What results should I expect with each pass?

[mikelz777]

I've been doing a 3 pass shave with the grain, across the grain and then against the grain. After the first pass when I'm rinsing and feeling my face, it almost feels as if I've done little to nothing even though I can hear the blade cutting. After the 2nd pass, it's a little better but there's still plenty left to be shaved. It's only after the 3rd pass, against the grain that I'm feeling smooth but there are still significant touch ups needed. Maybe I have it wrong, but it seems like most of the work should already be done in the first two passes and that the 3rd pass should kind of be the touch up pass.

I can see the need for it but I haven't yet done a face map on paper. I've kind of done it in my head but everything below the jawline seems to go in all directions. What makes it even harder is that my beard growth isn't symmetrical so it's a different approach on each side.

Another factor here might be the blades. I have a sampler of blades and I've been working from what I've decided are the lesser blades to the better blades. To give you an idea where I'm at, Derbys have been the best blade I've used so far! I've got 4-5 more brands to try out. (The Dorcos were terrible and didn't make it past 2 shaves. They resulted in the most nicks and weepers. The Sharps weren't very sharp, tugging and jumping from the start and didn't make it past 2 shaves. The Treet Classics were a little better, but not much. The Derbys have performed the best of all the blades I've tried so far. I got 4 shaves out of them but my impression of them, at best, is unremarkable.) There's little room to go but up, right?

What progress should I expect with each pass? It seems like most of the work (feel wise) is being done on the 3rd pass. After 3 passes should I expect a need for fairly large touch ups? Is there a better approach than having to change directions 3-4 times on my neck when shaving between ear to chin? I'm guessing it's probably more of a technique thing than anything else. I've been trying to change up my approach but it seems I haven't hit on the right way yet.

 

[boogieman_]

I will be watching this because it is the exact same for me. ATG is the only pass which gives any significant results.

Edit: also, I don't see the XTG doing anything, I get the same result with one WTG and one ATG as three passes doing WTG, XTG, ATG.

 

[Fkread]

Maybe try a better blade. I'm working through a sampler and have used Feathers and Astras from that sampler. I started with Derbys and they were decent, but Feathers so far have been the best. I've only had a few shaves with the Astra blades so I can't say too much about them yet.

As far as the various passes (and I'm new at this) -- your 1st pass sounds about right. My 1st pass result is a barely SAS. The 2nd pass is significantly better, but there is a 3rd or 4th necessary pass on my chin and jawline for the closest shave (DFS usually).

I'm pretty much a WTG shaver, but I do go XTG on my jawline and chin. Right now I refuse to do a ATG pass anywhere -- bad experience when I first began shaving.

Kelly

 

[oldbluelight]

I'm no expert. I've just come back to wet shaving after 30 years of wandering in the cartridge and canned goo wilderness and looking back on my previous work with 'real' razors I come to realize that back then I didn't really know how to get a good shave. Your experience sounds perfectly normal to me. I'm getting very good shaves but it takes an effort, 3 maybe 4 passes and touch up. I think that a WTG pass by it's nature will offer the least reduction because the hair can yield easily and lie down when the blade makes contact with it. In fact, I suspect that a careful examination of your neck with it's variable growth directions will reveal that some areas are smoother than others after the first pass because the razor approached the hairs in that area from an ATG or XTG direction. That's the case with me at any rate. Additional details about your razor and prep routine might also give an insight into possible areas of improvement. But I don't think that WTG passes should be expected to offer the greatest reduction.

 

[raccoonandbrush]

After you finish a pass, it should feel smooth in that direction. I use straight razors, and I only do 2 passes. The wtg pass takes care of most of the hair. The xtg pass cleans up from the first pass. The 3rd pass atg achieves bbs. I don't do a atg pass because it irritates my skin. 2 passes should be enough to achieve a nice smooth shave. On the few times I use a DE, I still get a very nice shave with 2 passes.

 

[KipNoxzema]

Something tells me it has to do with your razor. What one are you using? If it's an adjustable, it sounds like it is set too mild.

 

[mikelz777]

......Additional details about your razor and prep routine might also give an insight into possible areas of improvement......

