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The World Shave Off Showdown


Hello to all the members

Well here we go again! Another Shave Off Showdown only this one is a whole lot bigger than the Aristocrat Showdown I did a few months back. We call this one “ The World Shave Off Showdown “ and just like it’s title we’ve got a group of razors from around the world going for various titles and of course the ultimate world championship win.

This is an idea I had back when I was just about finished with the last Aristocrat Showdown Shave Off and all the positive feedback I was getting from members. I was a little hesitant to take on such a challenge knowing that this would be so much bigger than the last one and take much longer to complete. After much thought and consulting with some of the members on here that I call my friends I decided to do it. So we had to set some perimeters for this event, as there are literally thousands of razors out there and many of them could be in this Showdown based on their shaving capability’s but that would be a task that would probably take me a year to complete and we wanted to focus on just a certain group of razors both modern and vintage.

So far 2 members and myself have contributed all the razors for this Shave Off from our own personal collections. There are a couple of razors that we’d like to have included that none of us currently have in our dens. For example I sold my Timeless SS .68 OC as it wasn’t being used but we’d really like to have one for the shave off and all I’d need would be the baseplate as I have a SS .95 and could just change the baseplate.

Also before I go any further the 3 of us that includes @Shavemd aka Mark and
@loot aka James and myself Frank. Would like to say that we
want to express right from the start that if any member would like to add some input and ideas to this thread that might make this Shave Off even better we very much would welcome your comments as long as they are constructive. We’d like to keep the drama to a minimum and please no offensive or condescending remarks just because another member may have a different opinion than yours. Hey we all like a good debate but let’s try to keep this thread civil and drama free please!

We all had such a good time in the last shave off and I can’t begin to tell you how many members messaged me saying how much they enjoyed the thread as well as all those that expressed in the thread. So let’s go into this one with the same lighthearted friendly attitude and just have fun with it. We also encourage any member who knows and is willing to share the history of a razor we are using in the Shave Off with all the members that would be great and much appreciated. We’d also like to hear about your personal shave experiences with any of the razors that are being used but try to save them for the day that the one you want to comment on is actually in one of the legs of the Shave Off. This way we don’t get ahead of ourselves.

So this is what we’ve decided to do and of course we know that we aren’t going to please everyone as a lot of very good shaving razors have been left out of this World Shave Off Showdown.

There will be two categories involved in this Shave Off and they are as follows:

1. Only high-end modern razors, rare or hard to find vintage DE safety razors will be competing against each other in this category. This category will also be divided into 4 sub categories to make things fair.

a. Mildly efficient

b. Moderately efficient

c. Efficient

d. Very efficient

2. The Next category is much simpler as it includes both modern and rare or hard to find vintage adjustable and TTO razors. They will be all grouped together. We thought about separating the TTO’s from the adjustable razors but we could only think of two TTO razors that would be competing in this and both are very capable of holding their own against the Adjustable razors. Again if any of you can think of other razors that meet our criteria then please mention them or send the razor in before we get to deep in the Shave Off.

Also if you do decide to send a razor please create a slip with your screen and real name on it along with the model razor your sending in. If it’s in a case then just put the slip in the case if it’s not cased please wrap it and mark it. I will have a system to keep razors separated so when it’s time for one to go back to it’s owner it will be easy on all parties. Also if you are Shipping a razor to me for the Shave Off and they are rare or very expensive razors please put the right amount of insurance on it if anything should happen to it in it’s journey to me or on it’s way back to you and please we ask you pay for two way shipping with a return label included if you want your razor represented in the Shave Off. Also rest assured I have a case of OCD when it comes to taking care of my razors so I’ll do the same with anybody's razor that are sent in to me! I will take good care of it. If you have special instructions on how you want your razor cleaned up after a round of the Shave Off then please include it on your sheet you send in.

Again we had to set perimeters on what razors were going to be in the Shave Off and especially the modern ones. So we decided to only use modern High end razors or hard to find or rare vintage razors in this Shave Off. I think a lot of members including myself always wonder what does that razor shave like or wow that razor is stunning and I’d like to add one to my den but can’t find them etc etc. I know for many of us it may have taken us years to acquire your own personal “ Holy Grail “ razor I know it has for me. So this Shave off can at least give you some insight into what it’s like to shave with one of these modern high end or rare or hard to find vintage razors. I know I'm excited to shave with some of them. Each will have it's own story and I’m a sure members who know their history about the model of interest will educate us all.

