Steep vs shallow angle?

[Goatrope]

I don't know if this subject has already been discussed before, but I was wondering if there are certain modern DE razors that tend to perform better using a shallow angle vs a steep angle, or maybe both angle approaches?

It seems there are die-hard proponents of both approaches to getting an optimal shave, but I'm kind of becoming a fan of the shallow angle (~30%) which I've been enjoying with my vintage Gillette Tech so far.

Having said that, I seem to gravitate to more of a steep angle using my Gamechanger .84-P for some reason.

I assume many factors such as blade exposure, blade gap, blade clamping mechanism and 'dome' height of the top cap come into play on this question. Maybe non-razor factors such as blades (sharpness) are part of the equation too?

 

[dunadan]

I use a steep angle (i.e., handle closer to the face) with all my DE razors regardless of the gap/exposure. But I find it works particularly well on razors with more blade exposure (or are more ‘aggressive’).

Riding the cap feels awkward to me. FWIW the ads for the Gillette Tech said the safety bar smooths the skin ahead of the blade, which wouldn’t work as well if you’re riding the cap. Not sure how accurate that is though.

 

[Iridian]

I don't know if this subject has already been discussed before, but I was wondering if there are certain modern DE razors that tend to perform better using a shallow angle vs a steep angle, or maybe both angle approaches?

The Blackbird is using a rather shallow angle and the Chiseled Face Legacy Razor prefer a somewhat more shallow angle. Some users here shave steep with the Blackbird, but it is rather the exception.

The Blackbird is much beloved here and an excellent razor, it might be just the right one for you. The Chiseled Face Legacy razor I have has a fancy handle, but the head didn't really win my love.

This said, I rather shave steeper as well. It depends very much on the razor and many have quite some leeway with the angle and work with either very well. As you mentioned the "dome", some razors bend the blade so much that one shaves rather steep handle-wise with them while the actual angle of the blade is not nearly as steep, sometimes even rather shallow.

Then there is @Halfbeard who also rather shaves shallow, which always leaves half of his beard standing. So yeah, better to shave steep!

 

[Jay21]

It’s a face YMMV thing more so than a razor thing, at least that’s what I’m led to believe.

 

[spacemonkey42]

Razors designers have a certain angle in mind when they make a tool.

Shavers may use them at that angle or a different one that works for them, YMMV.

I do my best to let the razor guide me to where it works best, rather than trying to force my preference on the tool.


Additional perspective from @Blackland Razors -

 

[Slapo]

I don't know if this subject has already been discussed before, but I was wondering if there are certain modern DE razors that tend to perform better using a shallow angle vs a steep angle, or maybe both angle approaches?

It seems there are die-hard proponents of both approaches to getting an optimal shave, but I'm kind of becoming a fan of the shallow angle (~30%) which I've been enjoying with my vintage Gillette Tech so far.

Having said that, I seem to gravitate to more of a steep angle using my Gamechanger .84-P for some reason.

I assume many factors such as blade exposure, blade gap, blade clamping mechanism and 'dome' height of the top cap come into play on this question. Maybe non-razor factors such as blades (sharpness) are part of the equation too?

I'd say try both, decide for yourself. It's a quick and easy experiment to perform.

On razors where this is possible, I generally ride the cap, but then switch over to bar-first on rounded features of my face, like the chin or around neck muscles (although a head turn does flatten it a little).

 

[anoop]

Riding the cap feels awkward to me. FWIW the ads for the Gillette Tech said the safety bar smooths the skin ahead of the blade, which wouldn’t work as well if you’re riding the cap. Not sure how accurate that is though.

Yes indeed, and the shallow angle seems very counter intuitive. I have an AS-D2 and find that it's very sensitive to angle and you get the most aggressiveness at a very shallow angle. Not my preference and wish it was more neutral in its angle.

 

[Goatrope]

As you mentioned the "dome", some razors bend the blade so much that one shaves rather steep handle-wise with them while the actual angle of the blade is not nearly as steep, sometimes even rather shallow.

Is this referring to the Henson type razor heads where the blade is clamped and bent down in such a way that the angle is cutting more shallow even though the handle is parallel to the face as what would otherwise be considered a steep angle?

 

[Goatrope]

Razors designers have a certain angle in mind when they make a tool.

Shavers may use them at that angle or a different one that works for them, YMMV.

