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Newbie here! Hello and some questions

Sam Hanwich

Sam Hanwich

I recently started wet shaving and whenever I search on a shaving question, Google directs me to a thread at B&B so I decided to join the forum and here I am :)

From what I can tell so far, this is not your typical internet forum. I mean it seems like a friendly spot to share ideas and, for the most part, treat each other with respect even when opinions differ.

I've really been enjoying the shaves I've been getting but I have a couple of questions. Until such time as I succumb to AD (inevitable) and start hoarding exotic razors machined from fancy materials, I remain a mere mortal shaving with a DE89 and getting perfectly wonderful results.

I have many questions from all my searches and reading various conflicting opinions. I fully expect to hear "you're over thinking things" and I'm sure that I am. However overthinking things is something I enjoy, so it is not a "problem", for me at least, to overthink things. Rather it is part of the experience so please indulge my overthinking and asking questions 🤓

I've read many posts saying how the threaded post on the DE89 will break off easily if dropped. Well simple, I just won't drop it. :letterk1:
Some posts say the Mühle version uses brass for the threaded post so is improved over the EJ version. There are also many posts saying zamac will quickly corrode and those posts may show pictures of a zamac cap with a gnarly lump where the threaded post once was. Some things that jump to my questioning mind:

Isn't Zinc what you coat nails with so they won't corrode in the outside weather? Why would a zamac razor corrode?

I'm deliberately saying "corrode" rather than "rust" although many of the posts I read use the word "rust". I may be wrong but I thought "rust" applies only to Iron (Iron Oxide) and I wouldn't expect they use iron in the zamac material. Or??

If zamac is that prone to corroding it seems like I should dismantle the razor after every shave and dry out the threads in the handle with a Q-Tip. But there are many threads with disagreement about dismantle/clean/dry vs just leave it with the blade in. Seems like many just leave the blade clamped in the razor until they have shaved out the blade. Some at least loosen the clamping to shake and/or blow out the moisture. And here I am taking out the blade, wiping the blade dry and making a sharpie mark for each use, blade back in the paper wrapper, wipe and dry the razor. Which leads to another question:

Some blades say "DO NOT WIPE BLADE" 🤣 and I wonder if this just means "stainless so no need to wipe these days" or "don't wipe off the teflon coating" or "don't risk hurting yourself by wiping the blade" or something else I haven't thought of.

And here I will give my overthinking a rest (for now) and look forward to reading replies (even the ones that say "stop overthinking things")
 
Alum Ladd

Alum Ladd

Hello @Sam Hanwich and welcome to Badger and Blade!

Yes this is an oasis of the interwub, where you can pretty much relax and be yourself, within reason :letterk1:

Your post is postively telegraphic in it's brevity compared to some of the thread concepts on here, so you are not over thinking too much.

I am a big fan of zamac. Some of my favourite toy cars are made out of zamac and one day I hope to be the first on B&B to have a complete set of zamac dentures, if age related tooth loss strikes me down.

My first razor was a DES 89K Kelvin, which I still use and lurve. It is very zamacy and shiny.

Sam Hanwich said:
And here I am taking out the blade, wiping the blade dry and making a sharpie mark for each use, blade back in the paper wrapper, wipe and dry the razor.
Click to expand...
Yes I do that too.

Be seeing you!
 
rbscebu

rbscebu

Girls call me Makaluod
@Sam Hanwich, welcome to B&B. To address some of your concerns:

Zamak (or zamac) is a zinc/aluminium/magnesium/copper alloy first developed in the late 1920's. Initially this alloy had corrosion problems. This was found to be due to impurities in the zinc. This most probably is how zamak developed a poor reputation for razors. Once manufacturers converted to using 99.99% pure zinc, this corrosion problem was greatly reduced.

The finish on zamak razors is mainly an electroplating process, although sometimes another process may be used. Zamak needed a protective coating, particularly in a moist environment due to the zinc component. The zinc can oxidise, and the base metal becoming porous.

Where zamak can still have problems is if the protective coating is damaged enough to expose the zamak beneath. In a moist environment, this can set up a galvanic cell that produces corrosion in the base metal. Such corrosion can further break down the protective coating exasperating the problem.

That being said, many zamak razors can last for many decades is properly looked after (don't let the protective coating get damaged).

