So what's the deal with Rhodium re-plating?

[Freehand]

Have any of you Gents sent a vintage Gillette to one of the re-platers?

I understand that the razor would no longer be original, and some may think that de-values the razor. But my acquisitions are for my enjoyment and not necessarily for investment purposes. I also understand that a fresh coat of rhodium or nickel doesn't make the razor perform any better, but it sure does make it shiny and bright. And it makes me !!

And if I do decide to have a razor re-plated, what shape should the razor be in? It seems like a razor with cosmetic problems and brassing would be the logical candidate....so long as mechanically it functions OK. Is that the general consensus?

And what's the replating material of choice?....gold, silver, nickel, rhodium?

I know some might think re-plating is a waste of $29 to $65, but that would be a bargain, considering what my RAD has already cost me?

Anyone have any experience, comments, or suggestions?

Freehand

 

[bakerbarber]

I will be commenting on this in a few weeks. I am expecting one razor, and plan on sending out a few more as Christmas passes.

I would love to see pics and comments of the fellas who've taken the plunge.

Before and after?

I have a handful of shavers that I intend to keep, and pass on to family members some day. I want them to look stellar now, and in the future.

Some of my razors that have wear and show brass are just irritating me. they shave so well, but look crummy. Brass kind of smells weird when it hits hot water too.

I can't beat vintage for quality and performance. I might as well purty them up a bit.

I'd sure like to do Rhodium and Gold, but suspect nickel is in my future.

 

[mdkraus13]

ive been wondering about the replating too...anyone used the **filtered vendor**? where else have you been replated?
thanks,mike

Have any of you Gents sent a vintage Gillette to one of the re-platers?

I understand that the razor would no longer be original, and some may think that de-values the razor. But my acquisitions are for my enjoyment and not necessarily for investment purposes. I also understand that a fresh coat of rhodium or nickel doesn't make the razor perform any better, but it sure does make it shiny and bright. And it makes me !!

And if I do decide to have a razor re-plated, what shape should the razor be in? It seems like a razor with cosmetic problems and brassing would be the logical candidate....so long as mechanically it functions OK. Is that the general consensus?

And what's the replating material of choice?....gold, silver, nickel, rhodium?

I know some might think re-plating is a waste of $29 to $65, but that would be a bargain, considering what my RAD has already cost me?

Anyone have any experience, comments, or suggestions?

Freehand

 

[Blue58]

Have any of you Gents sent a vintage Gillette to one of the re-platers?

I understand that the razor would no longer be original, and some may think that de-values the razor. But my acquisitions are for my enjoyment and not necessarily for investment purposes. I also understand that a fresh coat of rhodium or nickel doesn't make the razor perform any better, but it sure does make it shiny and bright. And it makes me !!

And if I do decide to have a razor re-plated, what shape should the razor be in? It seems like a razor with cosmetic problems and brassing would be the logical candidate....so long as mechanically it functions OK. Is that the general consensus?

And what's the replating material of choice?....gold, silver, nickel, rhodium?

I know some might think re-plating is a waste of $29 to $65, but that would be a bargain, considering what my RAD has already cost me?

Anyone have any experience, comments, or suggestions?

Freehand

Ok I have not personally had any razor replated but from what I have seen most people don't have a problem with a razor being replated, they just have a problem with people replating a razor then when they offer it for sale they represent it as new, never used and demand an outrageous price for it. However if you are planning on keeping the razor for yourself then go for it

As for what to plate your razor with will depend somewhat on what the base metal is. some materials will adhere to one metal but not others so a different base metal was used when certain plating metals were used for the final material.

Now with cost of gold you may choose not to go this way. From what I understand there are a limited number of platers that can do the rhodium plating so this may proved to be impractical.

A lot of this boils down to how much you can afford

I know there are several people on this forum that have had razors replated so they should be able to help you with the who and where are good choices to plate a razor.

 

[bordeaaj]

I understand that the razor would no longer be original, and some may think that de-values the razor. But my acquisitions are for my enjoyment and not necessarily for investment purposes. I also understand that a fresh coat of rhodium or nickel doesn't make the razor perform any better, but it sure does make it shiny and bright. And it makes me !!

I agree 100%! There are a few hardcore collectors who apparently think that even so much as cleaning the vintage soap scum/stubble "plating" off the nasty old thing devalues the razor...all that stuff gives the razor "character". Nothing like showing off a cased mottled green razor with a few straggly face pubes hanging out of the blade gap in a nice display case! I think there is a difference between having "character" and looking like a "character". That said, I have picked up a few collectible razors off the 'bay that were pretty green on top yet minty underneath...curiously these same collectors didn't seem to want to touch them...it seems they were too busy bidding many times more for the nice clean collectible razors with obviously minty plating. So, logic has brought me to the conclusion that a razor with nice plating, whether original or replated, is worth more than one without. It's hard to imagine how putting on an improved coat of plating on a user grade razor will devalue anything. If you do decide to sell a nicely plated vintage razor, you might not get back quite what you put into it...but I bet you'll get quite a bit more than what you originally paid for it. I say go for it!

