When Does It Make Sense to Consider Buying a More Aggressive DE Razor?

[CK89]

This is a great thread with excellent posts.

Mild razors appear simple, like beautiful, innocent tools. But they have hidden complexities. You need time and patience to understand them. Follow their rules, and you'll get an incredibly close shave (a BBS). If you ignore the rules and try to force a BBS, you'll get irritation, without warning or explanation. You're left to figure out your mistake.

Aggressive razors are the opposite. They're direct and honest. They offer much more freedom. If you make a mistake, their feedback tells you what went wrong. It's easy to get a good shave with an aggressive razor, and there are many ways to achieve it.

Mild razors seem luxurious at first, but once you experience the easygoing nature of an aggressive razor, it's difficult to go back.

 

[sylbub]

This is a great thread with excellent posts.

Mild razors appear simple, like beautiful, innocent tools. But they have hidden complexities. You need time and patience to understand them. Follow their rules, and you'll get an incredibly close shave (a BBS). If you ignore the rules and try to force a BBS, you'll get irritation, without warning or explanation. You're left to figure out your mistake.

Aggressive razors are the opposite. They're direct and honest. They offer much more freedom. If you make a mistake, their feedback tells you what went wrong. It's easy to get a good shave with an aggressive razor, and there are many ways to achieve it.

Mild razors seem luxurious at first, but once you experience the easygoing nature of an aggressive razor, it's difficult to go back.

Very good point. The crux of the issue is feedback - some razors deliver none (Razorock BBS) and some others do (DE89's are quite good at this in spite of their mildness)

 

[ivan_101]

When you have black barbwire on your face and shaving with techs, super-speeds, DE89 etc., etc. doing 3 passes cannot provide BBS.

 

[Lane101]

IMO, it's all about how much blade feel you want.

It takes skill to achieve an irritation free shave using an aggressive razor. But getting a close shave using an aggressive razor should be included free with the package. I try the most aggressive razors I can find, and improve my technique until there is zero alum feedback.

Rumor has it that it takes skill to get a close shave using a mild razor. I wouldn't know. Maybe I'm lazy, but I have no interest in learning how to use a mild razor. I find aggressive razors much more intuitive to use.

You are right that a big part of this comes down to personal preferences.

Regarding mild razors the skill level required depends on how mild the razor is. My moderate to mild Weishi is easy to use, just let the weight of the razor do the work while taking advantage of its wide range of effective razor angles. For my much milder King C. Gillette it took a lot of experimentation to figure out how to use it to generate BBS shaves using a small amount of additional pressure on the razor and a final partial pass with a high handle to face angle or what is often called "riding the cap".

Suspect a similar pattern is true with aggressive razors where with higher blade gaps/exposure demand increased skill levels.

Curious, some of what you are describing in improving skills and technique to handle aggressive razors sounds similar, though to a lesser extent, to what is required to use a straight razor safely and effectively. Is that a fair analogy?

 

[Lane101]

Even with more aggressive razors i have tried, it still takes the same amount of passes to get a great shave. Most of my favorite razors are "beginner razors". The only time a reach for more aggressive open combs is when I'm shaving off a weeks worth of mustache and goatee.

That's a great point. We don't see lots of aggressive razor users, if any, claiming to achieve BBS shaves in a single pass. Most here still shave with at least a couple passed regardless the razor used for a BBS result. When we do hear about shaving in one pass the result is typically a DFS regardless of the aggressiveness of the razor used.

 

[Lane101]

This is a great thread with excellent posts.

Mild razors appear simple, like beautiful, innocent tools. But they have hidden complexities. You need time and patience to understand them. Follow their rules, and you'll get an incredibly close shave (a BBS). If you ignore the rules and try to force a BBS, you'll get irritation, without warning or explanation. You're left to figure out your mistake.

Aggressive razors are the opposite. They're direct and honest. They offer much more freedom. If you make a mistake, their feedback tells you what went wrong. It's easy to get a good shave with an aggressive razor, and there are many ways to achieve it.

Mild razors seem luxurious at first, but once you experience the easygoing nature of an aggressive razor, it's difficult to go back.

