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To go back to the 1.5k or not, that is the question

Ah, good to hear an expert say that. Here I've assumed I am among people who get it perfect on the bevel setter, and everything else is a couple of superficial passes.

That's not how it works for me. I can get it really wonderful on the bevel-setter, shave-worthy (yes, I've tried that shave), but still find that I need to do significant work as I go up the grits. I like to think of it as like magnification (or higher energies in particle colliders, if that resonates). The more fine-grained your measuring, the more subtly you can examine things.
Same and I am becoming more comfortable with that instead of assuming I am just doing it wrong. I am very confident in my bevel sets if I am going back that far, I don't want to do that again to keep spine wear down. After remembering to start inking my edges, I realised I simply wasn't spending enough time in the middle. I kept thinking I had to move on or I would be over doing it.

The one thing that that brings up though is whether having 2 or 3 different mid range stones isn't more beneficial that collecting dozens of finishers? Would it make sense to put the razor on my 5k and decide it is working too slow for that razor and switch to a 3k instead of assuming I need to go back to the bevel setter? I am still fighting spending $100 on an 8k that is only going to see less that 20 laps whereas, mid-range stones are more affordable.
 
I am still fighting spending $100 on an 8k that is only going to see less that 20 laps whereas, mid-range stones are more affordable.

I had the same thought when first buying stones. If you end up doing a lot of honing, a good 4k and 8k come in handy. 4k is great for resetting shave-ready edges, and 8k is great for removing the edge from a finishing stone before using a different finisher.

I, personally, would not invest in more than one 4k and 8k until I had tried a few different finishers.
 
The one thing that that brings up though is whether having 2 or 3 different mid range stones isn't more beneficial that collecting dozens of finishers?
Collecting dozens of finishers tends to be a "want to" rather than a "need to."
I am still fighting spending $100 on an 8k that is only going to see less that 20 laps whereas, mid-range stones are more affordable.
If you have a finisher that's capable of refining a 4k edge, sure. Many aren't. A quality 8k is kind of essential in that case.

I think you mentioned you have lapping film, too? What grits?
 
Collecting dozens of finishers tends to be a "want to" rather than a "need to."

If you have a finisher that's capable of refining a 4k edge, sure. Many aren't. A quality 8k is kind of essential in that case.

I think you mentioned you have lapping film, too? What grits?
That's why I am holding out. I have 1 and 3 micron. I have had good luck using the 1 followed by my La Lune, but I guess what I am actually doing, from what I am being told here, is dialling the 1 micron edge back with the slate. That begs the question, should I be spending more time on the 1 micron so I only do a few laps on the slate?
 
Well, either slate is improving the 1 micron edge or it isn't (sounds like it is). Have you shave tested both? That's a useful data point and really the only one that matters.

If it were me I'd be looking for a very consistently polished bevel off the film, l and then see what the slate is doing, both under magnification and on your face. That should tell you how much time to spend on the slate. If you can calibrate your visual evidence with the shaving results, you should be able to replicate that on the next razor.
 
If it were me I'd be looking for a very consistently polished bevel off the film
That's a good point. I have shaved off of it, but with different razors. I have been so happy with the edges I am getting off the slate that I hadn't thought about it because I was only doing the passing minimum that I thought I was supposed to do on the 1 micron. I could spend more time on it and test shave, I have just the razor for that...
 
You are missing the point and way over complicating your honing.

Your bevel is not fully set.

You must fully set the bevel. Likely the heel needs correction and is keeping half of the edge off the stone. Unless you drastically modify you honing stroke, the heel must be reprofiled to move the heel corner away from the stabilizer and get the whole edge on the stone.

Once the bevel is fully set, look straight down on the edge, (if you see any reflection, the bevels are not fully meeting), then it is just a matter of removing the previous stone’s stria with the next stone in the progression without messing up the edge.

1um film is about 16k so you are making a substantial jump from 5K. It can be done but easy to muff in less experienced hands. You only need to spend as much time on the mid grits as it takes to remove the previous grits stria. Stay on the 1um until all the 5k stria is gone.

Forget the Slate, at best it is 6k, maybe a bit higher if you are lucky, but introducing slurry adds a whole bunch more variables and at best you are going backwards in the progression.

First learn to hone, learn to fully set a bevel and more importantly learn how to recognize a fully set bevel. If you do not have a fool proof method, you are wasting your time and good steel.

If you are worried about needless spine wear, why are you learning to hone without tape?
 
I am actually trying to simplify things based on everything typed here. First is the slate, I get it it's not as fine as stated. Therefor, I am going to use it as some here recommend to tone down an edge, without slurry, AFTER trying the film progression. It's a finisher, I need to treat it like that.

Second is the bevel set. I know it's hard to believe, but other than screwing up the heel I managed to correct the bevel with a lot of work do to the wonky geometry on this razor. I made some mistakes, but I checked and check before I moved on. Shined a light at the edge, used the microscope and inked the edge. I was in agreement that I need to lightly use the bevel setter after fixing the heel, but we were starting to get to the meat of my problem which was not understanding how long I have to spend on the mid-range stone. I am working with a razor that is clearly too much for my current skill level, but I am making it work at the expense of some avoidable damage in more experienced hands.

I admit, I am going to have to either keep using films or cave and buy more stones. Maybe the 8k does make sense if I am going to then finish with 1 micron film or an equivalent stone. Then, maybe, dial back the edge with the slate LAST.
 
“This statement need a qualifier. What grit standard are we talking about? ANSI? JIS? Shapton?
And the OP has 3um film too, so he's not jumping straight from 5k to 1um.”


Thought he had .3um film.

ANSI? JIS? Shapton does not matter, I doubt anyone can tell a 14,000 grit edge from a 16,000 grit edge, when hone in experienced hands.


But it all does not matter until the OP gets the whole edge on the stone, and learn a foolproof method of recognizing a fully set bevel.

The OP is all over the map (not unusual for new a new honer), taking on a razor grossly in need of repair before it can be honed and choosing to hone it without tape causing more wear and more issues.

He needs to take a page from TexNat’s (Synthetic Progression Documentation Step by Step) thread and match his bevels to Tex’s.

Do not try to re-invent the wheel, do what others have done successfully, and first, learn to get a repeatable shaving edge, then take on natural hones and problem razors and learn how to make repairs.
 
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