sharpen a razor so you ensure a good shave, that's always an option. However, if you've found your own way using a much more straight forward process and can pass that information along, if that information is taken and used successfully, only egotistical and arrogant, small minds discount that process and result.

Sure, some come hear to discuss how to sharpen things, but it is a shaving forum. Some never join. Some join and never post. That's the nature of forums. I feel it is my responsibility to allow a new person wanting to shave with a SR as easy as possible. I mean, it was easy for me the first time I honed a razor so why would anyone else find it so difficult?

Anyway, back to my topic. Thanks to those who've added their experience with diamond paste.

 

[SliceOfLife]

This is the honing page of a shaving forum. People come here to discuss honing, whether they are honing enthusiasts or just want to know how to keep a razor sharp. In general if balsa + paste is good enough for a person, they won’t be here long. Not much to talk about in that case. The people for whom honing becomes a study... trying to perfect it, they stick around.
Edges have a lot of character, to the point where the best finish for one is likely not the best finish for another. The variables of the razors play a significant role in this. For that reason it’s a practice that is ongoing to find the “best” finish. The honing subforum as a whole doesn’t really spend much time on what is a “good enough” finish, though we have all been there and understand what that means.

 

[kohalajohn]

Yeah, Slice, I remember an example of this when the convex arks came out. I saw a post from someone I had never heard of. But he had been quietly honing and shaving straights for about thirty years, he said. He said he had bought a convex ark, it was a perfect fit for him and was "a game changer". He was basically saying that he was now fully satisfied and was done.

And that was it. He left and we never heard from him again.

He doesn't need the internet any more. He's off in happy land, thank you very much. He can sell his computer.

 

[Twelvefret]

Yeah, Slice, I remember an example of this when the convex arks came out. I saw a post from someone I had never heard of. But he had been quietly honing and shaving straights for about thirty years, he said. He said he had bought a convex ark, it was a perfect fit for him and was "a game changer". He was basically saying that he was now fully satisfied and was done.

And that was it. He left and we never heard from him again.

He doesn't need the internet any more. He's off in happy land, thank you very much. He can sell his computer.

I'm about to "happy land myself". If I can help a new member use films, some mid level stones, and pastes, I will. My interest is achieving excellent, near shavette or GEM MMOC quality shaves and nothing more. Not everyone hear cares about honing for honings sake. After all, it is a shaving forum.

 

[kohalajohn]

Yeah, I feel the same. I'm more of a shaver than a honer.

I was really satisfied with my convex black ark. It was a reliable way to get a very good shave. And even better, I knew that with just the passage of time, my technique both for honing and shaving, was improving and all I had to look forward to was better and better. And also, for when I got bored I had diamond balsa which also works perfectly.

I was riding off into the sunset, hombres. You won't see me again in this one horse town.

Then I made the mistake of having a new razor honed by doc226 on his jnat. Hmmm. It's a very nice edge. And is this a different character?

I'm resisting, but I feel the curiosity about jnats.

Why am suddenly unsettled? I was so happy and so satisfied....

 

[Chan Eil Whiskers]

Yeah, I feel the same. I'm more of a shaver than a honer.

I was really satisfied with my convex black ark. It was a reliable way to get a very good shave. And even better, I knew that with just the passage of time, my technique both for honing and shaving, was improving and all I had to look forward to was better and better. And also, for when I got bored I had diamond balsa which also works perfectly.

I was riding off into the sunset, hombres. You won't see me again in this one horse town.

Then I made the mistake of having a new razor honed by doc226 on his jnat. Hmmm. It's a very nice edge. And is this a different character?

I'm resisting, but I feel the curiosity about jnats.

Why am suddenly unsettled? I was so happy and so satisfied....

Oh, this could be very expensive!

 

[Twelvefret]

Yeah, I feel the same. I'm more of a shaver than a honer.