I'm using an EJ DE89, VDH pure badger brush and VDH luxury soap. I fill my mug (with the soap in the bottom) with hot water and let the brush soak in the mug for several minutes. I wash my face with Noxema, rinse my face and hold a wet, warm wash cloth on the lower face/neck for a minute or two. Then I lather up and have at it. I've been trying to keep things the same so the only changing factor at this point should be the blades.

 

[oldbluelight]

Okay Mike, I've got the same razor and soap. In my DE89 Feather, Personna Lab, Gillette Silver Blue and Personna IP Red Pack have been the best performers in tems of comfortable and close shaves. Just finished up with a Lord SS and my usual prep and passes. It did not give me as close a shave as my best blades. If you've got any of the blades I've mentioned try them in that razor. I don't think any blade or technique will give you 'One pass BBS' but perhaps a sharper blade will give you slightly more reduction on the WTG pass.

 

[Vlad]

Everything sounds ok to me...you are getting beard reduction. Works the opposite for me, I feel most comes off with pass 1. But it may just a difference of perception.

 

[NeverOne99]

I believe that BBS is only achieved with an ATG pass. I have an EJ and use a Feather in it and for the most part experience the same results as you do. However, if I haven't shaved for a week, then of course the first wtg pass gets the most reduction.

 

[beau5278]

I would imagine that everyones beard and as such,their shaving experience is different but most days I could get by with a perfectly acceptible shave with one pass,maybe not quite as much so if I don't shave but once or twice a week but even then the second pass is as close a shave as I ever get.

 

[PugslyCat]

Everything sounds ok to me...you are getting beard reduction. Works the opposite for me, I feel most comes off with pass 1. But it may just a difference of perception.

+1 - For me it's kind of like the law of diminishing returns with each pass. After WTG I have about equal amounts of bare skin and stubble. The XTG pass has most of the stubble cleared, but there is just enough left to justify going ATG. Usually I only need ATG from the jaw line down.

 

[mikelz777]

Okay Mike, I've got the same razor and soap. In my DE89 Feather, Personna Lab, Gillette Silver Blue and Personna IP Red Pack have been the best performers in tems of comfortable and close shaves. Just finished up with a Lord SS and my usual prep and passes. It did not give me as close a shave as my best blades. If you've got any of the blades I've mentioned try them in that razor. I don't think any blade or technique will give you 'One pass BBS' but perhaps a sharper blade will give you slightly more reduction on the WTG pass.

I may be turning the corner as far as the blade quality in my sampler pack goes. The blades I haven't tried yet are Super-Max Super Platinum, Personna Red IP, Astra Superior Stainless, Astra Superior Platinum and Blue Israeli IP. Of the blades I've used so far (noted above), I noticed that several of the blades regularly appear on peoples "worst" list. I'm pretty sure I'll get some better shaves with the blades I haven't tried yet. It'll be interesting to see how their performance compares with what I've used so far.

*******************************

From the feedback I've received so far, it doesn't sound like my 3 pass results are all that unusual. I guess I was thinking that 2 passes would take care of nearly everything and that the 3rd pass would be a clean up. I guess I shouldn't discount the value of beard reduction. Judging from the feel of my face after the 1st pass, I wouldn't want to go against the grain on the 2nd pass, especially on my neck.

The hair on my neck and jawline has more directions than Mapquest. Trying to accommodate WTG, XTG and ATG is like trying to solve a patchwork puzzle. I'd like to find a more economical and effective approach but maybe that will only come with experimentation and experience.

 

[oldbluelight]

I may be turning the corner as far as the blade quality in my sampler pack goes. The blades I haven't tried yet are Super-Max Super Platinum, Personna Red IP, Astra Superior Stainless, Astra Superior Platinum and Blue Israeli IP. Of the blades I've used so far (noted above), I noticed that several of the blades regularly appear on peoples "worst" list. I'm pretty sure I'll get some better shaves with the blades I haven't tried yet. It'll be interesting to see how their performance compares with what I've used so far.

*******************************

From the feedback I've received so far, it doesn't sound like my 3 pass results are all that unusual. I guess I was thinking that 2 passes would take care of nearly everything and that the 3rd pass would be a clean up. I guess I shouldn't discount the value of beard reduction. Judging from the feel of my face after the 1st pass, I wouldn't want to go against the grain on the 2nd pass, especially on my neck.