Great post that shows how YMMV this topic is given all the posts noting how moving to a more aggressive razor required effort to adjust and improve technique. For me I've found that my mildest razor allows a more carefree shave where I don't need to focus too much on what I'm doing as the only penalty for not removing enough stubble is an extra partial pass on that part of my face. The opposite is true with my moderately aggressive razors where I need to focus on maintaining the appropriate technique to avoid weepers.

 

[AshleyC]

This is why I'm a tireless (some might call repetitive and tedious) advocate for adjustable razors. I theoretically do not have to keep searching for that 3 piece razor with the sweet spot. I can dial in the sweet spot everytime.

When it comes to DE razors, the GC .84P is about as mild as I want to go. I'll only use a Tech or Super Speed (excepting the Red Tip) if I'm feeling nostalgic for a vintage experience.

At the other end of the spectrum, my Timeless Bronze OC is more aggressive than I really care for. But it is a 3 piece, so the only way I was going to find out I don't like it was to buy it. Now I'll have to leave it as a display (no), sell it at a loss, or try the milder base plate for an additional cost.

 

[Lane101]

I'm leaning at looking at a Canadian Manufacturer Razor Rock Game Changer or an adjustable razor. There is an adjustable razor that has an off white bottom that seems to turn from 1-9 giving you a mild up to an aggressive shave depending on the dial setup - am I right about this?

The Game Changer has different heads and from what I understand is you need to only buy the 1 full razor and that razor can take any of their heads made for the game changer, So if what I ordered at first didn't work out, I would just have to purchase a part instead of a whole new setup. Is this correct?

Also saw some posts about other razors from Razor Rock called a Lupo & Mamba. but the game changer seems to be loved more and the heads and razor is cheaper, but haven't ruled out anything yet but the Henson razors or an older Gillette. Nothing personal against them, I would just prefer to have something newer.

Plague Doctor

Hi, I think you are referring to the Merkur Progress two piece adjustable razor that is generally well regarded here. Will leave it to those who have used one to comment further as all my adjustables are of the TTO variety per my earlier posts in your thread.

 

[Rob72]

IMO, it's all about how much blade feel you want.

It takes skill to achieve an irritation free shave using an aggressive razor. But getting a close shave using an aggressive razor should be included free with the package. I try the most aggressive razors I can find, and improve my technique until there is zero alum feedback.

Rumor has it that it takes skill to get a close shave using a mild razor. I wouldn't know. Maybe I'm lazy, but I have no interest in learning how to use a mild razor. I find aggressive razors much more intuitive to use.

I very much agree. The _only_ reason I have kept my Muramasa is the adjustability, and it's 5 is where I usually consider a razor beginning to be useful. More "aggressive" razors exfoliate more, which some may find irritating, but I like it, and I am by no means an "exfoliation-cucumber-eye-patch-moisturizer" focused fellow.

 

[bushisho]

As long as I would like to agree with the Mr. Shavingstons' post, cuz it makes perfect sense, the opposite is also true- one cannot have a good shave with an aggressive razor without the proper technique. Try putting the same pressure, which one would have to apply to a de89 in order to have a bbs, with an r41-recipe for disaster. So yes, I do think that razor matters, because everyone is different. I can give an example with myself, wanted to try the SLOC razor for that double open comb and see if there is really something behind that design. Bought it, tried it- really disappointed, because that thing pulls my hairs like tweezers- exactly the same thing what happens to my face with every mild razor. I was at the brink of giving up in the beginning, because every other razor I bought was mild and I couldn't stand that pulling sensation. After that I bought fatip oc and realized that aggressive is the path I should go. I like some blade feel in my shaves so I tried r41 after some time (4 years after goind DE) andliked the truly bbs. Aggressive razors do the bbs for me, because of the thick and coarse beard I have, and I don't think we, who like aggressive shaves, lack anything in technique. My r41 eats cheeks if technique is offset and I still have both of them.

 

[wetshaver233]

When you're are not satisfied with the results from the current razor/razors that you're using and you want better and faster results.

 

[cpcohen1945]

Hi, I think you are referring to the Merkur Progress two piece adjustable razor that is generally well regarded here. Will leave it to those who have used one to comment further as all my adjustables are of the TTO variety per my earlier posts in your thread.