I was really satisfied with my convex black ark. It was a reliable way to get a very good shave. And even better, I knew that with just the passage of time, my technique both for honing and shaving, was improving and all I had to look forward to was better and better. And also, for when I got bored I had diamond balsa which also works perfectly.

I was riding off into the sunset, hombres. You won't see me again in this one horse town.

Then I made the mistake of having a new razor honed by doc226 on his jnat. Hmmm. It's a very nice edge. And is this a different character?

I'm resisting, but I feel the curiosity about jnats.

Why am suddenly unsettled? I was so happy and so satisfied....

Perhaps you are unsettled for the same reason our friend Jim was impressed with the vendor that used several mediums on the razors he sells.

I've said it before, if your business is selling shave ready edges, sending out an 8k edge will not help you build your cliental base or help your reputation. As a vendor you have to plan for coarse hair and a man w/o facial hair.

 

[Basil]

Yeah, I feel the same. I'm more of a shaver than a honer.

I was really satisfied with my convex black ark. It was a reliable way to get a very good shave. And even better, I knew that with just the passage of time, my technique both for honing and shaving, was improving and all I had to look forward to was better and better. And also, for when I got bored I had diamond balsa which also works perfectly.

I was riding off into the sunset, hombres. You won't see me again in this one horse town.

Then I made the mistake of having a new razor honed by doc226 on his jnat. Hmmm. It's a very nice edge. And is this a different character?

I'm resisting, but I feel the curiosity about jnats.

Why am suddenly unsettled? I was so happy and so satisfied....

Lol happy and satisfied with the convex ark here too. But I like honing on my jnat, it gives you a feedback you don’t get from a ark.

My ark is like glass smooth nothing changes no matter how many laps. The jnats you feel the slurry break down you can feel a difference as you get to that perfect edge.

 

[1Speedster]

Lol happy and satisfied with the convex ark here too. But I like honing on my jnat, it gives you a feedback you don’t get from a ark.

My ark is like glass smooth nothing changes no matter how many laps. The jnats you feel the slurry break down you can feel a difference as you get to that perfect edge.

Exactly how I remember my first honing experience finishing on the arkie my honing mentor had used to maintain his razors for decades.

 

[Basil]

Exactly how I remember my first honing experience finishing on the arkie my honing mentor had used to maintain his razors for decades.

Can’t really beat an ark for simplicity. It’s pretty fool proof.

 

[David]

As a vendor you have to plan for coarse hair and a man w/o facial hair.

Why would a man W/o facial hair need a shave ready razor?

 

[David]

Why am suddenly unsettled? I was so happy and so satisfied....

Because you enjoy honing more than you think and you’re curious as to what else is out there. Don’t be intimidated by jnats. Shoot one of the vendors that have good reputations here a message and tell them what you’re looking for and what your budget is and go for it. Everyone always talks about jnats and rabbit holes. There doesn’t have to be a rabbit hole it can be a simple as having one stone that you finish with just like you do any other finisher. Most vendors have 30 day returns so all you have to lose is the return shipping.

 

[Twelvefret]

Why would a man W/o facial hair need a shave ready razor?

Because some areas are more dense than others.

 

[MO1]

Jnats are very interesting. For example taking my Sheffield to my reasonably hard (quite hard not in the very hard level) suita (these stones are for the most part considered mid to prefinish speeders) makes just the perfect edge with that steel. Keen smooth, can go no prep, dry atg on my face with that edge with very little irritation and I have wiry beard (yes I was only testing the edge, I don't shave that way lol)
But trying to mimic the results with the hard swedish steel heljestrand was very hard, I can get it to a shaveable level with the smoothness, but not to the same keenness with the English steel.
So for the heljestrand it is a prefinisher in my book, I need to take that same edge to my very hard asagi to bump up the keenness. But taking the Sheffield to that asagi only scratches it up and leaves the edge harsh.
Gold dollars also works with the suita (the one I got) but it is not on the same smoothness level as the Sheffield although it has the keenness.

