Two Differnet Kinds Of Feather Blades???

[Pauldog]

It's likely that the blades I have in the cartons of 250 are not platinum. The cartons are taped shut, but the tape is so old that it comes loose when you touch it.

By the way, the 10-packs from LetterK and Cotton Blossom were from the same place I got them, and were marked "NeW Hi-Stainless". LetterK's are now probably going to be marked "Hi-Stainless", but still platinum.

 

[joch]

Is this the same blade that classicshaving is selling?

Joch

I have received a reply directly from Feather:



This confirms what classic was told.


So here is how it seems to break down:

Hi-Stainless These are the older blades that came in the black and gray package. They are not platinum coated and are no longer produced.

NeW Platinum Hi-Stainless These are platinum coated blades that were produced along with the non-platinum blades back in the 80's. They have "Platinum Coated Blade" and "NeW HI-STAINLESS" printed on the blade. They do not have the Feather logo or "TRADE MARK" printed on them. They were discontinued along with the non-platinum blades in 1988.

Platinum Hi-Stainless These are the current production platinum coated blades in the new yellow & red package BUT with the old style printing on the blade. These are only available in the US from http://classicshaving.com, who have excellent customer service and have been VERY patient and responsive in helping to figure this out.



That seems to be the whole picture!

I have completed my single blind comparison of the old non-platinum blade versus the current production platinum coated blade. I will write up a summary and post it tomorrow along with pictures and before and after micrographs of both types of blades.

Thank you all very much for you help in getting this sorted out!

Joe

 

[JoePerri]

Now that we have established which blade is which, we now need to know if there are any differences. The manufacturer states that the newer blades are platinum coated while the older blade is not. This is the only claimed difference. What I have done is put several of the blades under my microscope to see what differences are visible. Unfortunately I don't have access to research quality instruments, just my little toy USB microscope. All images are 640x480, taken under a mix of artificial and natural light. I know there are scientists and others on this board with access to very nice instruments, perhaps one of them might like to lend a hand. I'd be happy to send blades anywhere in the world.

Here is the first blade. This is the older non-platinum blade at 60x:

We can see a few things. First a wide primary bevel with fairly coarse grind marks, then a small secondary bevel with a fine surface. The edge appears straight and undamaged. The secondary bevel is the irregular brownish band near the edge. Looks good.

Here is the second blade. This is the current production platinum coated blade.

Right away we can see a major difference. The blade has a much more specular appearance. It does seem to be coated in some kind of reflective metal. This should be the platinum coating. Both images were taken under identical lighting so the difference is on the blade. We can also observe a small primary bevel with a coarser grind. The secondary bevel is also smaller and less visible. There seems to be a hint of a tertiary bevel as well. To me this clearly shows a difference in coating as well as in grinding(sharpening).


Here is the older non-platinum blade at 200x.

This shows both bevels clearly. The scratches from the primary bevel are ground away with a much finer abrasive in the secondary bevel leaving scratches too small for my microscope to resolve. Note the lack of any "wire edge" or other blade defects. This is a well sharpened blade.

Here is the platinum coated blade at 200x.

Now we can see a real difference. The scratches(grind marks) on the primary bevel are coarser. This is fine because the cutting edge is not formed by the primary bevel. We can then see the secondary bevel and that it is also formed with a coarser abrasive BUT there is clearly a third or tertiary bevel! This is a very small bevel and has been formed with very, very fine abrasives. So fine that it appears black because the marks are smaller than the shortest wavelength of the light I'm using. This is a VERY sharp edge!


So what does this mean? Well, the difference between the two blades are this: The newer blades are platinum coated AND sharpened using a different system. The new blades seem to have a more refined, sharper edge as well.


Now the question is can one feel a difference in the blades? After all any additional sharpness or new coatings mean nothing if they don't impact the shaving experience in some way.

To test this I enlisted my wife to help me with a blind experiment with both blades. First I obtained matching 1959 Gillette Fat Boy adjustable razors. Then I had my wife mark one blade with permanent ink and then load one of each kind of blade into the razors, not telling me which blade was in which razor. I then shaved with each for eight days total, alternating razors each day. At no point did I open the doors and look at the blades. I then repeated the experiment with fresh blades but had her reverse which blade was in which razor to try to avergae out any differences in the razors themselves. On the ninth day of the second trial I used both razors, one on each side of my face. I kept notes during both trials and wrote down my conclusions before I had her reveal the blades. This was all done before I looked at the blades under the microscope.

So what did I find?

There is a difference in feel between the blades. I chose the current production platinum blade in both trials. There was a clear difference. The platinum blade was smoother with less pulling. There was NO difference in closeness or irritation. Both blades gave very close shaves with no real irritation.

How big is the difference in feel? Small. While it is noticeable it is not a huge difference. The new blades cost approximately $.75 each, the older blades from Paul about $.25. Is the difference worth three times the price? No way. Of course once Paul's are gone, they're gone! I bought 350 from him and will happily use them for the next few years. However, if you want the most comfortable shave possible from a Feather blade you must use the new sharper platinum coated blade.


Hope this helps,
Joe

 

[BarryR]

Now that we have established which blade is which, we now need to know if there are any differences...

Nice job! I was going to do a randomized blind test myself, but haven't yet. Did you 'guess' which blade was which after each shave, or just once at the end?

 

[JoePerri]

Nice job! I was going to do a randomized blind test myself, but haven't yet. Did you 'guess' which blade was which after each shave, or just once at the end?

I tried not to guess which one was which. I just kept notes and tried to keep an open mind.

