Steep versus shallow angle Throwdown!

[engblom]

This is interesting. The conventional wisdom has always been that a shallow angle is the safest way, and that steep angle shaving is more likely to cause weepers, irritation, etc. As others chime in, we may be able to see whether your experience is unique, or whether the conventional wisdom is incorrect.

Sadly, most "conventional wisdom" is not wisdom from experienced shavers. Newbie wet shavers are so eager to help so they repeat everything they have been hearing at some point while older wet shavers might not always comment. Older wet shavers know way to well about the YMMV factor and often stays silent. The longer you have been wet shaving, the less you consider your own knowledge as absolute.

Personally, I also find a steep angle to be more safe.

 

[Slapo]

I'm starting to think a combination of the two might actually be desirable, particularly for people who don't shave too often - first pass with maximum efficiency, the rest with increased emphasis on safety. I'll probably give this a shot after the experiment is over. I have some razors/heads inbound. ;-)

 

[Raven Koenes]

People do what they want , this pages are just noncence , steep shaving is like scratching the face , you ruind Your face and the razorblade ,and you will find out that no razorblades are Sharp enough and that they have a short lived life

You must have missed the meme. 1Cal who is a confirmed steep angle shaver is on day 118 on a single PolSilver blade.

 

[Raven Koenes]

Same here. My dad was exclusively a steep angle shaver, and I never understood why. I shaved as shallow as possible for over 40 years.

Two years ago I challenged myself to learn steep angle shaving. If so many people could do it, so could I. I was convinced I would like it less and that it couldn't possibly be as smooth and comfortable as shallow angle shaving.

Today, every shave is more comfortable at the steepest angle the razor will support.

 

[guyakaguy]

Sadly, most "conventional wisdom" is not wisdom from experienced shavers. Newbie wet shavers are so eager to help so they repeat everything they have been hearing at some point while older wet shavers might not always comment. Older wet shavers know way to well about the YMMV factor and often stays silent. The longer you have been wet shaving, the less you consider your own knowledge as absolute.

Personally, I also find a steep angle to be more safe.

+1

I typically shave more toward the shallow side, but certain spots get a slightly more steep angle due to the direction I'm shaving in or inability to use a shallow angle (ATG on upper lip, XTG on jawline). Too much one way or the other, too shallow or too steep, gives you different results, albeit not desirable results.

Imagine peeling an apple or potato with a paring knife: too steep of an angle (knife closer to perpendicular) and you're just scraping the crap out of the outside surface without removing the skin; too shallow (closer to parallel) and you're going to take chunks out of the apple/potato. There's a balance or combination that yields the best and consistent results. It's not required to experience both extremes, but it certainly does help.


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[Raven Koenes]

+1

I typically shave more toward the shallow side, but certain spots get a slightly more steep angle due to the direction I'm shaving in or inability to use a shallow angle (ATG on upper lip, XTG on jawline). Too much one way or the other, too shallow or too steep, gives you different results, albeit not desirable results.

Imagine peeling an apple or potato with a paring knife: too steep of an angle (knife closer to perpendicular) and you're just scraping the crap out of the outside surface without removing the skin; too shallow (closer to parallel) and you're going to take chunks out of the apple/potato. There's a balance or combination that yields the best and consistent results. It's not required to experience both extremes, but it certainly does help.


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I agree being one who tends towards a steeper angle. In the end being a slave to a technique over what works can be counterproductive...I like to use the adage "just shave".

 

[nvpliers]

+1

I typically shave more toward the shallow side, but certain spots get a slightly more steep angle due to the direction I'm shaving in or inability to use a shallow angle (ATG on upper lip, XTG on jawline). Too much one way or the other, too shallow or too steep, gives you different results, albeit not desirable results.

Imagine peeling an apple or potato with a paring knife: too steep of an angle (knife closer to perpendicular) and you're just scraping the crap out of the outside surface without removing the skin; too shallow (closer to parallel) and you're going to take chunks out of the apple/potato. There's a balance or combination that yields the best and consistent results. It's not required to experience both extremes, but it certainly does help.


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Good points.

 

[Esetter]

I'm finishing up with Super Speed month tonight, I think I may have to pull out my Fatip or Old next and give it a go. Very much a steep angle shaver with those bad boys, but it's worth trying something new. I'm very interested in the consensus and others' experience here.

 

[cyberdog]

Hmm, what about the design of the head, which could play a significant role in this test. Some razor designs bend or curve the blade more than others, which is going to affect the blade to face angle. My Fat-Boy for instance, curves the blade more so than my Slim, making the blade to safety bar angle different...actually, it already places the blade more parallel to your face than say the slim or tech would.

I find the Fat-Boy more comfortable than my Slim, and I believe it's angle of the blade. Other more bend/curvy designs are the Mekur Progress, and depending upon the plate the Rockwell, which tosses in some bend. By comparison the Pearl & Parker 24/26 models hold the blade nearly flat, which may be why I didn't like those razors. I guess the point is that some razors already take care of the steep vs shallow angle for you.

 

[kingfisher]

Hmm, what about the design of the head, which could play a significant role in this test. Some razor designs bend or curve the blade more than others, which is going to affect the blade to face angle. My Fat-Boy for instance, curves the blade more so than my Slim, making the blade to safety bar angle different...actually, it already places the blade more parallel to your face than say the slim or tech would.

I find the Fat-Boy more comfortable than my Slim, and I believe it's angle of the blade. Other more bend/curvy designs are the Mekur Progress, and depending upon the plate the Rockwell, which tosses in some bend. By comparison the Pearl & Parker 24/26 models hold the blade nearly flat, which may be why I didn't like those razors. I guess the point is that some razors already take care of the steep vs shallow angle for you.