It doesn't have to be complicated, but I'm a perfectionist and I just cant stand not knowing if an edge can get better.
Jnats are alot of fun though!

 

[Twelvefret]

The 200k diamond edge continues to improve every razor for which it has been tried. I would equate todays shave similar if not the same as the Feather SS. I would have to recommend to anyone seeking a better shave to use diamond post stones.

 

[Steve56]

Because you enjoy honing more than you think and you’re curious as to what else is out there. Don’t be intimidated by jnats. Shoot one of the vendors that have good reputations here a message and tell them what you’re looking for and what your budget is and go for it. Everyone always talks about jnats and rabbit holes. There doesn’t have to be a rabbit hole it can be a simple as having one stone that you finish with just like you do any other finisher. Most vendors have 30 day returns so all you have to lose is the return shipping.

Exactly. @kohalajohn are you in Hawaii? Takeshi Aoki at AFramesTokyo can fix you up without large shipping costs.

I see from your profile that you were born in Scotland. Tom, @rideon66 has an oilstone or two from Fiddich River that seem to be very nice. We did an edge exchange and I was impressed with that edge. They’re hard to find but there’s a seller on eBay that throws one up once in a while. I’d like to try one myself.

 

[Steve56]

I'm about to "happy land myself". If I can help a new member use films, some mid level stones, and pastes, I will. My interest is achieving excellent, near shavette or GEM MMOC quality shaves and nothing more. Not everyone hear cares about honing for honings sake. After all, it is a shaving forum.

They probably do because this is the honing subforum, but you’re right about achieving your goals. And they’re excellent goals, to reproduce the edge that you like and want. If you’re a musician, that’s not quite the same thing as a luthier. You may not care how the guitar or mandolin are made, but luthiers do.

 

[Twelvefret]

They probably do because this is the honing subforum, but you’re right about achieving your goals. And they’re excellent goals, to reproduce the edge that you like and want. If you’re a musician, that’s not quite the same thing as a luthier. You may not care how the guitar or mandolin are made, but luthiers do.

You don't know much about musicians. I don't know a luthier who is not a musician.

 

[Steve56]

I don’t believe that I said that....

 

[kohalajohn]

You know, I did ask Alfred, doc226, about his method. And I learned that jnat honing doesn't have to be complicated.

His method is simple. No progressions with multiple rubbing stones. Most razors he gets are already at the mid level, around a 5k level. If not, he'll raise them up to that. My understanding is that it doesn't much matter how you get it up to the mid level. Use a synth or whatever.

From there, all he does is use a worn atoma 1200 to lap his hard Ozaku to create slurry. Then he just finishes from there, using lightening pressure as he goes. That's it. It also means he never needs to worry about his jnat dishing, it's automatically lapped flat each time.

I say "he just finishes" as if it's simple, but of course it's not. Of course he's been using this system for so long that I'm sure his hands have a very sensitive feel for the feedback, for knowing how the edge is doing. When to lighten up and when not to. It would take me a long time to build up that feel.

We talked about the electron microscope pictures we have seen, of jnat slurry. I said I was surprised that the images of the slurry show the particles the same size after honing, as when you first create the slurry. I had believed that the reason a slurry progresses, was because the particles were being broken down by the razor.

Not so. They are the same size before and after. He said he imagines what's happening is that the outside edges of the particles start off sharp and then do dull. Certainly, he said, the slurry cuts much more aggressively at the start. And cuts less aggressively as you go. And that makes sense. The mineral particles are like soccer balls, covered with sharp edges. The edges dull with use.

So the progression is caused both by his lightening pressure and also by the edges of the particles dulling with use.

Anyway, the temptation is to just get a hard Ozuku and an atoma 1200 and try it.

But then, my ark is working just fine.

Steve, I like your analogy about the guitar. That's exactly it. But even if a musician doesn't plan to become a luther, I think a good musician will still want to understand how his guitar works. Will want to understand why these strings don't work well with that type of guitar and so on.