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Tradere Is Back

Agree, but I’m somewhat disappointed about the deeper grooves on the handle. They just miss the point of the Tradere handle somehow. Doesn’t matter I’ll probably purchase one of each.
That's totally fair, but have you seen an original handle up close? There's a really good reason why we elevated the knurled surfaces.
 
Agree, but I’m somewhat disappointed about the deeper grooves on the handle. They just miss the point of the Tradere handle somehow. Doesn’t matter I’ll probably purchase one of each.
I have to admit I come down in this camp. Ive never owned one, but I really like the cool, quirky looks of the original Tradere.....thus, I’ve been following this Blackland re-release with great interest. I know that Shane says this isn’t a copy of the Tradere, rather, it is the Tradere. That may be true of the head, but from what I’ve seen and read, it’s a modern interpretation of the Tradere handle, i.e. a copy. I plan to try out the SB.
 
That may be true of the head, but from what I’ve seen and read, it’s a modern interpretation of the Tradere handle, i.e. a copy.
I don't think that's fair. The original handle changed lengths for the second gen. The original heads changed dimensions for the second gen. Are those still real Traderes? Or are they copies of the first gen?

As far as I'm concerned, the new Tradere has the same dimensions of the original, I have the rights to use the Tradere mark as I wish, and we're actually bringing back the very first Tradere design. On top of that, we're fixing the handle. If that doesn't make it a real Tradere, I don't know what will.
 
I am on the fence about this one. On one hand, I am very curious, on the other hand 118 grams sound too heavy for my taste.
 
I don't think that's fair. The original handle changed lengths for the second gen. The original heads changed dimensions for the second gen. Are those still real Traderes? Or are they copies of the first gen?

As far as I'm concerned, the new Tradere has the same dimensions of the original, I have the rights to use the Tradere mark as I wish, and we're actually bringing back the very first Tradere design. On top of that, we're fixing the handle. If that doesn't make it a real Tradere, I don't know what will.
Obviously everything Tradere ever made was a real Tradere. And, the Blackland Tradere will be a real Tradere. I only brought it up because you made it a point to emphasize (literally, with the definite article “the” in italics) that the Blackland Tradere will be the Tradere, and not a copy. I don‘t want to get bogged down in semantics, but that usage implies that what follows “the” is something specific and and singular in existence.

When you then say you’re fixing the handle, there are clearly some changes being made to it (to make it better, in your estimation). The way I would view that is that it will be a new and improved Tradere handle, a very close facsimile to the two original Tradere handles.....perhaps not a copy then, but maybe not the Tradere handle either.

Either way, I’m psyched about what you’re doing and can’t wait to place my order. I’ve been anxiously anticipating this release since the day you originally announced it.

Cheers.
 
When you then say you’re fixing the handle, there are clearly some changes being made to it (to make it better, in your estimation). The way I would view that is that it will be a new and improved Tradere handle, a very close facsimile to the two original Tradere handles.....perhaps not a copy then, but maybe not the Tradere handle either.
You're not wrong. I realize we're splitting hairs here, but you can make the argument that Tradere toning down the aggressiveness was fixing it to make it better. So I see this as just the next evolution of that. But it's still a Tradere.

I think it's also important to note that saying it's the Tradere, italicized or not, is to hammer home the point that this doesn't just sort of look like the Tradere and we're not ripping the design off. I'm paying royalties and doing it the right way by the going through the trouble of laser scanning and rebuilding all the components (massive PITA). The original Tradere founder has signed off on everything. If I wanted to, I could drastically change the head geometry or do whatever I want to the designs, but I've chosen to keep it true to the original and really bring this thing back. Not make a copy or slap "Tradere" on a similar razor. So that's why I use that language; it's because I believe it.

Regardless, it doesn't really matter, ultimately. I think you can make a strong case for either to be true so it's really just academic at this point. Although I do love this kind of lukewarm debate so I appreciate you playing the other side. :)
 
I don't think that's fair. The original handle changed lengths for the second gen. The original heads changed dimensions for the second gen. Are those still real Traderes? Or are they copies of the first gen?

