\PTR91 - Opinions?

[dreadpirate]

I live in a place where there will be an assault gun ban come 1 Oct. The PTR91, a 308 caliber semi auto, is a clone (I believe) of the HK 91. The HK 91 and all it's "copies" are banned. Interestingly enough, the AR10 (also a semi-auto 308) IS NOT BANNED.

I am trying to get a feel for what experience folks have had with the PTR91 to see if it is worth getting before the ban.

 

[ChefJohnBoy-ardee]

If you are fine with iron sights and you don't reload sure. Sure you can scope them but the scope base looks like a PITA.

If the AR10's are anywhere close on price I would pay. It also depends on the manufacturer of the PTR91. There are some less than reputable copies out there but that could also be mostly internet gossip that I took to truth.

 

[dreadpirate]

Also thinking about a FAL (DSA FAL SA58). Actually, my current ranking is AR10, DSA FAL, and the PTR is a distant third. And if I go with an AR 10, then I have time on my side. If I want the FAL I have to act soon.

OBTW both the FAL and the PTR can be had with picatinny rails on top to mount a scope.

 

[ia_james]

Nothing against the individual platform, but the lack of standards for the AR-10 would lead me to drop it from consideration. Lack of part interchangeability, mags not fitting, etc.

 

[DueceMcCracken]

I had a wonderful CETME, mint wood furniture to boot. Tons of fun to shoot, and the mags were mil-surp and dirt cheap. I got 20rd aluminum mags for like 1.50 each. This was a bit ago obviously. The CETME was the predecessor to the HK, i never had any issues with the roller delayed blowback, but from a technical perspective I don't like it at all. If i had the funds, I would go FAL or AR-10. AR-10 allows you to have different uppers that you can swap onto the same lower, if they are compatible. the ar-10 platform is not standardized from make to make. Which would allow you to have a shorty close quarters set-up, and a long range set-up to one serialized lower.

 

[dreadpirate]

Nothing against the individual platform, but the lack of standards for the AR-10 would lead me to drop it from consideration. Lack of part interchangeability, mags not fitting, etc.

Good point.

 

[MrMurphy]

In the classics category, the FAL wins over the G-3 (HK91).

FAL shoots smoother, has a better trigger, far better ergonomics. The G-3 was adopted by the Germans because the Belgians wouldn't let them build FALs. Considering two world wars, I don't blame them.

The HK isn't bad, but the FAL is a better shooter.

AR-10s are a wide open field, some are awesome (OBR), some are barely functional (DPMS) and there's 2-3 kinds of magazines in use. If money isn't an issue the OBR or KAC SR-25 are the two best out there (having shot both extensively and being involved in the testing of one of them). If money is an issue and you're not worried about one-hole accuracy, the FAL will shoot reliably with nearly any kind of ammo, with irons, is about a 2-3 MOA rifle, similar to an M16A2.

DSA Arms makes about the best FALs in teh world, being one of two manufacturers still making FALs, and they have modernized FAL updates (picatinny rail fore-ends, etc).

 

[Wullie]

I have to vote for the FAL platform. L1A1/StG58 etc etc. FAL's are full auto capable and REALLY pricey when you can find one. Not a lot of fun to shoot full auto either. Impressive but not real effective.

HELL of a rifle. Not picky about ammo as you can adjust the gas on 'em.

Downside is they're a bit on the heavy side. They weigh in about the same as Garand.

They are sweet shooters. I had an L1A1 and still kicking my rear end for selling it. Bought an StG58 last T'giving before things went nuts price wise.

Ammo is slowly becoming available again without having to consider sale of the left one to finance the transaction.

 

[mongoose]

There is nothing wrong with the PTR91 if it fits you and your needs. You are getting many opinions that are not correct. The FAL was already being sold to the Germans and FN refused to grant the license because they would not license it at the same price that they were giving everyone and their dog. Germany went to Spain and purchased the CETME that was a refined German designed Stg 45 that Dr. Ludwig Vorgimler enhanced.

