When YMMV is Absolutely Appropriate

[musicman1951]

In a recent whining thread (I'm not sure that was the official title) there was much consternation about YMMV. So to avoid any waffling, digressive prattle or meandering uncertainty allow me to state unequivocally that you were wrong to do so - no YMMV allowed.

You post about a problem with poor shaves using a razor I don't own and a blade I find too dull. I can tell you flat out your blade is too dull, but I have yet to watch you shave, or run my hand lovingly ATG on your stubble. So are your whiskers as thick as mine? Is your technique the same as mine? Is your lather good? So I say that that particular blade is too dull for me, but it might be fine for you (ymmv). And I say this because I often see blades on other shaver's 5 favorite blade lists that I've found too dull for me.

I tried a sample (thank heavens) of a popular cologne that gets plenty of rave reviews here. On me, to my nose, it smelled like a 4 day old corps which had been rolled around in rotting fruit and left out in the sun to bake. Was it my metabolism or just my nose? I don't know, but it was definitely a YMMV scent for me.

Have you ever had a blade that worked great in one razor and considerably less well in another? What's the "truth" about that blade you're going to recommend? YMMV depending on razor.

We share our experiences here, politely and with a strong desire to be of some help to another shaver. It's a great place, but all we can offer is what worked or didn't work for us. I don't recall YMMV being used as a substitute for offering an opinion. I usually see it used along the lines of this worked for me on my face with my razor and my technique, but you'll have to experiment on your hair with your razor and your technique. Big countries are invading little countries, global warming, IPA's with too bitter a finish - there are problems left to solve, but YMMV isn't one of them.

So go shave. Or skip a day - YMMV.

 

[shave/brush]

This is 100% true. Sometimes I will have a bad shave where the blade felt rough on my skin, a blade that usually feels great. So what would I call that? There are so many variables. YMMV.

 

[BigJ]

+1! Great post!!

‘So go shave. Or skip a day.’ IMHO the main thing is to HAVE FUN!!

 

[jmd]

TL; DR. A grab bag of nonsense to follow.

Once a month someone gets confused about steep v. shallow-- pretty clearly they fail to abstract away the razor, the facial hair and/or the inclination of the handle and become distracted by visuals other than the inclination of the blade with the shave plane.

You point this out. They assure you that is not what they are doing and carry on.

I'm all for skeptical inquiry and needing to be dragged kicking and screaming to the truth. But consider the hubris. Someone new to shaving suspects that engineers misunderstood the correct terminology regarding the simple geometry problem they solved more than a century ago. Rather than start over, with the suspicion that they are confused, they continue to explain how others are confused.

Everyone agrees that riding the cap or the guard are better terms. Life goes on. Nobody dies.

One does best to accept other's testimony, as that, their testimony, and hope you are worthy of the same courtesy.

And there are skews. We've all bled. But you'd think it is an achievement to not bleed, or only have "the usual" 3 weepers that apparently come with sensitive skin, like that is somehow normal, ok, or not a clear indication of operator error.

 

[ShavingPanda]

An IPA with too bitter of a finish, nonsense! Your preferences may vary (YPMV).

As someone who doesn't like YMMV, I appreciate everyone has different preferences and opinions, and welcome them because shaving is personal and interesting to see what other's like/dislike.

I just don't think 'YMMV' needs to be stated alongside every opinion or experience. I assume YMMV is inherent within every post. I think most experienced shavers understand everyone is different but perhaps newbie benefit from noting YMMV.

 

[Beefdrippings]

Whenever I’ve used it it was me just trying to be polite. I can only say what works best for me and I don’t want to speak in absolutes. Only you can truly know what works best for you

 

[silverlifter]

Whenever I’ve used it it was me just trying to be polite. I can only say what works best for me and I don’t want to speak in absolutes. Only you can truly know what works best for you

This! It is terrifc shorthand for telling others that their taste and/or technique is truly awful.

 

[Medivh]

This! It is terrifc shorthand for telling others that their taste and/or technique is truly awful.

Exactly. Shaving (even with a straight razor) isn't a rocket science and I believe that even a handicapped monkey can learn how to shave with enough practice and you don't have to be master Joda or mr. Miyagi like some folks see themselves to be able to shave with multiple different razors and get a nice BBS. I'm well aware that we're all different and we have different skin and whiskers and it's ok if someone disagrees with my preference when it comes to razors, blades, soaps/creams etc.

What i'm not ok with is when some ''wise guy'' tells me that it's my technique at fault, because I find some razors to have blade chatter or that I just don't find them comfortable or good shavers in general. I'm by no means claiming that i'm the most skilled shaver or a professional, but i'm pretty sure that if I spend a few months of constant shaving with the same razor over and over again with different blades, angle, pressure and pretty much any way imaginable and I don't see any noticeable changes and improvements that this has very little to do with my shaving skills or technique.

