Scuttles & lather bowls w/ grooves

[RBE17]

I was wondering if anyone else has noticed this. Before I bought a DB lather bowl and a DB one piece double scuttle I used various bowls from the kitchen until I bought a cereal bowl. The cereal bowl is smooth w/ no grooves.

My lather technique using the cereal bowl is to soak the bowl and brush in the sink while showering. Remove bowl, drain brush, load brush and lather. This worked quite well.

My lather technique w/ the scuttle is fill both chambers w/ hot water and soak the brush in the top chamber. Drain the top chamber, refill any water in the lower chamber that poured out, drain brush, load brush and lather. This works, too.

My problem started back in September w/ the DB lather bowl. I enjoy how quickly the grooves made lather, but my lather appeared to be airy and not as dense. I attributed some of it to the fact that the bowl didn't hold enough heat.

Then I bought the scuttle in October. After getting the proper temperature sorted out, it appears the same thing is happening w/ the lather. It also appears that the soap and water separate in the grooves. The lather is still slick, but not nearly as dense.

I'm wondering if anyone else has experienced this.

 

[EFaden]

Tagging this. I have also been wondering myself....

 

[craig87c]

This sounds pretty logical. I do notice I get a thicker, more cushiony lather when I facelather, or in my old bowl (sans groove).

 

[JPM]

For me, I'd have to say I find the grooves in my DB an aid to lathering. I find I get a much better lather in that than I did in the mug I used to use. I did find when I got the water too hot in the scuttle it started to break down the lather. That might be your issue.

 

[mkevenson]

I sold my scuttle and while I wait for the DB, I also have been using a bowl. It makes a fine lather albeit the bowl is a bit large. I wonder where the idea that ridges would help make lather came from?

 

[bulldog]

I presume the grooves aerate and agitate the soap a great deal. Does extra lathering effort may make the lather finer? I often like adding some shave cream to my bowl which makes the lather much denser.

 

[RBE17]

For me, I'd have to say I find the grooves in my DB an aid to lathering. I find I get a much better lather in that than I did in the mug I used to use. I did find when I got the water too hot in the scuttle it started to break down the lather. That might be your issue.

It took me some time to realize making the scuttle too hot could be part of the issue. I should mention that I've done side by side comparisons between the bowl and the scuttle (w/ no water). There is a difference in the lather.

I presume the grooves aerate and agitate the soap a great deal. Does extra lathering effort may make the lather finer? I often like adding some shave cream to my bowl which makes the lather much denser.

Yes, finer. That is a great way to describe it. It has more fluff to it because of the air in it.

 

[oskar]

I wonder where the idea that ridges would help make lather came from?

I guess that would have to be me. My scuttles and mugs have always featured ridges. I still think that ridges help, but they are a bit overrated these days.
The main thing for good lather is the right brush action, ridges cannot replace that. And I agree that lather issues in scuttles are more likely to be a consequence of too much heat.
Greetings
oskar

 

[mkevenson]

I guess that would have to be me. My scuttles and mugs have always featured ridges. I still think that ridges help, but they are a bit overrated these days.
The main thing for good lather is the right brush action, ridges cannot replace that. And I agree that lather issues in scuttles are more likely to be a consequence of too much heat.
Greetings
oskar

Oscar, very interesting! So how did the idea get to the states and the Potters that we love and use?
I agree with the heat issue. In fact I am thinking about getting a new water heater for my scuttle that accurately produces a measured heated water. Now all I have to do is figure out what the optimal temp is for water in the scuttle. Have you figured that one out?

Mark

 

[RBE17]

Now all I have to do is figure out what the optimal temp is for water in the scuttle. Have you figured that one out?

Mark

Mark,

For my scuttle, water, soaps and creams I've tried, water hot enough to keep the lather right above body temperature seems to be the sweet spot. I tried boiling water when I first got it, but all it did was make bad, warm lather. You'll find that some creams and soaps are more sensitive to the heat that others.

 

[JPM]

Oscar, very interesting! So how did the idea get to the states and the Potters that we love and use?
I agree with the heat issue. In fact I am thinking about getting a new water heater for my scuttle that accurately produces a measured heated water. Now all I have to do is figure out what the optimal temp is for water in the scuttle. Have you figured that one out?

Mark

I boil water and fill the outer chamber with it and then fill the inner chamber with hot tap water and soak my brush for about 3 minutes. (I don't put the brush in boiling water so as not to damage it.)