To qualify: A modern razor has to sell for $150 and up. I know that some of your beloved razors like Rockwell’s, Karve , Mamba, Slims, Tech’s etc. etc. do not meet this price point or are not rare or hard to fins and did not make the list to be in the Shave Off but like I said we had to draw a line somewhere and there are so many threads about some of the razors I mentioned that hopefully you have lots of other resources to help you find out info on the particular razor that is not in this Shave OFF.
To qualify: A Vintage razor has to be either rare or very hard to find so price point is not as important in this category. So we welcome any additional Vintage razors that qualify that we don’t have on the list.

So here is the list of modern and vintage DE Razors that will be in the World Shave Off Showdown and the sub category that they will be placed in. NOTE: The razors we are missing or would like to have in the Shave Off are marked in blue. So please feel free to contact me if you’d like to send yours in and help us fill in the list. For reference again all the vintage razors listed are either rare or hard to find and if you think we are missing any very important razors please feel free to make suggestions.

1. Timeless Bronze OC – Efficient

2. Timeless Bronze SB – Mildly Efficient

3. Timeless SS .95 gap DC - Very Efficient

4. Timeless SS . 68 gap SB or OC – Mildly or Moderately efficient depending on OC or SB – Don’t have one!

5. Charcoal Goods Level 1 SS – Mildly efficient

6. Charcoal Goods Level 2 Brass – Efficient

7. Charcoal Goods Level 3 Brass OC – Very Efficient

8. Blackland Blackbird SS SB – Very Efficient.

9. Blackland Blackbird SS OC – Very Efficient.

10. Wolfman WR1 SS .68 DC – Mildly Efficient.

11. Wolfman WR1 SS .74 Ti - Moderately Efficient.

12. Wolfman WR1 SS .80 DC - Efficient

14. Wolfman WR1 SS .86 OC – Very Efficient

15. Wolfman WR1 SS .94 SB – Very Efficient - It may show up !

16. Paradigm 17 4 SB - Efficient

17. Paradigm Ti 1 – Very Efficient

18. Paradigm Ti 11 – Efficient – Don’t have one.

17. Gillette New Deluxe Big Boy Chromium – Efficient

18. Gillette RFB Chromium – Efficient –Don’t have one.

19. Muhle R41 2011 – Very Efficient.

20. ATT Copper H plate – Efficient

21. ATT SS R plate – Moderately Efficient – Don’t have one.

22. Darwin – SS any model DE - Don’t have one

23. Gibbs # 14 – Efficient

Below is the list of adjustable and TTO razors we have so far. There are others we’d like to add to the list but these are the razors we currently have and a short wish list of some we’d like to see in the Shave Off. If you have any suggestions on razors you’d like to see added or if you have one to lend to us for the Shave Off then please make a suggestion or pm me about why you think it should be in the Shave Off. Please remember we had to eliminate some good shaving razors off this list. For example commonly found favorites like Superspeeds and Slims were eliminated from the list so please understand we have to draw the line somewhere. So it’s either modern high end, vintage rare or hard to find razors that are eligible for this Shave Off and we apologize if your favorite razor is not included. I know I keep repeating this message but I just want everyone to understand and be clear on this.

1. Gillette Red dot Fatboy

2. Gillette Chrome Toggle

3. Gillette F4 Toggle

4. Gillette 1st Gen British Aristocrat OC #15

5. Gillette 2nd Gen British Aristocrat SB

6. Gillette Fatboy

7. Gillette President

8. Rex Ambassador

8. Gibbs #17 Adjustable

9. Apollo Ben Hur Adjustable

10. Apollo Mikron Adjustable - don’t have one

11. Vintage NOS Merkur Progress Solingen Adjustable

12. Rocnel Sailor Adjustable – don’t have

13 Eclipse Red Ring

I’ll be using various blades in different razors, as you all know some blades just don’t work in certain razors even though they work in others. I’ll also be using various soaps and creams so I can mix it up a bit and also give my opinion on the soap or cream I’m using that day. Brushes will also vary but I mostly use Badger and Boar.

