Tomo

[SparkyLB]

I recently took a somewhat new Bergischer Lowe through a complete progression including resetting the bevel and the shave was a solid 8.75. Wanting to improve, I decided to use a different Tomo Nagura the next day. It's tough to tell if it's the edge is the same or better, if better, it's by a negligible amount.

I have 3 different Tomo Naguras. I have two questions but think I know the answer to the first.
1. Is it necessary to take a newly stropped blade after Tomo Nagura down to Koma Nagura before trying a different Tomo? I think the answer is no, but I'd be happy to be corrected.
2. Is the a "most proper" way of applying Tomo Nagura? I've used somewhat thick (never dry) pastes and diluted until at water only. I've taken slurries where the Tomo floats on top like cirrus clouds, and many iterations between the two.

Is there a "typical" way you guys typically do this? Assuming good geometry, an even bevel and a taut-stretched thread line when looking directly down on the edge.

Any tips would be appreciated--all while understanding that you have to DO this stuff to become more proficient. I know pretty confidently this is a battle between me and the edge, and perhaps coaching isn't in the cards--but I thought I'd ask just the same.

Thank you as always.

 

[cugel]

I have not had good luck with thick slurries for finishing. Of course that is with my tools. I can kill an edge with thick slurry. I tend to start with a bit heavier than skim milk then go from there. Some combos dont respond well to over-dilution or plain water either! I have only one stone that is, in my hands pure water finisher. It is a fairly soft relatively old hand sawn number. I tried everything and water wins. Of course it could be "auto-slurry" too. Try everything.

 

[SparkyLB]

Thank you, Cugel.

 

[camoloc]

I like diluted slurries when running a progression.

I clean and strop between each stone use. I like to feel what's happening to the blade.

upon finishing........I might even go water only laps on the shobu I use.

camo

 

[Titleist]

My two cents:

By the time I get to a finishing tomo, I use a thinner slurry for two reasons: 1. Getting a thicker slurry would probably take forever, 2. It would required more pressure thus gouging my Koppa and 3. Would lend itself (because of more pressure used) to a friable slurry with particles that are undesirable for finishing. When I first started out, I used too much pressure on a finishing Toma and did all of the above.

I have lost more edges at this stage than at any other.

Some days, I finish on Koma and then move right to laps on water only.

Just one Man's experience.

 

[SparkyLB]

I like diluted slurries when running a progression.

I clean and strop between each stone use. I like to feel what's happening to the blade.

upon finishing........I might even go water only laps on the shobu I use.

camo

Thanks, Camo. As do I, on all of your points.

 

[SparkyLB]

My two cents:

By the time I get to a finishing tomo, I use a thinner slurry for two reasons: 1. Getting a thicker slurry would probably take forever, 2. It would required more pressure thus gouging my Koppa and 3. Would lend itself (because of more pressure used) to a friable slurry with particles that are undesirable for finishing. When I first started out, I used too much pressure on a finishing Toma and did all of the above.

I have lost more edges at this stage than at any other.

Some days, I finish on Koma and then move right to laps on water only.

Just one Man's experience.

Thank you, sir. I develop my Tomo slurry very slowly, sometimes over 10 minutes spent on the task. I’m careful to the point where I have yet to scar my base stone with a Tomo.

As this gnawing thought has me rolling my eyes, I think I am forced to accept that there is no ONE way to accomplish this. Looks like it’s going to be time and the experience gleaned from expending it.

 

[Steve56]

1. not if the stone is reasonably fast and the edge is straight and even - tour loupe will tell you the last part.
2. I finish on very dilute slurry unless the edge is too aggressive off that particular stone/tomo combination. Typically I can see the edge through the slurry on the first couple of strokes.

 

[SparkyLB]

Thank you, Steve. Your answer and others suggest that I am using too much pressure on perhaps too rich a slurry. I will lighten up on both counts and report back.

 

[HazMat Shaver]

Yep. Im with Steve. My skurry is very thin. Almost not. And i use a diamond plate to make slurry from my base stone. Not a tomo. I got a few tomovand the diamond plate slurry just works for me.

You got to keep trying things.

 

[SparkyLB]

Yep. Im with Steve. My skurry is very thin. Almost not. And i use a diamond plate to make slurry from my base stone. Not a tomo. I got a few tomovand the diamond plate slurry just works for me.

You got to keep trying things.

Thank you.

 

[Steve56]

too much pressure on perhaps too rich a slurry

Yep.

Good JNats cut fast, they don’t need a lot of slurry.

Too much pressure on a razor means pulling edges.

 

[buca3152]

What you can also try is to work the slurry with another blade to get it closer to finish consistency and then use the blade you are working on. Slurry size for finishing is about the size of two quarters if you bunched it together.

 

[Gamma]

1. Is it necessary to take a newly stropped blade after Tomo Nagura down to Koma Nagura before trying a different Tomo? I think the answer is no, but I'd be happy to be corrected.

My preferred way to see what a Tomo/Honzan combo is going to do, is to progress up to that stage from some prior point. Typically, I would go back further than Koma, if I was testing a Tomo. It's like, if I am trying coffees, I get the best read on each one when I start with a clean cup.
But there are no rules and anyone can do whatever works for them. There is no 'necessary' protocol. It's a personal choice.

2. Is the a "most proper" way of applying Tomo Nagura? I've used somewhat thick (never dry) pastes and diluted until at water only. I've taken slurries where the Tomo floats on top like cirrus clouds, and many iterations between the two.

Is there a "typical" way you guys typically do this?

I would say that there is no 'most proper' method, but using a thick dry slurry/mud/paste would usually be 'improper' for finishing.
Try stuff, see how it works, see how you work with it, stick with what works best. Continuing to try new things, and re-trying things that didn't work before can keep the creative juices flowing.

 

[Jakebullet]

I only have one jnat, it finishes best for me with fifty or so laps on a milky tomo slurry with no water dilution.