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Discussion in 'Strops/Stropping' started by FlScott, May 8, 2019.
Thanks for posting this.
Here’s three tests on that very hard steel herder that’s about 20°, and you can see how thick ground it is by how narrow the bevel is. Usually I can’t even get half of the bevel into my field of view, But this razor barely takes up a third of it. These chips came from successful tests with scores of 16 g, 20 g, and 41 g.
Do you guys use stuff like Industrial Diamond Powder 50,000 Grit, 0-0.5microns for sharpening? I see it's not that expensive.
I do not.
Impressive results, sir.
I'm not opposed to it, but no.
I've used only stones, synthetic and natural, and pasted strops. My strops are pasted with CrOx and with Devo Red & Black (I have three pasted strops). Of course, I have non pasted strops too.
I haven't used any pastes in ten years. I really dislike the feel of the edge off pastes. No argument that it makes a very sharp edge though, and it is supposed to round off the bevel with use, so probably would help make edges more durable for these tests... but my primary reason for wanting this was to test different finishers... and pasted strops basically over-write the finisher with their own edge... so it'd defeat the purpose for me even if it did help with the chips.
So Mike (the manufacturer) offered me a narrower fulcrum to help with using it with straight razors, but the vendor also responded saying they will allow a return, so I'm going to go that route. Mike also mentioned that they've had reports of chipping with knives under 12* (24*)... which is almost exactly what my testing seems to suggest would be the angle at which the edge gets durable enough for this (right around where DE blades are)... if I were still cooking as much as I used to, I could see an argument for keeping it for my knives, but sadly, it's just not able to do what I bought it for, so back it goes. I wish everyone else luck with theirs.
I like colloidal silica, and occasionally iron oxide, but not diamonds much.
I've email asking Mike about getting a narrower fulcrum. Thanks.
Is it worth it?
(that's not meant to be combative, I'm just interested)
Well so far I’m the only one who’s been having issues with chipping. The narrow fulcrum will definitely help avoid that in the future for people who are having better luck with it as it is. And I’m sure Mike would appreciate having some one who uses this with straight razors to get more data on how they could improve in the future.
Maybe. I'm not sure yet.
I've not used it much yet + it hasn't helped me yet in my honing.
However, I believe it will help me, and not just a little bit as I learn to use it better and as it continues to inform my honing. If so, worth it it will be.
For someone who is already a very seasoned honer (meaning someone who knows the straight razors they hone are consistently sharper than a Feather DE blade) it might be interesting, but I'm not there just yet.
I say all this with little experience so far and with a firm knowledge that I generally am not a fan of gimmicks nor of measuring everything. Still, I'm very lousy at understanding and doing all the various tests guys do (other than the shave test) to see how sharp their edges are and hope this will help me along that road.
That amounts to a long "maybe."
I have a crazy idea which I've shared with the manufacturer and also posted on a thread here which discusses standardizing sharpness testing by using purchased human hair. Here's a link to that thread.
The following quoted material is what I emailed to the manufacturer of the Edge On Up. It's part of my ongoing conversation with Mike:
Isn't copper equivalent of human hair for hardness vs thickness? I see that touted often in media and forums. Copper litz wire is more standardized approach than human hair, and you can adjust its diameter to match the owners stubble (easily measurable with digital micrometer).
Check out the prices! They don't give it away that's for sure (at least not where I've looked).
Copper Litz wire is used in high end cables for hi-fi. Notably in top of the range headphones and earphones.
Not surprised it's expensive to buy.
Human hair would be a much cheaper option.
If you buy leads for welding, they have enough for thousands of tests. But it has to be copper, not copper clad aluminium, and that's gonna fatten up the price.
The problem is that is why you have to go down to tenths or even hundredths of a gram accuracy. A razor cuts dozens even hundreds of hairs at once with grams of force at most, the problem is that this test uses a harder media centered at a single point in the edge. To make it work with straight razors, It would need to test more of the edge at the same time but with a medium as soft as hair, or continue to test a single point but have much higher accuracy in the hundredths of a gram, So a reading could be gathered using something like a single human hair
A practical adaptation would be to use broader clips that would have several dozens of extremely soft filaments to test multiple points on the edge at once creating enough resistance that the force required could be measured in grams, Without having to exert all of that force at a single point on the edge. This would make refills extremely pricey though.
Just curious SliceOfLife - why are most of your razors in the 13- 14 degree range? Have you intentionally thinned them?
Its an awfully low angle.