Yes, it's probably a Merkur Progress. I used one for years. The handle is polished chrome with lengthwise grooves and ridges. It's OK, but good knurling is better, IMHO.

There's a problem with the Progress:

. . . The blade-fixing tolerances are too sloppy, so it's possible to put a blade in, tighten the head, and have
. . . the blade slightly crooked, or one side with slightly greater gap than the other.

The fix is to set the blade up symmetrically, just as you start to tighten the head. It works nicely, like that.

According to most accounts, the Parker Variant (a Progress clone) doesn't have that problem.

The Progress set on 1 is really mild. I like it best (with a Feather blade) between 1.5 and 2. I've never tried it set greater than 3.

Both the Parker Variant and the Pearl Flexi are worth considering, as alternatives.

. Charles

PS -- if you search, you should find a video from Mantic59 that talks about the Progress's quirks and how to avoid them. For all its flaws, it's been around since the 1950's, and it's a near-clone of a razor older than that. So it's probably doing _something_ right.

 

[Chelko]

The Game Changer has different heads and from what I understand is you need to only buy the 1 full razor and that razor can take any of their heads made for the game changer, So if what I ordered at first didn't work out, I would just have to purchase a part instead of a whole new setup. Is this correct?

Plague Doctor

Yes, you are correct. And the same applies to the Lupos, which are among my very favorite razors.

As for the aggressiveness, in my personal experience, it depends a lot on your beard (and technique of course). My thick beard tends to laugh at mild razors. Then I need to do too many passes and touch ups, I end up applying a bit extra pressure and I get irritation. I only consider using my mild one when I need to shave very short stable for a specific occasion. Otherwise, I like the more aggressive DEs, which allow me to find the proper angle easier and I can make them milder by just adjusting the angle with some of them. I can easily use my "aggressive" DEs as daily drivers, because the work great for me, very efficient, minimal irritation, and I have a better technique and enjoyment with them.

 

[ivan_101]

That's a great point. We don't see lots of aggressive razor users, if any, claiming to achieve BBS shaves in a single pass. Most here still shave with at least a couple passed regardless the razor used for a BBS result. When we do hear about shaving in one pass the result is typically a DFS regardless of the aggressiveness of the razor used.

Always 3 passes, even with the most aggressive razors. And I have and use a lot of them.

 

[Blade_Runner37C]

IMO, it's all about how much blade feel you want.

It takes skill to achieve an irritation free shave using an aggressive razor. But getting a close shave using an aggressive razor should be included free with the package. I try the most aggressive razors I can find, and improve my technique until there is zero alum feedback.

Rumor has it that it takes skill to get a close shave using a mild razor. I wouldn't know. Maybe I'm lazy, but I have no interest in learning how to use a mild razor. I find aggressive razors much more intuitive to use.

Do you think the red tip I got from you was aggressive?

I consider the Ikon b1 slant, Ikon b1 open comb, Merkur 37C slant, Ikon short comb and the Ming Shi 2000S 4+ aggressive. Would you agree?

 

[Eben Stone]

Do you think the red tip I got from you was aggressive?

I consider the Ikon b1 slant, Ikon b1 open comb, Merkur 37C slant, Ikon short comb and the Ming Shi 2000S 4+ aggressive. Would you agree?

No, the red tip is mild.

I haven't tried any of those other razors you mentioned.

Razors I consider aggressive are the R41, Ikon Tek, and Yaqi Knight Helmet.

 

[Tomo]

Blackland advocates for increased comfort through efficiency. It’s counterintuitive but in my experience it works. Aggression is in the technique not the blade holder. Expose the blade and let it do its thing.

 

[Plague Doctor]

Hi, I think you are referring to the Merkur Progress two piece adjustable razor that is generally well regarded here. Will leave it to those who have used one to comment further as all my adjustables are of the TTO variety per my earlier posts in your thread.

Excuse my ignorance but what does TTO stand for? is that what people call an adjustable razor with a knob?

