Steep versus shallow angle Throwdown!

[Useless shaver]

@rudyt

Very interesting indeed. I too have been using a steep angle for a long time (for good!) and actually one of the reasons I am not in is that I can't think of a razor I could shave with using the two angles.

Thanks for posting your experience.

 

[kingfisher]

Rudy, thanks.

The NEW Deluxe would work fine, I think, if you want to try it with a different razor.

 

[rudyt]

The NEW Deluxe would work fine, I think, if you want to try it with a different razor.

Great choice - I love that razor and I know I can shave both shallow and steep with it. I'll take that one for a test ride after the Fatboy on steroids before deciding which razor will be the "official" one.

 

[rudyt]

Test Shave #2 - Maggard V3A

Lather: RazoRock Santa Maria del Fiore
Brush: Vie-Long Epsilon white horse-hair fan (26/50mm)
Razor: Maggard V3A
Blade: Astra Superior Platinum [43]
Balm: Stirling Margaritas in the Arctic Post-Shave Balm

I still haven't decided on what razor I'll use for the 4-shave throwdown. Today was test shave #2, this time to see if I can shave shallow with the Maggard V3A. Tomorrow I'll try the Rapira Platinum Lux and Friday with be my +2 Fatboy set at 11. Saturday will be the NEW Deluxe and then I'll commit.

Right side of face at a shallow angle and left side at a steep angle. I'm right handed.

Comfort during the shave: like yesterday's Wardonia shave, two completely different sensations, but both were very comfortable

How close was the shave: both sides feel equal, a tie

How difficult or easy was the shave: shaving steep was a lot easier for me. I can shave steep much quicker and completely on autopilot. The shallow side took a conscious effort to maintain the proper angle - probably because I haven't regularly shaved shallow in two years.

Difference at the end of the day: dead even this time

Closing notes: Again, I shaved really shallow, literally riding the top cap with the handle almost straight out. I could feel a lot of drag from the top cap that I'm not used to, but like the Wardonia, there was almost no blade feel. I like blade feel and feedback, so like yesterday's Wardonia, I prefer the steep angle with this razor.

 

[cyberdog]

Well, I've got three shaves in using three different razors and received similar results on all three.

Shave #1: Rocky, KAI Blade, Proraso Green
Shave #2: Mingshi 2000s, Wilkinson Sword (German), Proraso Red
Shave #3: Fat-Boy, Rapira Platinum Lux, Razo-Rock XXX

All three immediately followed my morning shower, where I rub on some hair conditioner on my face and let it sit until I rinse off. - Makes a great pre-shave to soften the beard.

Post shave was an alcohol based aftershave, followed by a dab of lotion to lock in moisture. - All were some sort of Pinaud, so decent alcohol content. (There was no my face is on fire feeling on either side).

Right-Handed Shave, although I'm somewhat ambidextrous, not willing to risk a left hand using a different angle. I alternated the which side was Steep & Shallow between the shaves to negate the left/right. (Kept the angle on each side as best I could on each shave).

Comfort During Shave: Both have good comfort with any of the razor/blade combinations, however, the shallow angle with a light touch has less drag on the difficult spots (sides of jaw, mustache area, narrow strip down sides of neck). By the 3rd pass, the narrow angle definitely felt better or less scraped....and I didn't think a narrow angle would work with the MingShi looking at the head, but it worked really well. If I was to apply pressure, I think the narrow angle would be more likely to cut me, but with a light pressure it felt smoother going through the tough/dense areas.

Closeness: By the end of the shave, both sides similar, perhaps a tiny bit more clean-up on the steep angle, hard to say. That said, I think the shallow angle removed more during the first pass than the steeper angle. The end result was close.

Difficult or Ease of Shave: I'm definitely being more purposeful with the shallow angle, it's intimidating, and you really need to make sure there's no excess pressure applied. This may be that I'm not used to shaving at that shallow an angle, and speed may increase as become more accustom to it. (The FB felt less intimidating and easier to use with a shallow angle than the MingShi, although the Mingshi seemed to have more of increase in efficiency than the others).

Difference at the End of the Day: Tie, I don't stop the shave until I'm full on BBS! - I probably over-shave just a tad, I admit it, I like that feeling of being totally smooth afterward. My wife thinks I'm shaving for tomorrow each day.

Final Notes: I'm really liking the shallow angle, it sounds like a utility knife through paper as opposed to paper almost tearing, and I find my neck and sides of the chin don't feel scraped afterwards. Virtually no sting from the aftershave, perhaps a little tingle hear or there on the steeper angle side, but I'm getting good shaves from either side. I could easily do more passes on the shallow angle side without irritation.

