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No Timeless SE razor :(

Just a note: Comparing the Blackbird and Vector is a strange exercise, in my opinion. Sure, we make them both, but they're completely different. A bit like cross-shopping a Toyota Prius and Toyota Supra. Far better to compare them with similar products of different makes than to compare intra-brand.
Shane, if you ever consider making a Vector 2.0, say with half the blade gap as the current one, I believe many would get that small gapped head. I for one would.
 
Wow...that's quite an endorsement considering the elite razors you put up for sale! 😲
I think your nuanced description makes a lot of sense. Thank you for explaining the differences in feel!
How would you compare the feel of the Vector with the feel of the Blackbird? I found it had way too much blade feel, even though it did not cause any nicks, cuts, or post-shave irritation. Shane tried to convince me to give it at least a week, but it was nothing doing. That "bird" felt like it was ripping the skin off my face!

Like others have commented, it's not really fair to compare the Vector and Blackbird. Honestly it's really hard to compare the Vector against any DE razor because the AC blade and design of the Vector just make it such a unique razor. In terms of blade feel alone, the Vector doesn't have nearly as much as the Blackbird. But more than that, the AC blades just don't feel the same as DE blades so that's why I say it's a hard comparison to make. If smoothness/comfort are your top concerns, the Sabre Level 1 is the way to go. The Sabre is on par with the Timeless .68 in terms of smoothness IMO. For me personally, the end result I get from the Vector is well worth giving up that extra bit of smoothness during the shave. Like I said, zero irritation, and like DaveHStone said, once you get it dialed in the Vector is really an auto-pilot-easy razor.

My favorite AC blade is the Kai Captain Mild, I find it to be a lot smoother and does a better job on my face than the others. Many people say the Proline or Feather Pros are sharper/smoother/whatever, but I personally found those to be more "tuggy" when I use them. The Kai ProTouch are the only other AC blade I've found that I like, but they are slightly more expensive than the Kai Captain Milds. If you're going to give the Vector a try you may get a bit smoother shave using the guarded blades. For the Sabre there's really only 1 blade option, so that kind of makes it simple.
 
Brother, I hear what you are saying and my thoughts are exactly the same.

Vector is the best razor ever, but it's far from smooth. It has a HUGE blade gap and significant blade feel. It requires a rather special technique, which is a combination of constant pressure and changing angle. Once mastered, it indeed shaves like no other, but I agree there are many far smoother/milder razors.
Can you go into a little more depth of what you mean "changing angle"? You are changing the angle (steeper or shallower) depending on the part of the face you are shaving?
 
Shane, if you ever consider making a Vector 2.0, say with half the blade gap as the current one, I believe many would get that small gapped head. I for one would.
Although I have not tried the Vector yet, I am the opposite (experience from other razors). I like larger gaps but less (preferably neutral) blade exposure. I find that combination gives me the most comfortable shave. It is my theory on why the Wolfman WR2 is so lauded as the smoothest and most efficient DE . There is simply no other razor that has larger gap but also comparatively lower blade exposure. Winning combo in my opinion! :001_cool:
 
Shane, if you ever consider making a Vector 2.0, say with half the blade gap as the current one, I believe many would get that small gapped head. I for one would.

Pretty unlikely, at least for the foreseeable future. Honestly, the Vector is so popular as-is that we have a hard time keeping them stocked and it has strong reviews and a vanishingly small return rate. So I don't intend on messing with success and introducing additional variants, especially while we're struggling to meet demand. Plus, blade choice can adjust aggressiveness so much that the benefit of multiple aggressiveness levels is mitigated.
 
Just a note: Comparing the Blackbird and Vector is a strange exercise, in my opinion. Sure, we make them both, but they're completely different. A bit like cross-shopping a Toyota Prius and Toyota Supra. Far better to compare them with similar products of different makes than to compare intra-brand.
Understood. Thanks, Shane! I'm more of a Honda man...but I wouldn't mine a Supra!
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Now, just give us a Sabre Ti and all will be well with the world! ;)
 
The Vector feels completely different from the Blackbird. The bird have a lot of blade feel and makes you respect it. The vector is a lot smoother. Not ripping face feel.
There just a little blade feel and it is a blade feel that is not menacing at all. But it is crazy efficient. The AC blades are very different from DE blades.
Can't wait to try the Vector Ti 😍
 
The Vector feels completely different from the Blackbird. The bird have a lot of blade feel and makes you respect it. The vector is a lot smoother. Not ripping face feel.
There just a little blade feel and it is a blade feel that is not menacing at all. But it is crazy efficient. The AC blades are very different from DE blades.
Thanks for your insight!
 
