Refreshing edge for each shave

[miankapal]

Dear forum members,

I've been shaving with a straight for several months. Thanks to you all and especially the save clinic where I could find very useful information on how to make this journey.

In my case, I need to refresh the edge before each shave by stropping using an abrasive paste of ca. 1-2 micron. My beard is quite dense and strong and I usually do three passes: WTG, XTG and ATG. I know YMMV, but I would like to ask whether there are also other forum members who also need to refresh the edge for each shave. In general I've always read that once the edge has been sharpened it can take several shaves before needing to strop again with an abrasive paste or use a stone.

It could be that in my case because I do a three pass shave and the characteristics of the beard the edge becomes somewhat dull after a shave. But it could also be that I still have to perfect the technique/shaving angle, although I guess if the angle was not correct I would get either a harsh shave or have more difficulties cutting all the whiskers.

If I do not refresh the edge I can feel more pulling on the hairs and difficulties having a smooth shave.

Look forward to hearing your experiences.

Miguel

 

[kingfisher]

One of our forum members is a big advocate of using balsa with diamond paste between every shave. There is even a long thread about how to do it. At one time there was also a passaround of a couple of razors and the balsa. I participated in it.

It did make for a wicked-sharp edge on a daily basis. I, too, have coarse stubble and I ended up moving from straights back to DE/SE and then back to shavettes because straights just didn't maintain a sharp-enough edge for long enough, and I hated shaving with an edge that wasn't keen enough.

So, you are not alone.

On the other hand, others will likely chime in to say that an edge can be made to last longer with better lather, better shaving technique, and better stropping. I did manage to make one of my edges last about 23 shaves before I needed to refresh it with pasted balsa.

This morning's shave with my Feather SS suggested that the ProGuard I have in there is beginning to dull a bit. All I have to do is take it out and put a new one in and I'm good to go for another couple of weeks. That's the beauty of the shavette for me. YMMV.

 

[M14Shooter]

I love super keen edges and have a very tough beard.My edges usually hold up for 20-25 shaves before the need for a refresh.The type and hardness of steel can have an effect on how often you need to refresh the edge.
You may be over honing causing a wire edge that collapsed on your first shave.I would inspect your edge with a loop and see what you are dealing with.I
I find that with proper stroping an edge should hold for some time.
You may be also rolling your edge if not stroping correctly.

What type and brand of Razor are you using?

 

[miankapal]

Thank you both for your thoughts. I appreciate them.

Regarding the razor: Boker made of carbon steel.

When I shave with a DE, I almost always use a Merkur Futur with a Feather blade dialed at gap #5. I like and need rather sharp edges for my shaves.

 

[M14Shooter]

Was your Boker professionally honed or just the factory edge .Might just need a little work on the bevel and a full progression on the stones.Bokers are very good razors.The factory edge may not be ideal .
Good beard prep and hydration of the whiskers makes a big difference also.

 

[totorlekiller]

One of our forum members is a big advocate of using balsa with diamond paste between every shave.

I believe diamond paste is 0.1 to 0.25 microns, which would be a very different proposition to the 1-2 Microns paste mentioned by the OP.

1-2 is like a finishing stone, so it seems a bit unnecessary. I wonder if more stropping or stropping on a better quality strop might do instead.
When I started, someone told me that unless he stropped 50 each way, it did not work for him. So not knowing any better, I copied it. To which I added since 50 on the canvas side, before the 100 on leather.

If that is not sufficient still, you might want to get diamond paste or CrOx, which would still refresh the edge, but would not wear the blade as much as the 1-2 micron paste you are currently using.

 

[bromsvajer]

I do 10-20 laps on lightly pasted leather, waterbased .5 diamonds (not sure if it matters if its oil or waterbased, possibly it does). This gives an edge that treetop my fine ladylike armhair. For me stropping on clean leather doesnt improve edge in a noticible way, so I dont.

I think this edge is like a medium sharp DE blade.

 

[ajduplessis]

Leather stropping is essential to maintain your edge before and after shaves, it will not increase sharpness. Once a razor is shave ready only strop on leather until it requires a refresh. The refresh you can do on diamond but have a seperate stop for this, preferably leather glued to a flat stable backing such as wood.

You will soon have to reset/refine the bevel if you keep stopping on diamond for each shave IME.

 

[ajduplessis]

Well hydrated whiskers is not the toughest stuff around. Any keen smooth edge will cut them easily with proper technique and preparation.

 

[macintoshBR]

I do 3-4 laps on mastro livi Chrome oxide strop after each shave, I believe it make the edges last significantly longer

 

[ajduplessis]

I do 3-4 laps on mastro livi Chrome oxide strop after each shave, I believe it make the edges last significantly longer

do you have one of his razors? pics plz

 

[macintoshBR]

do you have one of his razors? pics plz

I don't, only the small strop. His razors are beautiful and true works of art, but I feel they are a little overpriced and couldn't justify spending that much on a razor.

 

[Slash McCoy]

1-2 microns daily is overkill. And if you are stropping on leather pasted with this, you are doing your razor no big favor, IYAM.
I suggest lapped and pasted balsa. But first, you need a truly sharp edge with a precise bevel to begin with. Stones of good quality can be used, yes, as long as your finish is without slurry and the stone if natural is at least equivelant to a 12k Naniwa. My usual preference is for lapping film on a 3/4" thick, 3" x 12" block of acrylic. When properly used, this will give you a good foundation to build upon with the balsa. See THIS THREAD, for what we call "The Method". When your edge is dialed in up to the 12k level, you can run a balsa progression at .5u, .25u, and .1u diamond paste, separate balsas lapped and treated with each grit. Your edge should be the sharpest you have ever seen, at that point, if you can follow directions which I admit are not simple. Lots of details to see to, details that will compromise the edge quality if you wander away from the path. And now finally, strop on CLEAN hanging leather, that has never been pasted (this is very important!!!) and shave.
Now with the Method Edge on the razor, after your shave you can revisit the .1u balsa. I go 50 very light laps after every shave. Then before shaving, I strop as normal on clean hanging leather. This regimen will keep your razor shaving nicely basically forever. I have never had to rehone a razor since dialing this method in.