Then I pour all the water out and fill the outer chamber with hot tap water and make lather. That seems to keep the lather nice and warm for at least 3 passes for me.

 

[Gruder]

The point about too much heat breaking down lather is right on target. Boiling water in a scuttle is overkill. If hot tap water doesn't keep your lather warm, you're using a fancified lathering bowl, not a proper scuttle.

 

[oskar]

I have given this ridge origin issue another thought, and I have to correct myself: Back in April 2005, before I started making mugs and scuttles, I asked the members of my German 'home' forum (nassrasur.com) for suggestions for the perfect mug. Someone proposed ridges in the bottom, and I found the idea so convincing that I have incorporated ridges ever since.
As for water temperature, I never measured it. It may be a good guideline to use water that is not quite hot enough to burn your skin. But there are different approaches, it just takes a bit of testing.
Greetings
oskar

 

[dpmtherrien]

I've been using my scuttles, Georgetown G4, and DB, for months now. All I use is hot tap water, and I've had no problems. I use soaps 99% of the time.

 

[bob.e]

My hot water heater does not get the water terribly hot I heat my water to about 160 degrees and fill my scuttle and bowl and let it cool while i shower I empty the lathering bowl portion after the shower and keep the original water in the scuttle half and that seems to work ok if I were to make lather to soon it dies in the bowl

 

[JCalkin]

When I started out in July, I had been using only smooth mugs to lather soaps and creams. In November I attended a student art sale at my college and picked up a pottery bowl for $5.

I didn't tell the artist what I intended to use it for.

I grabbed it b/c it was not smooth on the inside, though it is glazed. It's not exactly ridged either, it's kind of in the middle (let's call a spade a spade - it's imperfect inside).

My initial impression upon using it for the first time was that more air was indeed being mixed into the lather; bubbles were more visible. Also, the lather was exactly as described in this thread, less dense. I've found that the lather in the bumpy pottery bowl takes a bit less water than in the mug for a similar density, but is not as slick as a result. If I want it very slick, it takes enough water to tend towards frothy rather than peaky. Also, different cream formulas seem to react differently to the cream/water/air ratios involved. Musgo is quite nice in the bowl, while Bigelow fares better in the mug.

It just gives me yet MORE options to contemplate each morning, as if DE shaving didn't entail enough early morning decision making...

 

[Rancor16]

I did find when I got the water too hot in the scuttle it started to break down the lather. That might be your issue.

I've had that same thing happen to me when using a bowl filled with hot water (which was much too hot) to warm my mug. It would seem that the lather turns into a substance not unlike melted icecream when it's too hot haha

 

[roughneck]

I have been using my Georgetown G5 for months now with no problems. I do enjoy having warm lather for all of my shaving passes but remain undecided on how much the ridges actually help in the lather making process.

 

[Tedbytes]

Ah yes, the mug-scuttle-lather-temperature conundrum!! My biggest problem was water temperature. I own an Old Spice original Shulton mug, a Dbird, HG and a new Sarah Bonneyman is in the process of shipping. Pre heating the water and vessel for lather work up is essential as everyone has been told. How you transfer the lather,work it up, and apply is the technique; not unlike making a mousse or whipped cream without falling . I start with a full mug of water and use an immersion heater of the coil type, in all my scuttles than can permit the 2 inch diameter heater to enter the fill hole of the scuttle. Most Moss type scuttles and the DB allow this. The new Georgetown G5 addresses this issue with a cork for the heated and trapped water in the base, allowing the top lather bowl which is hot, to be emptied prior to lathering. I simply use the heater again in the lather bowl atop the heated base,dump again the lather water and start with a dollop of soap or cream in the lather bowl. Works for me.

 

[FL shaver]

I came on to post about how the less I develop my lather in the scuttle, the denser, slicker, and creamier my lather seems to wind up. I have been using my scuttle to get an early mix of soap and water, then going to my face to get a nice lather. When I develop lather in the scuttle, I seem to get a lighter, more airy lather that doesn't provide as much glide or cushion. I have noticed this especially in the last month and a half of MdC and MWF shaves. And when I post a photo of bowl lathered MWF or MdC, I get many folks saying the lather looks light and airy!!! There is still some nice, dense lather in the brush, but overall the lather is better if I essentially face lather.