single edge vs double edge - change in trend?

[inspectoring]

it seems like fewer people used SE compared to DE but given the new releases, i.e. Paradigm and Vector - both excellent razors, designed to be used daily, - do you think more people would come over to the SE side?

I know this is a rather personal preference -what gives a better smoother shave at the end of the day with all things being equal - DE or SE?

 

[Mick]

Both for me. SE barber blade more than anything else.

 

[Twelvefret]

I find better and smoother to be the result of my technique.

Any razor will work in the right hands with a decent blade.

Beard mapping is essential.

 

[Clay S]

People that like rigid blades will gravitate to SEs, or vintage DE blades.

All things being equal which gives a better shave? I would consider shaving with a SE sans holder, I wouldn't with a DE.

 

[Twelvefret]

People that like rigid blades will gravitate to SEs, or vintage DE blades.

All things being equal which gives a better shave? I would consider shaving with a SE sans holder, I wouldn't with a DE.

Not really. Some of us just want the experience of using various designs.

 

[oldmpf]

I had my first DE Shave of 2019 with a DE Razor yesterday. It was with a LH. Progress and a Lab Blue
blade. I enjoyed the Shave as a change of pace. I personally feel a lot safer when using SE Razors that use Gem/ AC blades.
Today I used an ATT SE1 with a Feather Pro , that blade not being used for some time. The Shave was very good with a superior finish to that of yesterday. For me Vintage/ Modern SEs win hands down, but what works for one is a matter of personal choice.

 

[OldSkoolMillennial]

Im sold on SE over DE. But Ill have both around for variety. SE blades are superior for my face and prefer the blade rigidity from them and SE razors.

I suspect SEs are going to take off soon.

 

[Steve_in_CT]

I've used DE razors for most of my 50 years of shaving, with the exception of a few years of injectors back in my teens and several years of multi-blade cartridges 10 or 15 years ago. I returned to injectors with the Supply a few months ago and then added a Black Hawk AC razor last month. I still use my Game Changer DE from time to time, but for now I'm primarily using those two SE razors. My next razor will probably be another AC razor if I can find a stainless steel model for under $100. I keep hoping that the stainless steel Hawk will be reissued or that someone else will fill that market niche.

 

[Cumberland Sausage]

it seems like fewer people used SE compared to DE but given the new releases, i.e. Paradigm and Vector - both excellent razors, designed to be used daily, - do you think more people would come over to the SE side?

I think more people might come over if there was a wider variety of modern SE razors at lower cost. The asking price for a Paradigm or Vector is a bit frightening to somebody curious to try an SE. The Hawk was one option (and a very good one) but it seems not to be available, and Colonial have dropped SE production for the time being.

As for which type gives the best results, I'm not even certain about that myself. Usually I think the SE wins out, then I use my Timeless .68, Feather AS-D2 or Fasan slant and change my mind, at least until the next time I turn to the ATT SE1, Hawk or Schick injector.

 

[Clay S]

I think more people might come over if there was a wider variety of modern SE razors at lower cost. The asking price for a Paradigm or Vector is a bit frightening to somebody curious to try an SE. The Hawk was one option (and a very good one) but it seems not to be available, and Colonial have dropped SE production for the time being.

As for which type gives the best results, I'm not even certain about that myself. Usually I think the SE wins out, then I use my Timeless .68, Feather AS-D2 or Fasan slant and change my mind, at least until the next time I turn to the ATT SE1, Hawk or Schick injector.

It would be nice for a modern Gem clone to be made, but I would guess no money in it. Too many used gems on the market. Unlike DE razors, that bend/torque the blade, SEs are just held. So not a whole lot of engineering to do.

 

[Esox]

I know this is a rather personal preference -what gives a better smoother shave at the end of the day with all things being equal - DE or SE?

SE, easily to me.

 

[Steve_in_CT]

I think more people might come over if there was a wider variety of modern SE razors at lower cost. The asking price for a Paradigm or Vector is a bit frightening to somebody curious to try an SE. The Hawk was one option (and a very good one) but it seems not to be available, and Colonial have dropped SE production for the time being.

I keep correcting folks on this. The aluminum Hawk is available; it's just the stainless steel version that is not. I bought the aluminum one a few weeks ago when it was only on the Italian Barber ebay store, but since then it's been readily available at IB. (Maybe, like the SS Hawk, it had been unavailable for an extended period of time).