The rifles in question are NOT platforms.

 

[dreadpirate]

In the classics category, the FAL wins over the G-3 (HK91).
The HK isn't bad, but the FAL is a better shooter.

That in a nutshell is what I have been seeing on various bulletin boards. Nothing bad about a PTR91, just that the FAL is "better".

I have pretty much decided to for the AR 10 route some time next year since I would rather not make this purchase now. The well is running dry from firearms purchases this year trying to beat the "Gun Control" legislation in my state that takes effect on 1 Oct. Also - I promised my son I would take him hunting this season - so yet another diversion of funds.

Thanks for all the info.

 

[MrMurphy]

They sold the Germans some FALs as the G-1, but you can bet less than ten years after the second time the Germans invaded their country, Belgium was not about to give them a sweetheart deal like the rest of NATO, Soviet threat or not.

The G-3/CETME did come from Mauser's late war prototypes. It's not a bad rifle, but I've shot both enough to know i'd rather have the FAL if I had the choice. I'd roll with the G-3 if it was issued, but I wouldn't choose one over the FAL.

Most countries with experience with both seemed to support that idea, I know in Rhodesia they went to the HK only when FALs became unavailable. Those that picked the HK from the start stuck with it (like Norway).

 

[dreadpirate]

Ok - I am now doubling back. Looks like the PTR91 is back on the table. I know the FAL is better in some ways, but the PTR91GI is a good value, very cool (IMHO), and I have read a lot of favorable reviews about them.


http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/com...939-atlanticfirearms-com-detail.html?Itemid=0

I was considering this IMBEL FAL but it has an Enterprize Arms receiver that has horrible reviews that have sort of put me off; although the price is right. Not to mention it's a 21 inch barrel versus an 18 inch with the PTR 91GI.

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/com...l-imbel-308-battle-rifle-detail.html?Itemid=0

 

[MrMurphy]

The diopter sight takes a bit of getting used to, but shoots well. The PTR is 'not' an HK, but overall, they generally shoot pretty well from all i've seen. I've handled a couple but have only shot the legit HK product.

Don't ever (ever......ever.....ever) plan on reloading anything you shoot through the PTR. The HK design throws brass about 15-20 feet and does a number on it. I've seen a HK91 throw brass the length of a 25m pistol range bench (around 30 feet sideways) much to the surprise of everyone to his right.... The fixed stock is far superior for shooting and general use, but the "A3" type strut collapsing stock is very compact. If you cut a couple extra detents for the lock you can make it various lengths like an M4 stock. Savvy Bundeswehr guys who still have access to G-3s for special purposes have been known to do this. A senior sergeant I ran into showed me on his G3SG/1 or whatever their DMR version is now called.

The stock HK safety is not user friendly, you either have double jointed thumbs or use the off hand to manipulate it. Reloads are similar in speed to an AK.

 

[dreadpirate]

PTR91 GI on the way!! (my "distant third" choice originally). Got it for $400 less than the prices I saw at a gun show yesterday, where I was able to handle one. Can I have my cake and eat it too? Can I still get a FAL??? Maybe - I could get a FAL receiver for $400 ish, using the money I just "saved"

 

[MrMurphy]

If you decide to stick an optic on it, Bruegger & Thomet (imported by DSA, who makes FALs) are the only guys who make a Picatinny rail system that works for HK91 type rifles that's actually worth anything.

Pretty much if you want to modernize the gun post 1990, B&T is the company who does it.

 

[dreadpirate]

If you decide to stick an optic on it, Bruegger & Thomet (imported by DSA, who makes FALs) are the only guys who make a Picatinny rail system that works for HK91 type rifles that's actually worth anything.

Pretty much if you want to modernize the gun post 1990, B&T is the company who does it.

Yep:

http://www.dsarms.com/B&T - Brugger & Thomet/products/166/