The hair on my neck and jawline has more directions than Mapquest. Trying to accommodate WTG, XTG and ATG is like trying to solve a patchwork puzzle. I'd like to find a more economical and effective approach but maybe that will only come with experimentation and experience.

Curiously enough a WTG below my jaw is from predominantly South to North so that's the direction of my first pass. I cheat a little on the XTG below the jaw. Instead of going E to W I go NW to SE and SE to NW everywhere except directly below my chin. There I confine myself to WTG which in this area is North to South and the opposite for ATG. Of course I'm old and have jowls and the beginings of a dewlap so the direction is somewhat dictated by deterioration in the terrain. Anyway try a 'bias cut' XTG on the areas with the disorganized growth patterns. For me it seems to offer the best level of reduction for he XTG passes on the conflicting growth patterns.

 

[Razorburne]

Maybe it's not your blade, razor, cream, etc., but rather your blade angle. It is very well possible for someone to cut at too steep of a blade angle --- you would still hear hair being cut (but it would just be the tips of your facial hair), and the result would be a less than stellar pass. I can only speak from my own experiences but even the subjective worst of blades would likely do a fine job if your angle and beard prep were spot on, though sharper/smoother blades and razors can add some variation to the final product. Go slower; short strokes; vary your angle, even if you think you are doing it correctly now, and see what happens.

Best of luck!

 

[Mandina]

+1 on exploring blade angle and pressure, but also on keeping in mind that the basic principle is gradual beard reduction, as well as on adapting the WTG/XTG/ATG approach to what works for you. For example, in a couple of spots I get no results at all from WTG, so my first pass in those spots is XTG. One more thing: I wouldn't take anybody's advice on what specific blades--or what anything--to use. YMMV: what works for them may be terrible for you. With blades and with everything else, much of the fun is exploring the various options to find what works for you.

 

[mikelz777]

Update:

I tried the Super-Max Super Platinum blades and noticed a significant difference in the sharpness and smoothness compared to the other blades I've tried so far. Blades are definitely a partial factor here. I also noticed, as someone pointed out, that with the first pass, there are some smoother areas and then stubbled areas with the stubbled areas being even less after the 2nd pass. I'm sure part of that is normal and part may point to a need to find a different or more effective shave direction or approach.

Blade angle and pressure? If anything, I need to use less pressure. Years of applying pressure with a disposable is a hard habit to break. I could probably improve on blade angle, mostly on my neck. Moving the razor every which way makes the neck angle hard to find some times.

I'm excited to be getting into the sharper, more well-reviewed blades in my sampler pack. I was pretty surprised at how much smoother the Super-Maxs were compared to the lesser blades I've used so far. I haven't even gotten to my reds, blues or Astras yet!

 

[BlackBard]

After you finish a pass, it should feel smooth in that direction. I use straight razors, and I only do 2 passes. The wtg pass takes care of most of the hair. The xtg pass cleans up from the first pass. The 3rd pass atg achieves bbs. I don't do a atg pass because it irritates my skin. 2 passes should be enough to achieve a nice smooth shave. On the few times I use a DE, I still get a very nice shave with 2 passes.

I'm with Matt, although I use a DE. I shave N/S on the first pass, followed by XTG (ear toward nose) above the jaw line and S/N on my neck for the second pass. There are a few areas on my neck, just below and to the side of my Adam's apple, where the hair grows in weird directions that always need some extra clean-up. This results in DFS to BBS.

 

[cluelessdude]

This is what I have started doing: WTG, ATG, ATG and if i have time another ATG. I get a closer shave.

 

[mikelz777]

I'm with Matt, although I use a DE. I shave N/S on the first pass, followed by XTG (ear toward nose) above the jaw line and S/N on my neck for the second pass. There are a few areas on my neck, just below and to the side of my Adam's apple, where the hair grows in weird directions that always need some extra clean-up. This results in DFS to BBS.

I may be complicating matters too much trying to chase the widely varying grain patterns. In the interest of simplifying things, I think I'll take the above approach for the first two passes and only then, face map the left over trouble spots for the 3rd pass and see how that works.