And if I do decide to have a razor re-plated, what shape should the razor be in? It seems like a razor with cosmetic problems and brassing would be the logical candidate....so long as mechanically it functions OK. Is that the general consensus?

The better replaters strip the old plating and polish out as many minor imperfections as possible before replating. The better shape the razor is in the better the result. That wouldn't stop me from sending in a user grade razor, however, as it will come back looking nearly as good as new...and quite possibly even better than new in the case of rhodium!

And what's the replating material of choice?....gold, silver, nickel, rhodium?

Rhodium is the hardest and showiest. Nickel is quite hard as well. These seem to be considered the most practical choices.

Gold and silver, although beautiful, are considered by many to be too soft and high maintenance to be practical for an everyday shaver. Silver will tarnish, as will nickel to a lesser degree. Though gold doesn't tarnish like silver, both are soft enough to become dull with frequent use and require polishing to stay looking shiny and new. That said, the new plating is usually quite a bit thicker than the thin layer Gillette applied so even these soft metals should last much longer even with everyday use.

 

[dirtdog]

Rhodium is the hardest and showiest. Nickel is quite hard as well. These seem to be considered the most practical choices.

Not so
http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/373287/how_to_care_for_rhodium_plated_jewelry.html
Rhodium is the best tarnish proof material
it is quite soft, wears poorly and is really inferior to hard chrome

 

[diverdoug]

I have been toying with the idea of rhodium plating my Merkur 39C, but have been concerned theat the plating process will make the handle engraving less "grippy". Should the plating effect the "coefficient of sliding friction" on the handle?

 

[cernel_joson]

Rhodium is one of the hardest in vickers scale of hardness (denting) but above average in the mohs scale of hardness (abrasion). It's also one of the brightest metals. To my eye, bright nickel will suffice for a replate. It resists abrasion better and also polishes out a lot easier than rhodium. It's hard to tell the difference between nickel and rhodium too, though rhodium has a discernibly whiter shine. In fact later Brit Aristocrats and Presidents have nickel heads and rhodium handles. I don't think anybody complains about that.

 

[diverdoug]

I just found this on another website

Friedrich Mohs, a German mineralogist, invented his eponymous scale of hardness in 1812. It compares substances by their ability to scratch each other, with diamond at the top with a score of 10. This is quite important to us traditional shavers because it gives us an idea about the potential longevity of our razors and also is very useful to know when re-plating a razor.

Gold is pretty soft with a Mohs of 2.5. Lots of razors from many manufacturers have been gold plated and it is totally unsuited to the job, I have two gold plated toggles and they have worn in the key contact areas. Gold might be OK for a razor you are going to just display and look at, but it isn’t what this blog is about. It has rocketed in price recently to $1,275 an ounce.

Silver comes next with a Mohs of 2.7, which isn’t much better, and it has the unfortunate tendency to oxidise to dull grey. At one stage Gillette silver plated a lot of razors but it has fallen out of fashion today. It is relatively cheap though, at $21 an ounce.

Nickel was Gillette’s plating material of choice through most of its classical production and many of those razors are still pristine today, so it is surprising to find that it has a Mohs of just 4. Nickel is $23,000 per tonne so is very cheap indeed.

Palladium is next, used by the Joris razors from France, this has a Mohs of 4.75. To put this into perspective human tooth enamel has a Mohs of around 5 so it is pretty similar. Currently it is $557 an ounce.

Rhodium is massively expensive, currently over $2,000 dollars an ounce (but it doesn’t take much to plate a razor). It has a Mohs of 6, which is the same as Titanium. Gillette plated some of their most special razors with this, I have a British Aristocrat #66 Coronation razor and it is very bright and shiny indeed. Rhodium is becoming increasingly popular for re-plating old razors.

Chrome is the plating of choice for a lot of modern razors from the likes of Merkur, Muhle and Edwin Jagger, it has a Mohs of 8.5 so is pretty hard, but we all know from our experience with cars just how it can be subject to tarnishing if it isn’t done just right.

Of course metal hardness isn’t the only factor when it comes to metal plating, however it does have a huge bearing on durability which makes the Mohs information useful to know.

 

[bordeaaj]

Not so
http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/373287/how_to_care_for_rhodium_plated_jewelry.html
Rhodium is the best tarnish proof material
it is quite soft, wears poorly and is really inferior to hard chrome

Yes, rhodium is inferior to hard chrome, and rhodium plating wear on jewelry is apparently common...and gold or silver plating on jewelry even more common, understandable when you consider the flash on jewelry is extremely thin (allegedly as thin as they can get away with, esp with the more expensive metals due to cost) and often in constant 24hr a day contact with the skin and clothing. With the thinnest of layers jewelers apply there are limits to any platings abrasion-resistance properties.