In my opinion, the reason why many manufacturers do not recommend that you wipe dry your razor blades is that, if not done with care, the blade's edge can be easily damaged. Many users are unaware how delicate the edge of a razor blade really is. Any cutting into cloth or even tissue paper can deteriorate the edge quality.
 
Sam Hanwich

Sam Hanwich

rbscebu said:
if the protective coating is damaged enough to expose the zamak beneath. In a moist environment, this can set up a galvanic cell that produces corrosion in the base metal. Such corrosion can further break down the protective coating exasperating the problem.
Click to expand...
That makes a lot of sense now. I hadn't thought of the galvanic reaction. That would explain the ugly pictures I've seen of the threaded post all crumbly Swiss cheese looking
 
Phoenixkh

Phoenixkh

I shaved a fortune
"Don't wipe the blade" falls into that "don't use this hair dryer in the shower" category.... those warnings are there because someone did something like that and a law suit was filed. "You didn't warn me that your razor blades were sharp."

I take apart my razors after every shave, clean and dry them, then re-assemble.. even stainless steel razors... so the plating will most likely outlast me before it starts wearing thin. I don't think this is the only way to do it, of course... I view my razors as tools and I take care of them the same way I do my other tools, carpentry and mechanic's tools. The good thing about razors with nickel plated Zamac heads? They tend to be fairly inexpensive.
 
Invicta

Invicta

Welcome to B&B.
Sam Hanwich said:
I remain a mere mortal shaving with a DE89 and getting perfectly wonderful results.
Click to expand...
That is a good razor capable of delivering a good shave, hence it's popularity. One of the most copied razor designs.
Sam Hanwich said:
Isn't Zinc what you coat nails with so they won't corrode in the outside weather? Why would a zamac razor corrode?
Click to expand...
Zinc has been used for weather roof flashings for many decades so it's resistance to water corrosion is good. It is the other metals added to zinc alloys, mainly for ease of casting and added strength, that are the problem.
Sam Hanwich said:
If zamac is that prone to corroding it seems like I should dismantle the razor after every shave and dry out the threads in the handle with a Q-Tip. But there are many threads with disagreement about dismantle/clean/dry vs just leave it with the blade in. Seems like many just leave the blade clamped in the razor until they have shaved out the blade. Some at least loosen the clamping to shake and/or blow out the moisture. And here I am taking out the blade, wiping the blade dry and making a sharpie mark for each use, blade back in the paper wrapper, wipe and dry the razor. Which leads to another question:

Some blades say "DO NOT WIPE BLADE" 🤣 and I wonder if this just means "stainless so no need to wipe these days" or "don't wipe off the teflon coating" or "don't risk hurting yourself by wiping the blade" or something else I haven't thought of.
Click to expand...
It is the chrome that provides the corrosion protection and that wears at the thread interfaces on the threaded post. To reduce wear on the interfaces:
  1. Don't over tighten
  2. Use a lubricant to reduce wear; I apply light machine oil to the threads once a month but mineral oil will do.
  3. I dismantle and wipe the blade daily (pinch and draw through tissue to avoid damaging the edge)
  4. Hard water is a pain in the neck and allows daily scum build up, hence the daily drying. If don't have a hard water problem it is a lot easier so just allowing the blade to dry naturally in a dry atmosphere is okay
  5. Ditto for the razor to prevent scum build up
  6. Some just attach a used blade to a magnet to let it dry in the air so don't need to put it back in the wrapper
  7. The polymer coating is baked on so cannot be simply wiped off. I have yet to see any scientific information on the expected life of the polymer coating. My blades last 2 to 3 weeks and remain smooth till the edge wears beyond usefulness.
  8. The "do not wipe" is a safety statement as you have deduced
Enjoy your shaves is my mantra; it is not a chore for me!
 
musicman1951

musicman1951

three-tu-tu, three-tu-tu
Welcome to B&B! I am strongly in favor of thinking, so over-think away!

Lots of shavers have and do use razors made of zamak, so enjoy it while it lasts - which could be decades.

I've read that wiping the blade is a bad idea because many are coated, and I've read that you could damage the very thin cutting edge (or your fingers, which would be a bigger concern to me). Unfortunately, I have no advice here - I'm just too darn lazy to wipe it for any reason. i give my razor a good rinse and am apparently completely satisfied with the results.
 
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