I hear what you are saying, but they really don't, because you can still apply that razor to your face at a variety of angles. So even if it is bent fairly severely, if there is a decent blade gap you can still choose from a variety of angles at which the blade actually interacts with your face.

 

[kingfisher]

OK, so shave one in the throw down for me is in the books.

Razor: iKon SBS. For those not familiar, it's like the Tradere but made of brass and with a flippable baseplate; therefore considerably heavier. It also has one SB side and one OC side. The blade is held almost completely flat in the razor
Blade: Polsilver SI, 3rd shave
Lather: Vintage Williams!

I did't feel well this morning and had a fever, so I slept in and decided on a one-pass shave today. So, that's all I've got is how it felt and the first-pass efficiency.

To me, the shallow side felt safer. It was smooth and comfortable on the face. The steep side felt a bit scary. This razor already has a lot of blade feel and on the steep side it felt like nothing but blade. It also felt like it might begin to "resonate" a little, although I don't know if it did. The aural feedback was certainly louder on the steep angle side. I was careful not to exert too much pressure. It seemed to remove whiskers pretty efficiently, although in places where the stubble is really thick it almost felt like it couldn't quite get to the base of the whiskers.

Having said that, after one pass, the steep angle side was actually more closely shaved than the shallow angle side. Both sides were OK, but feeling the stubble sideways there was no question that the steep angle was more efficient.

No sting at all from an alcohol-based aftershave, so neither side was irritated in the least.

Overall? I felt more comfortable using a shallow angle, but the steep angle provided more first-pass efficiency and did not result in irritation.

 

[paintflinger]

Both work, I find the shaves closer and blade life longer when using shallow angle. The problem is, not everybody is using the same razor/blade and one person's definition of no pressure is different from another's entirely.

 

[Highspeedlane]

Both work, I find the shaves closer and blade life longer when using shallow angle. The problem is, not everybody is using the same razor/blade and one person's definition of no pressure is different from another's entirely.

Good point. I wonder to what extent that different razors bend the blade might affect outcomes also.

 

[imatabor]

Sadly, most "conventional wisdom" is not wisdom from experienced shavers. Newbie wet shavers are so eager to help so they repeat everything they have been hearing at some point while older wet shavers might not always comment. Older wet shavers know way to well about the YMMV factor and often stays silent. The longer you have been wet shaving, the less you consider your own knowledge as absolute.

Personally, I also find a steep angle to be more safe.

I think that the conventional wisdom is because most razors can't do the steep angle. Which leads to new guys scraping their face.

 

[rudyt]

Question: What razor to pick to not skew the results? If I pick my R41 or iKon Tech, steep will win out because I just can't get a good shave at a shallow angle with those razors.

I can shave steep or shallow with a thin cap Old Type, but that razor doesn't qualify according to the OP, and by extension, the Fatip open comb should also be dissatisfied.

I'm guessing I can go with the Wardonia or Rapira Platinum Lux, but I've never tried them shallow. My other option is the NEW Deluxe. Ideas?

 

[Cal]

... the Fatip open comb should also be dissatisfied.

I'm sorry to hear that your Fatip's unhappy Rudy.

But I'm betting that "dissatisfied" is your smartphone's clever translation of "disqualified."

 

[Slapo]

I have only used the Rapira Platinum Lux with a shallow angle, worked a treat. I haven't actually used my now modded Wardonia, so I can't say.
You could also put the top cap from the Rapira on an EJ base plate. ;-)
Do you have the Maggard V3A head, by any chance? It should be able to do the job too.

 

[rudyt]

I have only used the Rapira Platinum Lux with a shallow angle, worked a treat. [snip]

Do you have the Maggard V3A head, by any chance? It should be able to do the job too.

OK, so the Rapira is a possibility, and so is the V3A (which I do own).

Hey @1Cal, I proof-read this one before posting ;-)

 

[Useless shaver]

For our next throwdown-

Which side of the blade do you use, the long sharpened side or the short unsharpened side?

The short one...


Of course.

 

[rudyt]

Test Shave 1: Wardonia

Lather: RazoRock Santa Maria del Fiore
Brush: Vie-Long Epsilon white horse-hair fan (26/50mm)
Razor: Wardonia Bakelite with Old Type Thick Cap
Blade: Astra Superior Platinum [42]
Balm: Stirling Margaritas in the Arctic Post-Shave Balm

I don't know what razor to use because it has to be one that I can get a good shave with both steep and shallow. The Muhle R41 or iKon Tech would have been my first choices, but I just can't get a comfortable shave with them at a shallow angle.

Today was test shave #1 to see if I can shave shallow with the Wardonia. Yup. This razor works at any angle from about 0 to 90 degrees. Right side of face at a shallow angle and left side at a steep angle. I'm right handed.

Comfort during the shave: two completely different sensations, but both were very comfortable

How close was the shave: both sides felt pretty equal, maybe a bit closer on the steep side

How difficult or easy was the shave: shaving steep was a lot easier for me. I can shave steep much quicker and completely on autopilot. The shallow side took a conscious effort to maintain the proper angle - probably because I haven't regularly shaved shallow in two years, and have never shaved shallow with this razor.

Irritation or weepers: I never get irritation, and haven't gotten a weeper in over 25 years of shaving

Difference at the end of the day: there was more growth on the shallow side. Now I can't tell if that is actual growth, or the angle of the cut on the stubble making the shallow side feel coarser.

Closing notes: I shaved really shallow, literally riding the top cap with the handle almost straight out. I could feel a lot of drag from the top cap that I'm not used to, but there was almost no blade feel. I like blade feel and feedback. If I wanted no blade feel, I'd just Nair my face ;-) I like the sensory aspect of shaving, and like to feel that there's something going on.