Last but not least I’ve decided based on a lot of requests from members to use and include a “ How to do sheet “ and coordinating drawings I did showing the “ Skin Stretch Short Stroke Technique “ I use which was inspired by a technique I learned from an old Italian barber that was a master with a straight razor. I then modified the technique to use with safety razors and added a few things. I’ve found that using this technique I’ve been able to not only cut down the number of passes to lets say get a BBS, DFS or CCS but I’ve been able to tame some very efficient razors that many would call or use the term “ Very Aggressive” I welcome any comments on the technique and hope you enjoy my labor of love. I’m glad to help anyone who needs help if you have an interest in learning what I will refer to moving on as my SSSST. I'm here to answer a simple question or if any of you would like me to send you a copy of the Tech sheet and drawings sent to them I'm glad to oblige . Just please be patient as I still work almost every day so mu response time is not always immediate so it may take me a day or two to get it to you.

Also I have categorized BBS shaves which I will be using do describe the shave I get from each razor and each Shave Off and for some members I know they don’t agree on the number system I use which is a BBS level 1, BBS Level 2 and the elusive BBS level 3. For some I know you’d rather it be about how long the BBS shave lasts. For example a 8hr, 10hr or 12hr etc. which I get an also agree on but for me I’ve like many have had all those multiple hour long BBS shaves but if I do a cotton test after a shave I can be more accurate in my description of the results of the Shave OFF immediately after the Shave Off that day rather than have to wait however many hours later. For example hand feel alone does not always reveal what level BBS shave is achieved where as the cotton test doesn’t lie. I have done the test so many times that I can now usually tell by hand feel only what level I've achieved because I’ve become super sensitive to each level but to be clear it took a few years and a lot of shaves to get there.

Also Mark, James and myself would like to thank you all for reading this World Shave Off thread and again we welcome all your comments and suggestions. I’d like to get all the razors that will be used in the Shave Off at least on this list by the end of the week as I’ll begin the actual Shave Off on either Sunday or on Monday and I’m going to try and do a new one every 2 to 3 days max as I’d like to have a decent amount of beard growth for each Shave Off.

So to conclude we will wait for your comments and suggestions!

Great shaves!

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Oh yeah baby! Let's kick this thing off! Thanks for taking the time to do this Frank. I have a feeling this thread is going to take some time to follow. I'm certainly looking forward to it. This will be fun.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

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I have a Timeless 68 OC baseplate I'll be happy to send, pm me your address and I'll send it to you. I also have a NEW Deluxe Belmont/Criterion (1931) in gold and a '36' Crat I'll send your way if you like.
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This is going to be a fun ride. Thanks for doing this Frank. So many of these razors are so hard to find, I cant wait to see how things stack up. The Us vs Brit had me reading and learning everyday this should be even better. Have fun doing this, I know I will.
Another great idea. IllI be watching avidly once again. Hope to learn a lot from all the comments and input. Thanks for doing it
Oh Frank, this is going to be AMAZING. I have just ordered a Timeless Bronze SB, so Ill be interested to see how that performs/compares. Im also considering buying a Charcoal Goods Level 2 brass, so that will be eye opening too!

Cant wait.

I do have a Timeless .68 SB that I ordered and used only once, but its all packaged back up and ready to sell next week on BST!
I forgot to ask all the members watching this thread what category would you like me to start with? Either the DE 2 and 3 piece razors or the TTO and Adjustables?
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Oh yeah baby! Let's kick this thing off! Thanks for taking the time to do this Frank. I have a feeling this thread is going to take some time to follow. I'm certainly looking forward to it. This will be fun.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

James I’d like to not only thank you for the awesome razors you’ve contributed to make this Shave Off happen but for all the helpful input in setting it up my friend.
I can’t wait to take that Red Dot and Chrome Toggle for a spin!
Well you got one nice razor coming in the Timeless Bronze and you can’t go wrong with the Charcoal Level 2.

One of the members was kind enough to offer his .68 baseplate so I’m good. Good luck with the sale!

Thanks Bud. Like I said I ordered the Timeless Bronze with the SB. I may order the OC baseplate - depending on findings in this thread :)

Love this place. Oh, and you an I have an unfinished (great) discussion to complete at some point on our Aristocrat obsession.
Lol yes we do have to continue our discussion on the Crats! Pm me and we can exchange info and maybe have a phone chat.