I do my best to let the razor guide me to where it works best, rather than trying to force my preference on the tool.


Additional perspective from @Blackland Razors -

Thanks @spacemonkey42. Good video.

Yeah, I get the "it depends" answer to this question: personal preference, YMMV, different tools require different approaches, etc.

I've heard the 'let the razor guide me' type of advice before, but I've never quite understood it myself. I guess I'm not tuned into my razors enough to know where they are 'guiding' me because they usually go where my hand directs them to go.

 

[anoop]

I guess I'm not tuned into my razors enough to know where they are 'guiding' me, because they usually go where my hand directs them to go.

Agree 100%. Especially if it requires one to do something counterintuitive like using a very shallow angle. If I didn't know this about the AS-D2 from reading this forum, I would probably never have discovered how to correctly use the razor and would have sold it (like many have) instead of making the effort to learn how to use it by playing with the angle.

 

[Goatrope]

but then switch over to bar-first on rounded features of my face, like the chin

Good point. I'm sure my shaving angle changes when going 'around the corner' on my chin and jaw line.

 

[anoop]

It’s a face YMMV thing more so than a razor thing, at least that’s what I’m led to believe.

Definitely more of a razor thing. I've only used 2 razors -- DE89 and AS-D2 -- and both required very different angle. DE89 is more neutral. AS-D2 requires a shallow angle.

 

[anoop]

A related question --
Is it better to have the blade edge be more perpendicular to the cutting surface or more parallel? It seems like with mild razors (AS-D2) they are trying to get it to be more parallel. On the other hand, a razor like the PILS would probably cause the blade to be more perpendicular and is considered less forgiving.

 

[Jay21]

Definitely more of a razor thing. I've only used 2 razors -- DE89 and AS-D2 -- and both required very different angle. DE89 is more neutral. AS-D2 requires a shallow angle.

We’ll have to agree to disagree. My razor collection and face vs. reported user preferences here tell me it’s YMMV.

 

[Raven Koenes]

The Blackbird is using a rather shallow angle and the Chiseled Face Legacy Razor prefer a somewhat more shallow angle. Some users here shave steep with the Blackbird, but it is rather the exception.

The Blackbird is much beloved here and an excellent razor, it might be just the right one for you. The Chiseled Face Legacy razor I have has a fancy handle, but the head didn't really win my love.

This said, I rather shave steeper as well. It depends very much on the razor and many have quite some leeway with the angle and work with either very well. As you mentioned the "dome", some razors bend the blade so much that one shaves rather steep handle-wise with them while the actual angle of the blade is not nearly as steep, sometimes even rather shallow.

Then there is @Halfbeard who also rather shaves shallow, which always leaves half of his beard standing. So yeah, better to shave steep!

I'm one of the exceptions with the Blackbird. I've been shaving with it since January. I find it intuitively steep.

 

[NorthernSoul]

I'm neutral on the subject.

 

[spacemonkey42]

I've heard the 'let the razor guide me' type of advice before, but I've never quite understood it myself. I guess I'm not tuned into my razors enough to know where they are 'guiding' me because they usually go where my hand directs them to go.

By guide you, surely you know that means trying different angles and determining at which angle each razor is most efficient. And yes, one's hand directs these angle experiments.

 

[Goatrope]

By guide you, surely you know that means trying different angles and determining at which angle each razor is most efficient. And yes, one's hand directs these angle experiments.

Ah, ok. Thanks for clarification @spacemonkey42. I'm still a learning rookie.

 

[ERS4]

This concept is often discussed. You can search "riding the guard" and "riding the cap" in B&B to find more opinions.

Some people like shallow angles, others the opposite.
Some people shave at the angle that the razor is designed to shave at, while others think their own way is smoother.
Some people will cut off the safety bar and call it "Devette".

So there is no limit to your face/your razor.

 

[horizon]

Most razors, with very few exceptions, have a wide useful working angle. Many people will say that the angle is a matter of preference, and they would probably be right.
Personally, I think the shallow angle works better, less likely to dig into the skin and will cut hairs more easily. Pay attention to the good professional barbers who work with straight razors, always use a shallow angle and there is a reason.
The effectiveness of slant razors is also their design to work with a shallow angle. In addition, the blades used in slant razors have a longer life, because they cut more easily with less resistance due to the correct angle.
For me, the best shallow angle razors are the Blackbird and the R41 GS.