Some razors take some time to get used to them like my Fatip Grande/Schone, others are great right out of the first try and there are those who despite being able to get a BBS, just don't work as I would want them to no matter how much I try.

 

[APBinNCA]

TL; DR. A grab bag of nonsense to follow.

Once a month someone gets confused about steep v. shallow-- pretty clearly they fail to abstract away the razor, the facial hair and/or the inclination of the handle and become distracted by visuals other than the inclination of the blade with the shave plane.

You point this out. They assure you that is not what they are doing and carry on.

I'm all for skeptical inquiry and needing to be dragged kicking and screaming to the truth. But consider the hubris. Someone new to shaving suspects that engineers misunderstood the correct terminology regarding the simple geometry problem they solved more than a century ago. Rather than start over, with the suspicion that they are confused, they continue to explain how others are confused.

Everyone agrees that riding the cap or the guard are better terms. Life goes on. Nobody dies.

One does best to accept other's testimony, as that, their testimony, and hope you are worthy of the same courtesy.

And there are skews. We've all bled. But you'd think it is an achievement to not bleed, or only have "the usual" 3 weepers that apparently come with sensitive skin, like that is somehow normal, ok, or not a clear indication of operator error.

As someone prone to explaining things in unnecessarily complex details and when misunderstood, I write a PHD thesis for them. I know which thread of which you speak and fortunately this time, I wondered in late enough to see the train wreck in progress. In classical debate, the first order of business is defining terms. In modern debate, one person decides randomly that they don't agree with commonly accepted terms, but only later in the discussion and with a lot of passion behind their insistence.

 

[GaryTha]

In my opinion, if people use hedging words, they probably don't need YMMV.

 

[jmd]

Content free silliness.

In my opinion, if people use hedging words, they probably don't need YMMV.

If you are going to stake out such controversial territory it would behoove you to say, IMHO rather than IMO, just so we know. But YMMV.

As someone prone to explaining things in unnecessarily complex details and when misunderstood, I write a PHD thesis for them. I know which thread of which you speak and fortunately this time, I wondered in late enough to see the train wreck in progress. In classical debate, the first order of business is defining terms. In modern debate, one person decides randomly that they don't agree with commonly accepted terms, but only later in the discussion and with a lot of passion behind their insistence.

Yes.

And I rejoice that a kind shepherd traveling by sees what is happening, correctly diagnoses the fellow's mind can't let go of the handle, so tries to leverage this by 1) explaining the thing in terms of the handle 2) pointing out the handle's perpendicularity to the plane in question 3) ergo, shallow handle steep blade and vice versa.

Bob's your uncle, you'd think. But of course not. Fruitless, other than genius, hilarious, campy illustrations that truly deserve to be printed out and proudly displayed on a refrigerator. I'd call it a win for ymmv.

 

[GaryTha]

Content free silliness.



If you are going to stake out such controversial territory it would behoove you to say, IMHO rather than IMO, just so we know. But YMMV.

PDNA

 

[hairless wonder]

Some razors take some time to get used to them like my Fatip Grande/Schone, others are great right out of the first try

Ironically, this is also YMMV territory. I've always gotten great shaves with my Fatip Grande--even the first time I shaved with it. It may have helped that I transitioned from a Fatip Piccolo and that prior to the Piccolo, I'd been using other somewhat similarly designed OC DE razors.

 

[Medivh]

Ironically, this is also YMMV territory. I've always gotten great shaves with my Fatip Grande--even the first time I shaved with it. It may have helped that I transitioned from a Fatip Piccolo and that prior to the Piccolo, I'd been using other somewhat similarly designed OC DE razors.

I agree, but that wasn't my point. What I was trying to say is that some folks think that everything in wetshaving is about technique and skill and while they are indeed very important, there are tons of other factors that contribute to the shaving like being blessed with good skin and/or soft facial hair for instance, but they don't even try to see things from a different angle and instead they see themselves as black belt shave masters who have the best shaving skills ever and I find that laughable.

One of my best friends shaves by just applying a bit of water on his face with a cartridge razor without taking a shower, using pre shaves or shaving gels/soaps/foams/creams etc. and his face is perfectly smooth without any bumps or ingrown hairs. If I shave only by that method alone, I don't think my face would be as good as his and even he acknowledges that this has nothing to do with his shaving skills and hes by no means the only person on the planet who can do that, but hes the only one that I know personally and one of the very few who has the balls to admit it instead of calling himself the mr. Miyagi of shaving like lots of folks do by telling others that it's their technique at fault and not the products they are using.

 

[Ron R]

I seldom use YMMV but it is a true short abbreviation statement about a variable that should not offend some one IMO, relax there are worse abbreviations to describe something.