 

[Squinty]

Hi first post from a newb.

I do it all wrong

with all honestly I'm awful with a hanging strop, carpal tunnel, RA and ulnar nerve surgery two years ago...its an exercise in turning the edge over.

I have two oil soaked saddle leather strops which have been treated with green (0.3-0.5m?) and red (0.1m) paste.
Depends on how often I use the blade and for all of the novice honing I do...some of the vintage SRs I have simply won't hold an edge.

And I use that flat on the kitchen worktop with a quick squirt of veg oil, I run the blade up with two fingers in the hollow just under the spine.
Green after the hone or if I feel they aren't shaving that well, before/after or between directions with red.

Works for me.
Am I doing my 80-90-100 year old blades a disservice?
Certainly no more than letting them continue to rust away in a drawer.

 

[Slash McCoy]

Hi first post from a newb.

I do it all wrong

with all honestly I'm awful with a hanging strop, carpal tunnel, RA and ulnar nerve surgery two years ago...its an exercise in turning the edge over.

I have two oil soaked saddle leather strops which have been treated with green (0.3-0.5m?) and red (0.1m) paste.
Depends on how often I use the blade and for all of the novice honing I do...some of the vintage SRs I have simply won't hold an edge.

And I use that flat on the kitchen worktop with a quick squirt of veg oil, I run the blade up with two fingers in the hollow just under the spine.
Green after the hone or if I feel they aren't shaving that well, before/after or between directions with red.

Works for me.
Am I doing my 80-90-100 year old blades a disservice?
Certainly no more than letting them continue to rust away in a drawer.

A disservice? Your razor, your face. Yes, using The Method would give you far better results. But methods must sometimes adapt to the user and his situation.

But I am not sure I understand. You mean the spine is elevated a finger's thickness above the pasted strop? You REALLY ought to rehone and then strop ALWAYS with the spine on the strop. What you are doing is applying about a 45 degree secondary bevel to a normal ~17 degree base bevel. That it shaves at all is almost miraculous. And are you not stropping on clean leather immediately prior to shaving?

How do you hone? Do you also hone with the spine elevated a finger's thickness? That is really not good. I don't think anyone here would disagree with me on that, and we always disagree on everything, arguing ceaselessly.

Instead of flipping the razor the way most of us do, maybe you can simply loosen your grip and use your off hand to turn the razor over by the blade. You could also maybe make up a piece of rope with an eye big enough to put your foot in, to tension the strop. Table stropping with paste is better IMHO than hanging strop with paste, but for final clean leather stropping I do believe strongly that a hanging strop is superior.

Have you considered switching to a shavette? As long as it is one that holds the blade securely, the only real difference is that the edge is a lot sharper than the average straight razor edge, and so you have to be even more vigilant with shave angle and skin stretching. Before I retired I was taking cheap shavettes and Feather DE blades with me aboard ship and once my technique was dialed in, my shaves were as good as straight razor shaves.

 

[Squinty]

no, the spine isn't elevated. Its flat to the leather and I push and pull the blade with two fingers against the spine...in the hollow. Just applying even light pressure across the full width of the blade, polishing slow and easy.

You seem to be thinking (to me at least) of 'two fingers' ie whisky measure .

Of course I could simply be waving the blade in the air; 2 fingers away from the strop altogether.
Sharpen/ed on Sun/light? ...by hec/k thats sha/arp

Ah yes..no problem turning the razor, just my stropping literally turns the shaving edge over.

Errr no I haven't considered a shavette, I'd never heard of one until I'd perused the Great Bay of Evils for a vintage SR.
Some variation on a box-cutter isn't it?

Nothing wrong with some healthy disagreement and with my poor descriptions it must be so easy to get confused when you pass retirement age.

 

[Slash McCoy]

Ah. Okay then. Things are not as bad as I had feared. No, a shavette is not much like a box cutter except that it accepts disposable blades. Some use semi proprietary long blades and can be quite expensive, though they are well engineered. Feather is sort of the benchmark in that category. Then there are others that use half of a DE blade, and are way cheaper and more popular. Sallys Beauty Supply is one brick and mortar establishment where you can buy these. The price keeps going up up up, but they should still be under ten bucks. They also sell Personna DE blades, which are not bad. I prefer Feather DE blades, and they are surprisingly cheap if you buy 100 online. I like to keep two of these shavettes, so when I snap a blade in half I have a place to put both halves. Feather blades are generally acknowledged to be the sharpest, though some few argue it is subjective and not an accurate assessment.

Shavettes are infamous for being unforgiving of shortcomings in shave technique. But once you are dialed in, the shave can be quite good, better than a DE razor and as good as a very very very sharp straight razor. More importantly for you, no honing or stropping needed. Each half blade should give you a week's good shaves. Then you simply toss the blade. Wasteful? Yes, but not so very, owing to the low cost of DE blades when properly sourced. Try fleabay, 100 blade lots.

Properly speaking, "Shavette" is a trademark for Dovo's disposable blade razors, and the genuine Dovo Shavette has a lot of fans. Me, I prefer the cheapies and DE blades. YMMV but I think it is a good place to start. Minimal capital outlay compared to higher quality solutions, so if it doesn't work well for you, no big loss.