And no offense meant to the asker, but it does betray some ignorance. Tons (most?) of truly specialty coffee is sold in 12oz bags.
Starbucks? How are they viewed among the coffee guys and gals?
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And no offense meant to the asker, but it does betray some ignorance. Tons (most?) of truly specialty coffee is sold in 12oz bags.
I am always in the mood for a dark roast. Starbucks is still garbage. It is because their coffee is mass produced and so when they roast their beans they roast them with the husk on and just burn the husk off...This is what gives the bitter aftertaste on Starbucks coffee (this was at least the case when I drank their coffee about a year ago).
About a year ago I started going to our local farmer's market. I went through a couple of the coffee vendors there and it got progressively better. Finally I stumbled on one vendor who was roasting their beans on site (they have a larger roaster at their warehouse/offices obviously, but they bring a small one to the market...Always smells GREAT!). This coffee is the best I have tried to date. They do about 15 different roasts (light, medium, dark, etc.) and all of them are delicious. I ended up with probably the 3rd darkest coffee they have because I love bold coffee.
Honestly though if people are suggesting dunkin donuts coffee I don't think I would call that a snob. Personally I wish I could run and get a cup of coffee from somewhere close and easy. Unfortunately I have to brew my own (often in a french press now or my non-fancy espresso machine). I would definitely call myself a snob (working in a kitchen has put my taste buds to the level of being an *******
).Really though, just like shaving, it is all up to someone's preferences. If you enjoy 7-11 coffee then go get yourself some and enjoy
.
This was a tongue in cheek comment. This was based on the view that all bags of coffee at grocery store were at one time one pound bags and now the smaller bags are just a rip-off.
I need to weigh my next roast to verify, but I had come think of the 12 oz size as a result of roasting 1 lb, and that was why most roasters settled on that size at retail. Meaning with a 12oz bag of roasted coffee, one is buying about 1 lb of coffee on the input side of the roaster. IIRC the one time I weighed this, I got roughly 13 oz when roasting a pound of green beans.
Closer to 13oz, plus or minus a half.
I have spent many hours hanging out at Staufs and watching them roast and talking with the owner.. no one roasts just 1 pound of coffee unless you are doing it in your kitchen. Beans fresh out of the roaster are not at their peak of flavor. They need to de-gas for at least 48 hours +/-. If you are drinking single estate beans then each estate will have a different taste. As far as bag size.. you walk to the barrel and say I want 1/4 pound of this, a pound of that, 1/2 pound of that and 1/2 pound of that mixed. If you are buying 'pre-bagged' coffee then all bets are off on what you are getting. If you have to buy at a ggery store then go with the 8 o'clock whole bean and use their grinder. Properly kept most folks could not tell if the coffee was gound 10 mins ago or 5 days ago..
Since I know Matt I will ocassionally order from him.. organic beans and roasted with a wood fire, a little more spendy but a hell of a lot more work.
http://mattscoffee.com/index.php?osCsid=8540e26017188358799e865652706200
Since I know Matt I will ocassionally order from him.. organic beans and roasted with a wood fire, a little more spendy but a hell of a lot more work.
http://mattscoffee.com/index.php?osCsid=8540e26017188358799e865652706200
OK, so far so good. However, I'll say in passing that "1lb green nets 13oz roasted" is a statement of yield, and not an implication of batch size. It applies at 1lb batch sizes (larger than most home roasters, but certainly possible if you have a Behmor or the like) or 100lb batches.
Huh? "Pre-bagged" coffee isn't a term I'm used to seeing, but it adequately describes that sold by the top shelf specialty coffee vendors. In fact, most of the truly great coffee to be bought is sold "pre-bagged". If you're getting it from bins, I get suspicious of cleanliness and freshness.
Whoa there - I can't get into recommendations for grocery store coffee (as I can't in good conscious recommend any of it, save for very few cases where I know the sell fresh beans from a local roaster). Second, "use their grinder" is a major no-no. Only God knows what's been through that thing and what minimum wage worker last "cleaned" it (let alone proper maintenance). Finally, "properly kept" and "grind at the store" don't mix, and if you can't tell coffee ground 10 minutes ago against 5 days ago, none of the aforementioned advice really applies. Just drink Folgers.
When I was just a home roaster, I would roast 16oz. down to just under 14oz. This is not the reason.
Do you know why or have a theory as to why the 12oz bag became such a common size? There must be some history behind it, like the number of perk pots one could get out of a bag, or tradeoff between the amount one would drink before the coffee would get stale, or maybe it's as random as the number of hotdog buns in a pack, or maybe I am trying to over think it.
You're right in part.
Consumers are too used to thinking of coffee, even specialty coffee, as a commodity. The average consumer doesn't understand nor care what it takes to get such a great cup of coffee. The average consumer doesn't understand (and most don't really care) that the poorest American on food stamps has a standard of living at least twice that of the farmers in Ethiopia who grew, harvested, processed, and bagged the raw product that must still be shipped half way around the world, roasted by a roaster who won't screw up the work that they put into it, packaged, shipped again, and eventually bought by a consumer. (best case scenario)
They don't recognize the absurdity of having no problem paying upwards of $20 for a bottle of wine that will yield only 4-5 or so glasses, which puts it at minimum of $5 per serving. Yet, they'll scoff at a product that's more than twice as complex, and offers a greater experience on the palate (the only reason people say they pay high prices for wine is taste.. just keep that in mind), and is available quite readily for well under $1 per serving because it is "expensive".
In short, you people who say that Starbucks is expensive (and let's not even mention the high end specialty lots from micro-roasters like myself) don't understand the cost of the cup in your hand, and I find it insulting to my industry as a whole.