 

[hairless wonder]

I agree, but that wasn't my point. What I was trying to say is that some folks think that everything in wetshaving is about technique and skill and while they are indeed very important, there are tons of other factors that contribute to the shaving like being blessed with good skin and/or soft facial hair for instance, but they don't even try to see things from a different angle and instead they see themselves as black belt shave masters who have the best shaving skills ever and I find that laughable.

One of my best friends shaves by just applying a bit of water on his face with a cartridge razor without taking a shower, using pre shaves or shaving gels/soaps/foams/creams etc. and his face is perfectly smooth without any bumps or ingrown hairs. If I shave only by that method alone, I don't think my face would be as good as his and even he acknowledges that this has nothing to do with his shaving skills and hes by no means the only person on the planet who can do that, but hes the only one that I know personally and one of the very few who has the balls to admit it instead of calling himself the mr. Miyagi of shaving like lots of folks do by telling others that it's their technique at fault and not the products they are using.

Oh, I'm totally on board. I'm fairly "lucky" in the shaving department, but even I can't shave like your friend without irritation. There are too many face angles, skin types, beard types, etc. for there ever to be a one-size fits all approach to shaving, IMHO.

I just found it delightfully humorous that you mentioned the Fatip Grande as needing more of a break in period before someone's fully comfortable with it as a rule by which you were contrasting other YMMV areas of shaving. It tickled me (in a good way).

FWIW, I find the general rule of thumb in shaving to be YMMV. The only exception to that rule might be that Arko smells like an urinal cake!

 

[Medivh]

Oh, I'm totally on board. I'm fairly "lucky" in the shaving department, but even I can't shave like your friend without irritation. There are too many face angles, skin types, beard types, etc. for there ever to be a one-size fits all approach to shaving, IMHO.

I just found it delightfully humorous that you mentioned the Fatip Grande as needing more of a break in period before someone's fully comfortable with it as a rule by which you were contrasting other YMMV areas of shaving. It tickled me (in a good way).

FWIW, I find the general rule of thumb in shaving to be YMMV. The only exception to that rule might be that Arko smells like an urinal cake!

The Grande is great. It took me a few shaves to truly master my technique, maybe because back then I was still new to wet shaving and I haven't tried lots of razors or because the design and the shallow angle was unknown to me back then, but regardless I think I was getting much better shaves than many of my current razors. I've got a Schone and a FOCS and sold the Grande, but now that I think about it, I think I was getting better shaves from it compared to the Schone.

About Arko, I don't mind the scent, but then again I still don't understand why people are so obsessed with different soap scents, unless they turn them off, of course. If the scent isn't bad, to the point of me not wanting to use the soap, I really don't care. From the soaps I want them to do their main job and I have parfumes to please my nose.

 

[thombrogan]

I don’t want to speak in absolutes.

Me neither. Smirnoff 80 gets the same job done smoother and for less money. Speaking only medicinally and not as beverage to be sipped and contemplated (as I read some do).

The only exception to that rule might be that Arko smells like an urinal cake!

Yes. And what a urinal cake!

I one time hurt the feelings of Spyderco’s owner by calling his folding pocketknives “fugly.” Then, as I tried and liked one of his knives and well, got a bunch more, they started looking prettier to me as I used them. Still, over twenty years later, I haven’t lived it down.

@musicman1951 , if you had those audits at everyone’s bathroom sink, I think you’d be able to answer their questions for that one shave and then scan B/S/T for deals as a bunch of people start swearing off shaving

 

[hairless wonder]

Me neither. Smirnoff 80 gets the same job done smoother and for less money. Speaking only medicinally and not as beverage to be sipped and contemplated (as I read some do).



Yes. And what a urinal cake!

I one time hurt the feelings of Spyderco’s owner by calling his folding pocketknives “fugly.” Then, as I tried and liked one of his knives and well, got a bunch more, they started looking prettier to me as I used them. Still, over twenty years later, I haven’t lived it down.

@musicman1951 , if you had those audits at everyone’s bathroom sink, I think you’d be able to answer their questions for that one shave and then scan B/S/T for deals as a bunch of people start swearing off shaving

I agree about the Spyderco knives aesthetics, too! I initially thought they looked ugly and poorly designed, then I got a Pacific Salt for fishing. Now I find myself wanting more Spydercos. Also, I'm really digging the Spyderhole over thumbtabs on the back of the blade (like the one found on the back of my Benchmade Griptilian).

If I didn't know any better, I'd swear that Spyderco infused their knives with some sort of mind-altering substance that makes anyone who handles one lose their sense of aesthetics and good taste!

 

[thombrogan]

You can’t spell “cute” without spelling “cut” and that’s what Spyderco knives do.