As far as I'm concerned, the new Tradere has the same dimensions of the original, I have the rights to use the Tradere mark as I wish, and we're actually bringing back the very first Tradere design. On top of that, we're fixing the handle. If that doesn't make it a real Tradere, I don't know what will.

I own a first generation OC Tradere. I was one of the very first buyers in fact and Richard even sent me a razor with the number that I asked for. Mine is in beautiful condition and I even have the suitcase like box.

I don't know if that history gives my opinion any more weight than anyone elses, but that's the background. And as far as I'm concerned, what Shane is making is a Tradere. Of course it is and for all the reasons that he's stated.

He is doing the right thing by calling it a Blackland Tradere. By doing so, he has put his own name on his creation and paid homage to the first maker. In my world, nothing could be more honest, straightforward or just plain right.
 
I own a first generation OC Tradere. I was one of the very first buyers in fact and Richard even sent me a razor with the number that I asked for. Mine is in beautiful condition and I even have the suitcase like box.

I don't know if that history gives my opinion any more weight than anyone elses, but that's the background. And as far as I'm concerned, what Shane is making is a Tradere. Of course it is and for all the reasons that he's stated.

He is doing the right thing by calling it a Blackland Tradere. By doing so, he has put his own name on his creation and paid homage to the first maker. In my world, nothing could be more honest, straightforward or just plain right.
I‘ve been giving the whole Tradere issue a bit (read - a lot) of thought and at last I can have a clear mind as to my issue with the whole affair. I fully accept that this razor is a Tradere and manufactured by Blackland. Where my issue lies is with the terminology Gen 1 & Gen 2. As far as Richard was concerned he closed the Gen 1 and that version should remain closed. Gen 2 is a bit different, that model was still current when production closed so there is a case for the proposed SB version to remain as a Gen 2. Personally I would like the first release of the Blackland Tradere to be Gen 3 where the OC is known to be more efficient than the SB.
 
I‘ve been giving the whole Tradere issue a bit (read - a lot) of thought and at last I can have a clear mind as to my issue with the whole affair. I fully accept that this razor is a Tradere and manufactured by Blackland. Where my issue lies is with the terminology Gen 1 & Gen 2. As far as Richard was concerned he closed the Gen 1 and that version should remain closed. Gen 2 is a bit different, that model was still current when production closed so there is a case for the proposed SB version to remain as a Gen 2. Personally I would like the first release of the Blackland Tradere to be Gen 3 where the OC is known to be more efficient than the SB.
I think it's easy to get lost in the details of what should be called what and debate ship of Theseus type things, but we have to remember that the entire point of this project was to bring back a beloved razor that people still covet. So creating a new Gen 3 doesn't accomplish that goal.

Regarding the end of Gen 1, remember that this was 2012. This is the early days of modern razors. The R41 had just come out, ATT starts machining razors this year, but not much else is out there. Wet shavers are mostly using vintage razors or modern 34Cs, DE89s, etc. Aggressive razors weren't really a thing yet. So Richard's Gen 1 OC was seen as way too aggressive for tastes at the time and he dialed it down for Gen 2. In the last eight years, razor trends have changed drastically and there is now a market for more aggressive designs. I suspect the Gen 1 OC will fit right in alongside popular mid-aggressive razors like the Blackbird, but we'll just have to find out over the coming weeks.
 
I think it's easy to get lost in the details of what should be called what and debate ship of Theseus type things, but we have to remember that the entire point of this project was to bring back a beloved razor that people still covet. So creating a new Gen 3 doesn't accomplish that goal.

Regarding the end of Gen 1, remember that this was 2012. This is the early days of modern razors. The R41 had just come out, ATT starts machining razors this year, but not much else is out there. Wet shavers are mostly using vintage razors or modern 34Cs, DE89s, etc. Aggressive razors weren't really a thing yet. So Richard's Gen 1 OC was seen as way too aggressive for tastes at the time and he dialed it down for Gen 2. In the last eight years, razor trends have changed drastically and there is now a market for more aggressive designs. I suspect the Gen 1 OC will fit right in alongside popular mid-aggressive razors like the Blackbird, but we'll just have to find out over the coming weeks.