Still, rhodium is the hardest and longest wearing of the options most razor replating services offer...at least according to the replating services themselves, who also reference the Mohs Hardness Scale for each of their options and claim to apply the plating several times thicker than jewelers do...or Gillette ever did. As well, these are the choices given by the original poster as being under consideration.

Interestingly, I found while searching around that the Mos Hardness Scale is only a relative scale of 1 to 10 and apparently does not measure or compare true or absolute hardness. It will tell you that corundum with it's hardness of 8 is one step above topaz with it's hardness of 7. Diamond at 9 is even harder. What it does not tell you is True Hardness...quoted from one website "for instance, on the True Hardness Scale corundum is twice as hard as topaz, but diamond is almost four times as hard as corundum yet there is only one step between each of these three minerals" on the Mos Hardness Scale. I'm not sure exactly where the metals in question would fall on the True Hardness Scale but extrapolating over from the Mohs Scale it looks like it would be pretty low...gold, silver, and nickel somewhere between 0 and 1 and rhodium between 1 and 2...chrome would be the hardest at just over 2. There are several other scales that deal with absolute hardness as well, such as the The Rosiwal scale e.g. shows the expenditure during the cutting ("cutting hardness"), the Vickers (airplane factory) scale which shows the denting depth of a material. Even though it's just relative, Mohs hardness is apparently always meant when discussing jewelry and gemstones.

 

[dirtdog]

Thanks guys for the clairification I was going on what this stated from the article

I found out early wearing my engagement ring that rhodium plating has a tendency to wear over time. Fortunately for those of us that have rhodium plated jewelry we can have it replated. If the rhodium plating finish wears and how fast is wears depends on the type of metal that is plated and how well and how thick the plating was applied. It also depends on how much the jewelry is worn and how you care for it.

I had my badge plated with the stuff and was VERY UNIMPRESSED WITH IT

 

[bordeaaj]

I had my badge plated with the stuff and was VERY UNIMPRESSED WITH IT

I have heard of some of the lower quality replaters doing absolutely horrible jobs replating razors...I guess they didn't remove the old plating or polish them before replating or something. Most guys who have had their razors done at the more reputable places seem very pleased for the most part.

 

[dirtdog]

I guess the trick is to put it on thick

 

[David in Boston]

...bright nickel will suffice for a replate. It resists abrasion better and also polishes out a lot easier than rhodium...

I'm thinking of re-plating some Gillettes and bright nickel seems like a logical choice.

As for the question of re-plating razors, heck it's your razor you can do what you want.

The only thing is if you sell it you should be a gentleman and tell the buyer of the re-plate.

 

[Freehand]

Thanks Gents. This turned into a very interesting thread....maybe a little more technical than I expected, but interesting nevertheless.

I think I'll go forward with the $65 rhodium replating on an already fairly nice Fatboy.

Just for clarifacation, the objective isn't to fool or deceive anyone about the the razor being new or unused.

The objective is more in the line of "instant gratifacation" and a relatively inexpensive diversion from reality and everyday life. Like some one above said, I just want it to look purty and it makes me feel better when it's shinny!!

When it's done, I'll try to post some before and after shots.

Thanks for all the opinoins.

FREEHAND

 

[Freehand]

Phil....that's a good question, but being a relatively new member, I choose to not "fan the flames", or so to speak.

But just for the record, that's where I intent to send the Fatboy, unless I hear something negative about them in the next few days....

Any comments? Feel free to PM me if you would prefer to not have your comment "on-the-record".

Freehand

 

[Copierguy]

*** Presidents have nickel heads and rhodium handles. ***.

I've got a couple user grade Presidents and the heads look great while the handles are both brassy. Interesting.......

 

[David in Boston]

Phil....that's a good question, but being a relatively new member, I choose to not "fan the flames", or so to speak.

But just for the record, that's where I intent to send the Fatboy, unless I hear something negative about them in the next few days....

Any comments? Feel free to PM me if you would prefer to not have your comment "on-the-record".

Freehand

Would you care to mention pricing?

For example, plating costs using nickel, shining nickel, gold or rhodium.

Thanks

 

[cernel_joson]

Since you're in Boston, there's a replater in Norton who seems to do a lot of work for people here (aside from the member replaters):

Reliable Electroplating, 508 222 0620, ask for Dale the owner. It'll cost about $30 to plate in nickel.

Most of the results have apparently been satisfactory, and one unsatisfactory result was dealt with by talking to the owner.

 

[David in Boston]

Since you're in Boston, there's a replater in Norton who seems to do a lot of work for people here (aside from the member replaters):

Reliable Electroplating, 508 222 0620, ask for Dale the owner. It'll cost about $30 to plate in nickel.

Most of the results have apparently been satisfactory, and one unsatisfactory result was dealt with by talking to the owner.

Thanks for the information.

Just out of curiosity anyone know offhand what type of plating/costs
are offered by these vendors?