 

[Slapo]

Second shave this morning: I think the results are about the same, maybe less of a difference this time. Swapped angles on each side, too.

Shave gear:
Razor: the same razor head (Virginia shaving closed comb) with a different handle found on an Acevivi dual comb razor, similar length and weight to the one used in the first shave.
Soap: SueZBana Cedarwood and black pepper
Brush: Cheap synthetic from eBay with aluminum handle
Blade: Timor

Not much time for shaving these days.

 

[cyberdog]

Well, I tried this morning, with my fairly new to me Schone OC, but couldn't finish and changed razors after the first pass....I tried, but was too irritated from the first pass. I've used it half a dozen times, so maybe she needs a new blade, it should have only been shave #4 on the Rapira Lux in it, and I usually get more shaves than that from them. - Maybe Schone eats blades faster than the MingShi, Rockwell, or Fat-Boy, but damn that was a rough first pass. I finally grabbed my MingShi with the Wilkinson Sword (5!) and finished the shave with the most comfortable angle I could muster. (And I was using Stirling Tuscany, a wonderfully thick, creamy and lubricating soap, and had used Dove Men's Pre-Shave, so go figure).

I'll need a day or two to let the damage heal, and figure out what went wrong this morning. I've had weeks of perfect bbs shaves, and BAM the worst shave in six months! I actually needed alum in 3-4 spots to stop the blood, I haven't needed that in months, since I the tto knob loosened on me during a shave. Not sure if the Schone doesn't like that shallow an angle or needed a sharper/newer blade to pull it off, as I've used it with a steeper angle in the past, and it was the shallow side that became irritated, but didn't know it until the blood started.

 

[rudyt]

Test Shave #3 - Rapira Platinum Lux

Lather: Dapper Dragon Obi Hill
Brush: Vie-Long 12705 brown horse-hair (24/50mm)
Razor: Rapira Platinum Lux w/Barbasol clone handle
Blade: Astra Superior Platinum [44]
Balm: Stirling Margaritas in the Arctic Post-Shave Balm

Getting closer to deciding on what razor I'll use for the 4-shave throwdown. Today was test shave #3, this time to see if I can shave shallow with the Rapira Platinum Lux. Tomowrrow I'll try the NEW Deluxe, and Saturday will be my last test, this time with the +2 Fatboy set at 11.

Right side of face at a steep angle today and left side at a steep angle - opposite of the past two shaves. I'm still right handed.

Comfort during the shave: still two completely different sensations, but both were very comfortable. A tie.

How difficult or easy was the shave: shaving steep is still a lot easier for me. The Rapira at a shallow angle was somehow easier than the Wardonia or V3A. Maybe I'm just getting back into the swing of shallow angle shaving.

How close was the shave: the Rapira shaved a little closer at a steep angle.

Difference at the end of the day: steep wins again

Closing notes: One of the characteristics of shaving steep with a blade with lots of overhang is that the shave s LOUD. Switching to shallow quiets the razor down significantly. I like my razors loud as it adds to the sensory experience. Steep angle wins out again today.

 

[cyberdog]

I'm about ready to stop testing and just use the MingShi for the test, it has the blade gap, as I don't usually run the FB at 7+ for all three passes. (Do all three passes need to be at 7 or above on the Gillette Adjustable?). While there's a noticeable difference in efficient with the Rockwell, either way is pretty comfortable, it works at just about any angle....I'm thinking that isn't why you'd like us to use for the four or so shaves, right? (I'd be using R3 or R4 if I used Rocky).

 

[BSAGuy]

I do both at various times and on various places on my ugly mug.

 

[Useless shaver]

I do both at various times and on various places on my ugly mug.

My ugly mug is mine, sir...

 

[Slapo]

Third shave in today around noon.

Gear the same as for the second shave, except for the brush, i. e.:
Shave gear
Razor: Virginia shaving closed comb with Acevivi handle (sold with a dual comb head).
Soap: SueZBana Cedarwood and black pepper
Brush: Stirling 26mm (non-Kong) synthetic... excellent brush
Blade: Timor (2nd use)

Result: Tie
Two passes against the growth, across the grows on my neck for the first pass and also the second on on the shallow angle side due to pre-existing rash/bumps.
Same closeness on both sides, with the exception of my neck, where some rash popped up on one side a day after shave 2 of this throwdown, due to me unconsciously rubbing an intense itch in the area, so I only went across the grain there on both passes. One tiny nick on the shallow angle side on a skin bump I haven't noticed, and one on a mole, likely due to the overhang of my razor catching it when it was covered by soap.
Steep angle feels a little safer while shallow seems more efficient, but now only on the first pass. Additionally, though, it seems that steep angle works a little better on my neck, where skin is sensitive, but the hair is tough and curls. The comb apparently straightens the hair a little, so it's easier to cut.