I found one online from a company called aliexpress, not called a Murker Progress, but it is out of China and they are around $10 shipped. i'm guessing this is a scam correct? Guess i'm going to have to get a paypal account to order anything online because I can't even get blades anymore locally. I was scammed once a while back purchasing online. They drained my bank account and I was almost homeless and lost my car over it.

I am not big on ordering online anywhere. That's really my problem. Even scared to share private info (name, location, etc.)

I was told to buy pre-paid visas and add that money to a paypal account, but need to research it first.

Plague Doctor

 

[JAHE]

I believe all a more aggressive razor does is widen the range of angles where the razor will cut efficiently. If the blade is more exposed then you can afford to get your angle a bit wrong and the blade edge will still be on your skin. It’s an aid for imperfect technique (though some shavers also prefer a stronger blade feel when they shave - but most just want an efficient shave as comfortably as possible). The price you pay for a more exposed blade is a harsher shave. But you might find that this is still more comfortable overall than doing repeated passes or applying pressure with a more mild razor that you struggle to maintain the optimal angle with successfully on parts of your face.

But a more aggressive razor isn’t really any more efficient than a mild razor - as long as the blade edge is on your skin correctly the blade cuts exactly the same. So I’d say it’s fine to try a more aggressive razor, but don’t start collecting them because over time your shaving technique will improve and you’ll learn to get exactly the same results from mild razors, which will be more comfortable.

While you might find it easier to get close shaves with a more aggressive razor, I’m not sure it helps you improve your technique. It just allows you to get away with deficiencies in your technique, so it might actually reinforce poor technique and slow your learning.

What you could try instead is to use your milder razor to show you where you’re getting your angle wrong, and between shaves think about what you could try differently to get a better result in the areas you weren’t satisfied with (you didn’t get a close enough shave, or you got irritation because you added pressure or went over the spot too many times). It’s difficult to maintain the optimal shaving angle when your face is full of curves and hollows and corners, so it takes time and practice. Things that often help include stretching your skin to make it flatter, using much shorter strokes (so you’re not trying to compensate your angle across a curved surface with long strokes), going slower and concentrating on the angle, using as light a touch as you can (adding pressure is counter-productive because it pushes the razor into your skin and makes it less flat - less pressure and correcting the angle is the solution, not adding more pressure). You can also try more advanced techniques like holding the razor slightly diagonally so when you do your stroke the blade is also slicing the hair a bit).

Good luck, and always keep asking questions. There’s stuff to learn but everybody gets there in the end. Your face and hair are unique to you, so some of it you can only figure out for yourself. You get there quicker by trying things and learning from each shave.

This is a very informative summary, which in my opinion contains very valuable arguments.

As far as a successful shave is concerned there's one point I'd like to add: imo one shouldn't underestimate the meaning of picking a 'proper' DE blade. Imo, it's all about the combination of a razor and a blade... Different blades might make for a significantly different experience even if loaded in the very same razor...

 

[Blade_Runner37C]

Excuse my ignorance but what does TTO stand for? is that what people call an adjustable razor with a knob?

I found one online from a company called aliexpress, not called a Murker Progress, but it is out of China and they are around $10 shipped. i'm guessing this is a scam correct? Guess i'm going to have to get a paypal account to order anything online because I can't even get blades anymore locally. I was scammed once a while back purchasing online. They drained my bank account and I was almost homeless and lost my car over it.

I am not big on ordering online anywhere. That's really my problem. Even scared to share private info (name, location, etc.)

I was told to buy pre-paid visas and add that money to a paypal account, but need to research it first.

Plague Doctor

Not a scam. Made in china clones.

DUDE your going to have to get over that. I can't find jack locally either. You will never get all the cool and great products your reading about on here (or anywhere). Just go to paypal dot com have your credit card on hand (or get a credit card) they are protected from fraud and so is paypal. Bank accounts do not reimburse you for fraud. I have set up a 2nd bank account just for paypal and other pay apps so that doesn't happen. I don't know how a person can survive in 2025 not ordering online. I would shrivel up and die.

PS I can help you out with the paypal thing, just send me your name, social, mothers maiden name, town you were born in, first pets name, DOB and current and last known addresses. It's ok you can trust me........... in case you have no sense of humor, i'm just joking with you.