How do we cope? We sell it in smaller sizes so that there is less demanded out of pocket to take some home to enjoy. It makes it more approachable to the masses who think that coffee isn't worth half of what is charged, when in reality, it's worth at least three times that.
There is a reason Kona coffee is so expensive. I'll give you a hint: it's not because it's so good. It's because the workers are American and have similar standards of living as you and me. It's because that's what is required to sustain that standard of living. Compare that to the tiny amount charged for that amazing Ethiopia Sidama you last tried, and consider the living conditions of those who are responsible for it.
I don't want to see one more word about specialty coffee being "expensive". Expensive is a relative term. For what you get in return, it's the bargain of the century. Enjoy it while it lasts.
IMO Starbucks is akin to grinding up Kingsford charcoal and brewing it.
THIS. I have thoroughly enjoyed the Kona I've bought fresh or roasted myself (except that one batch... don't ask). However, and I say this with great pain considering the cost, it wasn't anything special. On the other hand, I'm STILL thinking about that Sidama from Shilcho Co-op that totally blew my mind, cup after cup. Kona is good, not great. JBM is the same way. Good, not great.
Gesha, on the other hand...
certainly when you roast anything you end up with less weight. buy a pound t-bone and weight it after you grill it. I don't understand the conflict here
Huh? if you're getting it bagged means it was roasted more then a few days ago, do you think it's roasted in the bag? Well, when I stand there watch them dump the green beans from the burlap bag into the roaster and then watch it put in the barrell all in site of the shop I'm pretty sure what I'm getting.
BS.. I didn't recommend it I said if you have to use grogery coffee. First you stick an empty bag under the grinder run it a few second and flip the flipper thing. The you ground yours. Where do you live that you think someone is running corn through the grinder? Everyone doesn't have $15 for 12oz of coffee, $50 for a min use grinder or the time to screw with it before leaving for work.
Kind of like the cart vs DE shaving mindeset that carts suck.. do the prep and do it right and you can get a servicable shave. Lot's of folk are happy with a DFS.
IMHO, coffee from micro roasters are worth what they charge it's a lot of work and investment.
Sure I drink mostly Stauf's, some of Matt's particulary Sunday morning and even buy the 8 o'clock when we have friends or host a holiday as most people could care less. On the road when my themos runs dry I'll hit a Starbucks or even McDs and live to tell about it.
Stauf's is a great local name!
Star bucks is roasted for the purpose of creating their coffee blends. As a straight cup I find it horrible. Given a choice I'll choose another place for coffee.
Corn's not the issue. The prior customers who ground their highly flavored coffee beans is. Not that it matters to me anyway. I'm sure it doesn't matter to those that use grocery store grinders either.
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Stauf's would make a great meeting place for a meeting of the Central Ohio B&B'ers.. unless the coffee in the dirty barrels would be a turn off. Even a great little barber shop right next door and one about 3 doors the other direction. I've gotten a shave in Gina's and was happy with the results.
We're in agreement; I was just pointing out that my previous statement (that you get about 13oz of roasted coffee per pound of green) is NOT saying that commercial roasters actually roast a single pound at a time. It's just a ratio.
This, however, is laughable:
You're mistaken. The very best coffee roasters roast, cool, and bag their coffee within an hour (I'm talking from pouring the greens into the hopper to pouring the roasted beans into bags). Counter Culture, Intelligentsia, Coava, Jason - these guys are selling "bagged coffee" (again, a totally ambiguous term) that's very much fresh. My favorite is Counter Culture (because they're awesome and local) - I could place an order today, it'll be roasted tomorrow morning and bagged right after, then packed for shipping, and then on my doorstep Saturday morning with the rest of the mail (no local pick-up options, unfortunately). I've ordered from Jason, and it was much the same story, except that shipping took an extra day. Bangin' tasty fresh coffee. Let's say I'm already out for a cup, probably at Jubala Village Coffee in Raleigh. Guess what? BAGS of Counter Culture coffee at the register, all less than a week out of the roaster. It all depends on where it's from.
As for this business of grocery store grinders, that's your call. I, for one, won't touch 'em. They're covered in rancid coffee oils because nobody is caring for them like they should, and that stuff is making it onto what you're grinding to take home (whether or not you whack the lever a few times, it's on the burrs and in the chute).
I grew up in Dunkin' Donuts territory. I do not like their coffee. They used to have Dunkin' Dark Roast which was almost OK, but their normal roast is not for me.
When the Coffee Connection was around Boston (prior to getting bought out by Starbucks[?], if I recall correctly) I really enjoyed their dark roasts.
If I had my choice for the perfect cup of coffee whenever I wanted it, then I would never step foot in a Starbucks.
However, Starbucks is ubiquitous and I know that I'll get something I like WAY better than the other readily available coffee (Dunkin'), I choose Starbucks. It's not my favorite, it's not even close to my favorite, but it's everywhere and I can muster a good deal more enjoyment out of a Venti Bold Black than I can a large cup of weak hot water from D&D.
That's my take on Starbucks. It's kind of crappy, but it's everywhere and it's better than a bunch of other stuff that's also everywhere.
When the Coffee Connection was around Boston (prior to getting bought out by Starbucks[?], if I recall correctly) I really enjoyed their dark roasts.
If I had my choice for the perfect cup of coffee whenever I wanted it, then I would never step foot in a Starbucks.
However, Starbucks is ubiquitous and I know that I'll get something I like WAY better than the other readily available coffee (Dunkin'), I choose Starbucks. It's not my favorite, it's not even close to my favorite, but it's everywhere and I can muster a good deal more enjoyment out of a Venti Bold Black than I can a large cup of weak hot water from D&D.
That's my take on Starbucks. It's kind of crappy, but it's everywhere and it's better than a bunch of other stuff that's also everywhere.
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