Maybe a bit early for a conclusion, but I'd say that while I have mostly used a shallow angle before the throwdown with some exceptions (moles), I might start using it on my neck a lot more. Curiously, a sort of scooping motion that I started using before entering the throwdown yielded similar results to steep angle shaves, but I haven't experimented with it enough, so will need to revisit.

I'm also wondering whether a steep angle would work as well with an open comb. Will try later.

 

[rudyt]

Test Shave #4 - NEW Deluxe

Lather: RazoRock Santa Maria del Fiore
Brush: Vie-Long Epsilon white horse-hair fan (26/50mm)
Razor: Gillette NEW Deluxe (15mm)
Blade: Astra Superior Platinum [45]
Splash: B&M Lavanille Tonique After Shave Splash

Getting really close to deciding on what razor I'll use for the 4-shave throwdown. Today was test shave #4, this time with the NEW Deluxe. I know I can shave shallow with this razor because I did it for years. Tomorrow will be the +2 Fatboy set at 11, my last test shave before I commit to a razor.

Right side of face at a steep angle today and left side at a steep angle - same as yesterday. I'm still right handed.

Comfort during the shave: a tie again, but there was less difference in feeling between steep and shallow as with the other razors. Both angles felt somewhat similar.

How difficult or easy was the shave: I've owned the NEW Deluxe for about 4 years, and used it the first two years exclusively at a shallow angle, and the last two at a steep angle. The steep angle was still easier for me.

How close was the shave: the steep angle was noticeably closer.

After-shave sting:Tied - no sting whatsoever on any side.

Difference at the end of the day: based on the above, steep will probably win again

Closing notes: It will either be this razor or the Fatboy on 11 for the formal throwdown. Stay tuned ...

 

[Useless shaver]

Thanks, very interesting again.

 

[kingfisher]

Today was number two in the throw down. For this one, I used my Fatboy set on 8. I used the steep angle on my left side and shallow on my right, opposite of the first time.

Comfort during: I preferred the shallow angle. I went quite steep and it produced more blade feel than I prefer. Shallow with the Fatboy is smooth and feels entirely non-threatening, even when it is opened up. I probably should mention that the blade was on its last legs; I think the steep angle feels worse when a blade is getting near the end of its useful life.

How difficult or easy: I found it pretty easy to maintain the angles on either side of my face. As long as I wasn't actively trying to absolutely maximize the steepness, the steep angle is perhaps slightly easier to maintain, even though I am a largely a shallow angle guy.

How close? After the first pass, the steep side was slightly closer, again. After two passes, the difference was negligible.

Aftershave sting? None whatsoever. No irritation on either side. Smooth and comfortable.

Difference at the end of the day? Too soon to say. I posted this too early. I'll make sure to check this evening and update as necessary.

Winner the first time around was shallow. Winner today is yet to be determined, but it was very close.

 

[Useless shaver]

Shallow? Hmmm... Maybe it's got to do with the type of razor? Sure it does...

 

[rudyt]

All other variables will be carefully controlled, because you'll be using the SAME RAZOR for each side of the face, just shaving with a different technique.

Why didn't someone point out to me that I was reading this wrong? I guess nobody reads my long-winded posts ;-) I understood it as we needed to use the same razor for all shaves. Pre-coffee comprehension fail.

So ignore the part in all my posts where I'm struggling to find the right razor for the throwdown. I'll just keep exploring as many as I think would work with both techniques.

 

[cyberdog]

Having tried several razors before committing, some have no difference in feel, others very much so. I tore myself up with the Schone (close to Fatip) trying to go too shallow, it has a preferred range, that falls towards the steeper side.

The Fatboy and MingShi (Futur twin or copy) work well either way. There's more blade feel with the Fatboy when you go too far shallow. The Fatboy has a sweet range that lands somewhere in between, but that spot varies with the setting, or sure seems to.....I used it this morning on 7, higher than of use my slim, and at 7 it was surprisingly smoother shallow. Will wait until later in the day to post results, for end of day results, but pretty darn good. I may count this as shave #1 in the throwdown.

 

[Highspeedlane]

Why didn't someone point out to me that I was reading this wrong? I guess nobody reads my long-winded posts ;-) I understood it as we needed to use the same razor for all shaves. Pre-coffee comprehension fail.

So ignore the part in all my posts where I'm struggling to find the right razor for the throwdown. I'll just keep exploring as many as I think would work with both techniques.

All good Rudy! I'm enjoying the heck out of reading all the differing findings here. Good stuff!

 

[Useless shaver]

Rudy.. I got the same as you... same razor every shave....

Am I wrong too?