Joe

 

[BarryR]

I tried not to guess which one was which. I just kept notes and tried to keep an open mind.

Joe

I was thinking about a statistical analysis, so what I meant was, did you form any conclusions on each day as a separate trial (as in, razor 'A' feels sharper today) or just one conclusion at the end of each of the two trials?

 

[JoePerri]

I see what you mean. I did not keep track of any change in each blade over time, just the difference between them. I think they both dropped equally in performance over time. The smoother blade started that way and stayed that way.

Joe

 

[duckintheface]

I'm afraid I have to challenge your single blind methodology Joe. Clearly, your wife... who knew which blade was which.... was stroking your clean shaven face more on the days when you used the platinum coated blades. This influened your conclusions regarding the superiority of the new blades.....

nawwhh... just kidding. I'm very impressed with your dedication and complete obsession with the goal of getting the best shave life has to offer.

 

[scoopster]

Just wanted to check back in on this thread. I was having much more consistent results with Pauldog's old stock Feathers. For me they were noticably less sharp but much smoother than the Platinum ones.

I've used a few more of these blades and have mixed results, some really smooth and nice while a few were pretty rough on my face. I recently switched razors which definitley has some bearing in my analysis (Merkur 38C to a Vision 2000). Overall I think these old stock Feathers are smoother but I still have an occasional one that yields a rough shave. I continue to experience that these NOS Feathers do seem to last longer for me. Platinum Feathers: 2 shaves, occasionally 3 shaves. NOS Stainless Feathers: 4 sometines even 5 shaves.

 

[TstebinsB]

For those of you interested in the DE blades, this is from my friend in Japan:

As for the feather blades, I talked with Feather Japan directly. Here's their story. Both blades are same. When Feather's hi-stainless blade came into the market in US, the package was designed with the name "New hi-stainless". And Feather Japan was requested to put the word "New" on the blade surface by the US distributors. It means one product had two kinds of the design. It had continued till around ten years ago. Now their production procedure was rationalized, and they're manufacturing only one design i.e. the blade of the right side. The current blade exported to US is same with the one for the Japanese market i.e. the right side one. I hope it explains all. If you have any further query, please ask me freely. Thank you.

 

[michael m]

Great job....now I will start to see if I can tell a difference .

 

[JoePerri]

If you can work out a way to do a blind test, I'd be very interested to hear your findings.

Joe

 

[JayKay]

I was reading somewhere not to long ago that all the new feathers produced are the same. They just write new on them and send them to america. But all the blades produced by feather now are exactly the same.

 

[TstebinsB]

I was reading somewhere not to long ago that all the new feathers produced are the same. They just write new on them and send them to america. But all the blades produced by feather now are exactly the same.

Look up to my post..

 

[JoePerri]

Sigh...

If only someone would make a detailed study of this and then create a long detailed thread with all the pertinent information including direct correspondence with the US distributor and manufacturer......

Joe

 

[TstebinsB]

Sigh...

If only someone would make a detailed study of this and then create a long detailed thread with all the pertinent information including direct correspondence with the US distributor and manufacturer......

Joe

Looking over your study, you said Feather said the newer blade is platinum-coated but not the older one? That's not what they've told me. You are correct that they use a different sharpening system for their blades. As technology has improved, so has the method of sharpening. However, both blades are platinum-coated.

 

[JoePerri]

Try starting from the first post and then reading all the subsequent posts. They are all written in a pretty clear manner. That should clear it right up for you. For the terminally impatient you might skip right to this bit:

Hi-Stainless These are the older blades that came in the black and gray package. They are not platinum coated and are no longer produced.

NeW Platinum Hi-Stainless These are platinum coated blades that were produced along with the non-platinum blades back in the 80's. They have "Platinum Coated Blade" and "NeW HI-STAINLESS" printed on the blade. They do not have the Feather logo or "TRADE MARK" printed on them. They were discontinued along with the non-platinum blades in 1988.

Platinum Hi-Stainless These are the current production platinum coated blades in the new yellow & red package BUT with the old style printing on the blade. These are only available in the US from http://classicshaving.com, who have excellent customer service and have been VERY patient and responsive in helping to figure this out.

There was a very old non-platinum blade. When they started making platinum coated blades they switched to two different blade markings. They have since unified the markings to be consistent. I, personally, have spoken directly with the manufacturer about this several times.

Joe

 

[TstebinsB]

Try starting from the first post and then reading all the subsequent posts. They are all written in a pretty clear manner. That should clear it right up for you. For the terminally impatient you might skip right to this bit:



There was a very old non-platinum blade. When they started making platinum coated blades they switched to two different blade markings. They have since unified the markings to be consistent. I, personally, have spoken directly with the manufacturer about this several times.

Joe

When you wrote "The manufacturer states that the newer blades are platinum coated while the older blade is not," I didn't know you were talking about two different newer blades. My fault for not looking through the whole thing.

 

[Pauldog]

Now I'm not sure which blade I have. I know it's older, but it may or may not have the platinum coating. It must use the older sharpening method, though.

 

[Gafer]

Try starting from the first post and then reading all the subsequent posts. They are all written in a pretty clear manner. That should clear it right up for you. For the terminally impatient you might skip right to this bit:



There was a very old non-platinum blade. When they started making platinum coated blades they switched to two different blade markings. They have since unified the markings to be consistent. I, personally, have spoken directly with the manufacturer about this several times.

Joe

This should be posted up in the Wiki. Thanks for the summary. I too was confused by all the posts.