 

[Old Hippie]

It would be nice for a modern Gem clone to be made, but I would guess no money in it.

There's the ATT G1 and the PAA Starling V2, I suspect there are others.

I have both of those -- just now in my...hhmmmm...second week playing with the Starling. I'll be trying the ATT either next or shortly. (I like to plan a month of shaves with each razor. Keeps the RAD down, gives me time to think up new things to try, and I really get to understand how that razor works.)

O.H.

 

[Esox]

It would be nice for a modern Gem clone to be made, but I would guess no money in it.

Something like this?

Sabre GEM Safety Razor

 

[Clay S]

Something like this?

View attachment 961732

Sabre GEM Safety Razor

Looks nothing like one, so it fails as a clone A gem clone made from stamped metal would be quite inexpensive, thus no money in it. Machined metal OTOH. Much nicer, much pricier.

You can get a modern DE for $20-$35. An SE? Not a big enough market for Chinese clones to be made unfortunately.

 

[Clay S]

here's the ATT G1 and the PAA Starling V2

The PAA is in the upper end of the price range I am talking about!

 

[Esox]

Looks nothing like one, so it fails as a clone A gem clone made from stamped metal would be quite inexpensive, thus no money in it. Machined metal OTOH. Much nicer, much pricier.

You can get a modern DE for $20-$35. An SE? Not a big enough market for Chinese clones to be made unfortunately.

Not a clone no, but it does use GEM blades.

The only inexpensive modern SE's I'm aware of are the aluminum RR Hawk and ATT Calypso SE1 but both are AC format not GEM. Only the Hawk is what I'd consider inexpensive and I'd put my MMOC up against either of them.

 

[dotKomo]

I had a Gem and tried it, but never really cottoned to it. I PIF'd it to another B&B forum member.

Then, I was the lucky winner of a generous Xmas PIF (from Kris Kringle) and received a SS Colonial General SE. WOW! Granted, it's a slab, but it will flat out mow down a beard. I can get a BBS nearly every time. I balked a bit and blade prices, until I realized I can easily get 15 plus uses each.

 

[Cumberland Sausage]

I keep correcting folks on this. The aluminum Hawk is available; it's just the stainless steel version that is not. I bought the aluminum one a few weeks ago when it was only on the Italian Barber ebay store, but since then it's been readily available at IB. (Maybe, like the SS Hawk, it had been unavailable for an extended period of time).

Apologies for this. The few vendors here in the UK were out of stock for a while, but one at least seems to have them back on the virtual shelf.

 

[Old Hippie]

Looks nothing like one, so it fails as a clone A gem clone made from stamped metal would be quite inexpensive, thus no money in it.

Aha. I see what you mean. Correct in essence -- I bought a lot of three, two 1912 Gems and a 1914 Ever Ready -- for $7.50. I think the ATT is my most expensive SE razor or will be: I bought the head intending to make a bone handle, but may go back and pick up a nice knurled SS piece instead.

It may coincidentally be easier to set up a stamping operation now that we can use CNC mills to create the dies. There may be a living in it -- lots of us appreciate the north-of-200 razors but don't actually own them. A decent, well-made stamped razor costing, say, $45 at most would find a market.

Slim margin for manufacture, for sure, but then again I have an apparently unused MMCP in original-appearing box marked with a regular price of 50 cents! I wonder what the margin was on that one in 1948 dollars? And they included five blades with each one, all for what we would now pay for one blade AND they apparently made some money.

Just checked the Consumer Price Index (CPI) comparison 1948-2018. Basically ten times more now, so that 50-cent razor would be five bucks (as an equivalence of value, not a direct price comparison). So buying it then would be about the same level of purchase as shelling out five bucks today. The actual PRICE today would likely be far higher.

I also see (Minimum Wage in 1948. How much was inflation?) that the 1948 minimum wage is given as $0.40/hr., equating to $4.29/hr in 2019. Obviously wages have inflated as well. That makes that razor worth a little over an hour of time for a minimum-wage worker. I'll leave it as an exercise for the student to determine what an hour of their time is worth according to their current wage.

But we're hobbyists, and hobbyists will do stuff industry won't touch. A moderately enterprising person could set up a home shop level stamping operation and start turning out Gem razors. (Won't be me; I'm wrapped into a different razor resurrection project...)

O.H.