"Notes" question

[rearviewmirror]

I understand the topnotes (initial spray)/middle notes (as it dries)/basenotes (dried, also the longest lasting, and the 'true' scent).

Now my question is...how does the perfumer 'make' the topnotes/middle/base?
Is it something that even can be determined, or are certain notes just always going to be a top/middle/base?
I always see citrus notes as top notes, which I assume because they're fleeting.
I always see rose notes as middle notes.
I always see cedar and vetiver as basenotes.

Not sure if I even made this question clear, but could you somehow "make" a scent that had vetiver as a topnote, or citrus as a basenote, or is it really just mixing different scents and then they fall wherever they do on the pyramid?

 

[Lynchmeister]

Nope, it is what it is and you'll never see something like citrus in the base notes and we've got nobody but chemistry, or more specifically, the volatility of the fragrance molecules to blame. While all of the notes are there at the initial application, the top notes are the most volatile and will evaporate (and be detected by the nose) first, followed by the heart and basenotes, which of course are increasingly less volatile in relation to the notes before them.

Edit: For all I know, with the advent of synthetics, my blurb above could possibly go right out the window.

 

[StylinLA]

Nope, it is what it is and you'll never see something like citrus in the base notes and we've got nobody but chemistry, or more specifically, the volatility of the fragrance molecules to blame. While all of the notes are there at the initial application, the top notes are the most volatile and will evaporate (and be detected by the nose) first, followed by the heart and basenotes, which of course are increasingly less volatile in relation to the notes before them.

Edit: For all I know, with the advent of synthetics, my blurb above could possibly go right out the window.

No, that's pretty much it I think...there is something more to this that is not easily understood I fear...something about the nature of "scent" in that in spite of synthetic aroma chemicals, there are no long lasting citrus scents. I suppose that may change in time. But as a fan of lime scents, I've never run into one with any kind of longevity. Can't believe that were it possible, Trumpers Extract of Limes would not use a synthetic that lasted more than 30 minutes.

We need a chemist/perfumer to weigh in here.

I believe the nature of the note is what dictates whether it is top, heart or base. You can't jumble the order of them as you wish. Everything is present when you spray it on, but as top notes fade away, the reveal the middle and so on...
i believe too, some of the base notes are likely scents that don't reveal themselves right away, and evolve/develop over time.

 

[Evbo]

I believe the nature of the note is what dictates whether it is top, heart or base. You can't jumble the order of them as you wish. Everything is present when you spray it on, but as top notes fade away, the reveal the middle and so on...
i believe too, some of the base notes are likely scents that don't reveal themselves right away, and evolve/develop over time.

Indeed. I've found this to be especially true with essential oils. Some of them have so much complexity in & of themselves -- rose, especially -- that even the scent of a single EO will evolve over time.

 

[Lynchmeister]

i believe too, some of the base notes are likely scents that don't reveal themselves right away, and evolve/develop over time.

Indeed. I've found this to be especially true with essential oils. Some of them have so much complexity in & of themselves -- rose, especially -- that even the scent of a single EO will evolve over time.

This is the epitome of what can be described as my simultaneous fascination and frustration with perfume. I can speculate all day on the how and why of it (the wearer's body chemistry, environmental factors {temp, indoors/outdoors, competing odors, etc.}, mood,...the list goes on!), but at the end of the day, I think the key (read: the key for my sanity ) is to accept it as something mysterious and wonderful and leave it at that.

 

[Lamb Root]

Rosemary for example in Villoresi's Wild Lavender is in the base notes, and in most other fragrances in top. (And it really is)

 

[nole1]

Rosemary for example in Villoresi's Wild Lavender is in the base notes, and in most other fragrances in top. (And it really is)

This is purely speculation but that could be because rosemary happens to be the least volatile in that range of notes while in others, it's the most volatile.

 

[Schad]

It's a great question and one I've wondered about myself.

 

[jakespoppy]

It's one of those questions I could sit and contemplate for hours and feel I never get closer to an answer. In addition to volitility, I've read of top notes described as made of molecules that are "smaller and lighter" that therefore rise and evaporate faster so they are more noticeable first but last for shorter periods of time.

 

[Ron991]

Fragrant materials are listed in order of volatility and are grouped under respective evaporation coefficients (perfume notes) that range from 1 to 100.

Top Notes:	1 to 14 (most volatile)
Middle Notes:	15 to 60
Base Notes:	61 to 100 (least volatile)

 

[Schad]

Some of my ex gf's would have fit into the topnotes category

 

[jakespoppy]

Some of my ex gf's would have fit into the topnotes category

They smelled really good for 15 minutes.....?

 

[BigAlum]

+1 Thanks rearviewmirror for asking this question. I have just started my journey with fragrances and the evolution of a particular frags scent over time is a wonderful yet heretofore mystery for me.

 

[Lamb Root]

This is purely speculation but that could be because rosemary happens to be the least volatile in that range of notes while in others, it's the most volatile.

Yes, I agree, but one can always try for himself.

 

[Shmu]

Some of my ex gf's would have fit into the topnotes category

I have to ask, are you saying that they fit into the "most volatile" category, or are you saying that they fit into the "1 to 14" category?

 

[ShaveThis]

+1 Thanks rearviewmirror for asking this question. I have just started my journey with fragrances and the evolution of a particular frags scent over time is a wonderful yet heretofore mystery for me.

Please let me add my thanks to rearviewmirror for asking this question. So much to know about frags and I'm just starting, so this is very helpful. Wish I had something to add.

 

[StylinLA]

Wish I had something to add.

Hangi n here, sample some stuff and you'll have plenty to add.

None us are rocket scientists, we just read a bit and try a lot of stuff.

 

[ShaveThis]

Thanks for the encouragement. I am starting to acquire a number of samples, I just have to keep track of them all. I better start a little book for both my impressions and what my wife likes and dislikes (as I just found out).
I'm really glad that some of the people on B&B sell samples.

 

[rearviewmirror]

Pete, your best bet is to ignore what the wife likes/dislikes. If shes anything like most of ours, you can wear something 2 days in a row and one day she'll love it and the next will hate it.

 

[ShaveThis]

You know I've read that here on the board and it's probably true. I'm going to try that little experiment to see.
Besides, I wear the pants in this family.