Brother, I hear what you are saying and my thoughts are exactly the same.

Vector is the best razor ever, but it's far from smooth. It has a HUGE blade gap and significant blade feel. It requires a rather special technique, which is a combination of constant pressure and changing angle. Once mastered, it indeed shaves like no other, but I agree there are many far smoother/milder razors.
Thanks for your insight. I will try the Vector Ti but something tells me it may not be for me. I'm not big into blade feel (the Blackbird taught me that!) and I'm not sure my technique is "special" enough at this point to master such a tool 🤔
 
Brother, I hear what you are saying and my thoughts are exactly the same.

Vector is the best razor ever, but it's far from smooth. It has a HUGE blade gap and significant blade feel. It requires a rather special technique, which is a combination of constant pressure and changing angle. Once mastered, it indeed shaves like no other, but I agree there are many far smoother/milder razors.

Hi Dave
A big YMMV on this one. I find the VectorSB one of the smoothest, if not the smoothest of my SE razors, and I have a reasonable size stable.

Some find the SS Hawkv3 very smooth, in my hands its a bit harsh. So there you have it, sometimes razor feel is mysterious![emoji2962][emoji33]
 
Pretty unlikely, at least for the foreseeable future. Honestly, the Vector is so popular as-is that we have a hard time keeping them stocked and it has strong reviews and a vanishingly small return rate. So I don't intend on messing with success and introducing additional variants, especially while we're struggling to meet demand. Plus, blade choice can adjust aggressiveness so much that the benefit of multiple aggressiveness levels is mitigated.
Well... Sabre has L1 and L2... perhaps one day you can add just one addittional base plate with smaller gap to the Vector's offering. Just a thought from a very happy user 😉
 
Hi Dave
A big YMMV on this one. I find the VectorSB one of the smoothest, if not the smoothest of my SE razors, and I have a reasonable size stable.

Some find the SS Hawkv3 very smooth, in my hands its a bit harsh. So there you have it, sometimes razor feel is mysterious![emoji2962][emoji33]
OH absolutely it is YMMV.

For example, to me the Vector's OC plate has always felt smoother than the SB... Go figure.

I contribute this to combs allowing lather to penetrate deeper, but who knows.

In any case Vector is fantastic razor, the best purchase I've made in this hobby.
 
Hi Dave
A big YMMV on this one. I find the VectorSB one of the smoothest, if not the smoothest of my SE razors, and I have a reasonable size stable.

Some find the SS Hawkv3 very smooth, in my hands its a bit harsh. So there you have it, sometimes razor feel is mysterious![emoji2962][emoji33]

I'm convinced that a big part of the "YMMV" factor is lack of clearly defined terms. "Smooth" may mean different things to different people. Some people think of smooth as in not harsh, rough, etc... Others think of smooth in terms of how easily/effortlessly the blade cuts through hair. Some think of it in terms of how much blade you can feel during the shave. I'm sure there are other factors that weigh in to smoothness as well.

For instance, many people say Voskhod or Personna Labs are very smooth blades. For me they are very tuggy, so I don't describe them as smooth at all. On the contrary, sharper blades like Feather or Gillette Blacks cut through my hair very easily and don't leave a whole lot of "tactile feel" as they do their job. I would imagine how fine or coarse your hair is, or how thick your beard is, plays a big role in personal perception of smooth.

All that being said, I wanted to clarify my statement about the Vector. I think the lighter weight and lower profile head doesn't have a lot of mass to it, and therefore there is more tactile feel as the blade cuts the hairs. In that sense, I don't find it to be an overly smooth shaver (compared to the Sabre or a Timeless SS .68, for example). However, in terms of being harsh, aggressive, menacing, rough, etc... I do not find the Vector to be any of those things. I never feel at risk of cutting or irritating my skin, I don't need to overly concentrate while shaving, and I can use it every single day with 100% comfort. So in that sense I agree that it is a very smooth shaver.
 