Oh and wait till the Bronze OC comes up in the Shave Off as it is definitely completely different than the SB.

Great shaves my friend

Thanks Bud. Is the Timeless Bronze OC as aggressive as the Crat #15? That was a little to rough for me remember. I hate my face/beard sometimes :lol1:


I didnt know
Staff member
Is the Timeless Bronze OC as aggressive as the Crat #15? That was a little to rough for me remember.

Want to quickly and easily smooth out an early Gillette TTO?


Two strips of electrical tape smoothed out my 1940 Gillette Regent instantly.

See my post below;

The blade tray is flat and as the razor closes the blade tray rises forcing the blade against the doors giving it its curve.

The two very small points marked in red are the only places the blade is clamped. Only at each point, not between each point. Basically a corner of the blade tray and again at the edge of the door.

In the next picture, the lower green line would be roughly where the blade is when the razor is fully closed. The upper green line is roughly the inside surface of the doors. The space between is airspace. No blade support.

@AimlessWanderer Heres another example of The Squiggly Green Line™ lol.

Because that razor only has two very small points for bearing surfaces of the blade between tray and doors, combined with the more than generous blade exposure it offers, when I use that razor the blade can chatter. This is also why I believe these particular early Gillette TTO's to be so much more audible or noisy shavers. The center of the blade chatters against the inside of the doors and the head basically acts like an echo chamber.

The result of the tape strips was to eliminate that airspace, and it works to a point but the blade tray is still essentially flat.
James I’d like to not only thank you for the awesome razors you’ve contributed to make this Shave Off happen but for all the helpful input in setting it up my friend.
I can’t wait to take that Red Dot and Chrome Toggle for a spin!
My pleasure friend. As you know, we have similar tastes in razors wo it will be interesting to hear your opinion on my gear to see how well it meshes with my thoughts.

FWIW, I vote you start with adjustable. I know you love your Gibbs but I've put two American stalwarts in your hands. Let me go ahead and get the win in that category and the you can start on the mild stuff. Save the Very Efficient category for last. That way my gear will bookend the events with wins. Plus it will give me time with the Grand Champion WR1 .94SB before I have to ship it out to you.

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I loved the US vs British Aristocrat shave off, can't wait and subscribed. I'd like to see the TTOs 1st as well

And thank you!!
Ok will do!


Ok so heres's how I'm doing it. I'll start with the Adjustable razors as you and Mark suggested and I have to say I was leaning in that direction myself. What I'm going to do with the Red Dot and the Chrome is pit them against the normal Fatboy and the normal F4 Toggle. So Red Dot vs Regular Fatboy and Chrome Toggle vs F4 Toggle. This will be good and there was a thread asking how the Red Dot shaves compared to the Regular Fatboy so I'm killing two birds with one stone! Also can get these two rare razors back to you unless of course they both win their first round. Then they got to move on to the next round. [emoji38]

Also, the Red Dot and the Chrome Toggle are freshly replated. They were both done by RazorPlate. The Chrome was the only Chrome Toggle CAP ever disassembled. He did a video and put it up on YouTube. It was also the only Chrome Toggle RazorPlate did. Unfortunately, the Red Dot was unacceptable when I received it from Chris. He didn't want to correct it and refunded my money. I swallowed my pride, ate some crow, and sent it to Matt at Razor Emporium. I have not used the Chrome since it was plated. I used the Red Dot one time before sending to you. As you know, both razors are done in factory nickle. It would be great if you could include the replate jobs in your review of those two pieces. Readers may find it interesting.

The Chrome Toggle is a completely different design/blade tray than a Standard Toggle. The adjustment dial is different as well. It has a physical stop on the turret. CAP commented he thought that was the best design for a Toggle. I can't remember why. It's in an email somewhere, I think.

A Red Dot is essentially a standard Fatboy with a Standard Toggle head....same blade tray.

Just a little interesting history on those two razors.

No need to split my stuff up. You have a prepaid label to get it all back to me in one box. Although I miss them, I have plenty of other razors to use until they return. Haha.

I like the way you are going to pair them. I'll do my best to keep my opinion of the shaves they produce to myself until you've had a chance to pass your own judgment.

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