I somehow never envisioned a reference to the Ship of Theseus in this discussion! Brilliant! Especially brilliant in discussing this in the context of succeeding generations. Well done Shane, well done! I wish I had thought of it.

If I were more clever I suppose I would be able to come up with a pun involving paying homage to Apollo razors. Regrettably that's beyond my abilities or at least the abilities of the person I think I am. The metaphysics of identity at play.
 
Hi - I know its difficulty but in terms of aggressivenes - can you tell me where this would fit compared to
1. Vector
2. Blackbird
3. Sabre

I know it is not a SE but I own all three and I want to know if I will be able to use it daily.
FYI - I can't use blackbird or sabre daily (even with mild plate) with 3 passes.
 
Hi - I know its difficulty but in terms of aggressivenes - can you tell me where this would fit compared to
1. Vector
2. Blackbird
3. Sabre

I know it is not a SE but I own all three and I want to know if I will be able to use it daily.
FYI - I can't use blackbird or sabre daily (even with mild plate) with 3 passes.
Sure! It's hard to directly compare so I think the best way to think about it is in tiers of aggressiveness. I think intra-tier comparisons get difficult with different blade types. For the Vector, assume Feather Pro or Schick (guarded blades would drop it a bit and Pro Supers might bump it into the next tier).

Least Aggressive: Sabre L1

Roughly tied for middle: Sabre L2, Vector, Tradere SB

Most Aggressive: Blackbird, Tradere OC


It's interesting that you find the Sabre L1 and L2 to be not daily drivers. If I had to guess, this might be a blade issue because the L1 is quite mild and the L2 is somewhat similar to your Vector. Your assessment of the Sabre gives me pause here, but I would generally say that I recommend the Tradere SB as a razor to use daily for most wet shavers.
 
Thank you - also I think it might be technique and weight issue as I find vector much easier to control and get a better shave than saber.
 
I have a question for you Shane. My impression of how razors have changed over the past decade or so, is that more recently, blade exposure rather than blade gap has become more important in the regulation of a razor's aggressiveness. My understanding of the Blackbird, for example, is that it has a fairly small blade gap and it might be considered aggressive because of blade exposure rather than gap. Looking at pictures of the Tradere OC, it seems to have a larger blade gap than the Blackbird. Would you say that the Tradere OC is an older style razor that gets its aggression from blade gap rather than blade exposure, or would you classify the Tradere OC as aggressive due to its blade exposure? I'd imagine it's a combination of both, but I still wanted your opinion on the subject. Thank you!
 
I have a question for you Shane. My impression of how razors have changed over the past decade or so, is that more recently, blade exposure rather than blade gap has become more important in the regulation of a razor's aggressiveness. My understanding of the Blackbird, for example, is that it has a fairly small blade gap and it might be considered aggressive because of blade exposure rather than gap. Looking at pictures of the Tradere OC, it seems to have a larger blade gap than the Blackbird. Would you say that the Tradere OC is an older style razor that gets its aggression from blade gap rather than blade exposure, or would you classify the Tradere OC as aggressive due to its blade exposure? I'd imagine it's a combination of both, but I still wanted your opinion on the subject. Thank you!
I think this is less about an older or newer approach to razor design and more about how perception has changed. People used to be completely fixated on blade gap as the only metric in determining a razor's performance. That was always wrong, but I think it took a while for that information to take hold in the community. Design has always been about both gap and exposure. More to your point, I don't think there is a real shift toward a design focus on exposure over gap. The only razors I can think of with an unusual combination of gap and exposure are the Blackbird and Timeless Bronze.
 
Well mine is ordered. Got the safety bar version as I have an original gen 2 Tradere. And mainly because OC destroys my face lol.

Can’t wait Shane. Can’t freaking wait!


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