I'm convinced that a big part of the "YMMV" factor is lack of clearly defined terms. "Smooth" may mean different things to different people. Some people think of smooth as in not harsh, rough, etc... Others think of smooth in terms of how easily/effortlessly the blade cuts through hair. Some think of it in terms of how much blade you can feel during the shave. I'm sure there are other factors that weigh in to smoothness as well.

For instance, many people say Voskhod or Personna Labs are very smooth blades. For me they are very tuggy, so I don't describe them as smooth at all. On the contrary, sharper blades like Feather or Gillette Blacks cut through my hair very easily and don't leave a whole lot of "tactile feel" as they do their job. I would imagine how fine or coarse your hair is, or how thick your beard is, plays a big role in personal perception of smooth.

All that being said, I wanted to clarify my statement about the Vector. I think the lighter weight and lower profile head doesn't have a lot of mass to it, and therefore there is more tactile feel as the blade cuts the hairs. In that sense, I don't find it to be an overly smooth shaver (compared to the Sabre or a Timeless SS .68, for example). However, in terms of being harsh, aggressive, menacing, rough, etc... I do not find the Vector to be any of those things. I never feel at risk of cutting or irritating my skin, I don't need to overly concentrate while shaving, and I can use it every single day with 100% comfort. So in that sense I agree that it is a very smooth shaver.
Food 🥘 for thought 💭 👍🏻
Thank you!
 
I define "smooth" as comfortable (no nicks, cuts, or irritation...plus no excessive blade feel). I don't mind some blade feel (à la the Tatara), but if the razor constantly makes me think, "There's a sharp object on my face! There's a sharp object on my face!" (à la Blackbird), then I consider it excessive blade feel. Now, what others think of smooth in terms of how easily/effortlessly the blade cuts through hair, I would define as "efficient".

I agree with you about the blades, the fact that half the guys around here consider the Voshkod the greatest blade ever notwithstanding. 😂 I find it extremely rough. OTOH, while many consider the Feather too harsh, I also find it incredibly smooth (no nicks, cuts, or irritation) plus extremely efficient. Of course, I've learned with the Feather to use a very light touch...and have now carried that over to my other blades, resulting in zero alum feedback for weeks! ;)

Your last paragraph beautifully articulates what I hope will be my experience with the Vector. Lightweight + low profile + tactile + 100% comfort sounds like a winner to me!
 
Like others have commented, it's not really fair to compare the Vector and Blackbird. Honestly it's really hard to compare the Vector against any DE razor because the AC blade and design of the Vector just make it such a unique razor. In terms of blade feel alone, the Vector doesn't have nearly as much as the Blackbird. But more than that, the AC blades just don't feel the same as DE blades so that's why I say it's a hard comparison to make. If smoothness/comfort are your top concerns, the Sabre Level 1 is the way to go. The Sabre is on par with the Timeless .68 in terms of smoothness IMO. For me personally, the end result I get from the Vector is well worth giving up that extra bit of smoothness during the shave. Like I said, zero irritation, and like DaveHStone said, once you get it dialed in the Vector is really an auto-pilot-easy razor.

My favorite AC blade is the Kai Captain Mild, I find it to be a lot smoother and does a better job on my face than the others. Many people say the Proline or Feather Pros are sharper/smoother/whatever, but I personally found those to be more "tuggy" when I use them. The Kai ProTouch are the only other AC blade I've found that I like, but they are slightly more expensive than the Kai Captain Milds. If you're going to give the Vector a try you may get a bit smoother shave using the guarded blades. For the Sabre there's really only 1 blade option, so that kind of makes it simple.
Thank you. I'm going to start at the 'top' (Vector Ti) and work my way 'down' (Sabre...Hawk...etc.). I'm tempted to get all three at once (like I did with many DEs), but I'm in no rush now that I have my Timeless...and I want to give each a fair shot. As you said, we are talking about different platforms, and the Vector is unique even among SEs. I ordered a sample pack of AC blades...plus regular dispensers of Kai Pink and ProTouch...so hopefully, my first shaves won't be too bad. I just have to be patient with myself and with the new razor and not send it back after the first shave! ✈
 
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