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Masa

Old Hippie

Somewhere between 61 and dead
Any other masa makers here?

After getting fits trying to source the necessaries, I finally got it all in hand. I've been rocking the tortillas for a few batches now and really enjoying the process.

Yeah, I should have pix. Two things: I'm an old radio guy and don't think in pictures; and my camera is my phone -- and since I live where there is essentially no cell service I have to actually dig out and boot up my phone to take pictures. I'll try to make the effort (places back of hand on brow, rolls eyes).

O.H.
 

DoctorShavegood

"A Boy Named Sue"
I stock the MASA in my pantry. It’s just basically the ground up corn. And on occasion I will mix up a nice batch for my tortilla press. I can also run down to my local grocery store which stocks ready made Masa dough.
 

TexLaw

Fussy Evil Genius
Indeed, I also have not nixtamalized my own corn. We always have a bag of masa in the pantry. Obviously, we use it for tortillas and other such things, but I also like using it to thicken certain soups, sauces, stews, and what-nots (like chili).

I was playing around with it in my cornbread and other yeast breads for a little while, but I never got very far with that. I might want to pick that back up.
 

TexLaw

Fussy Evil Genius
I must confess I have not tried to make masa from scratch. Maybe one day. The masa harina is so convenient.

There was a time that I considered it, but then I came to my senses. I can buy high quality masa harina at an very low price. I don't make my own fish sauce, I don't brine my own olives, and I don't nixtamalize my own corn and grind it into masa.

I don't think masa was in Make the Bread, Buy the Butter. If it were, it would most certainly advise to buy it.
 

Old Hippie

Somewhere between 61 and dead
I used masa harina for years, and still have it around. Most of my Latin friends around here use Maseca, kind of like the Kellogg's corn flakes of masa; meaning it's easy to find and makes an acceptable product but everyone says how starting with corn kernels is so much better. I've tried Bob's Red Mill version, but it's coarser than Maseca and I think I've identified where they're cutting some corners.

One interesting little wrinkle I came across this year is how bloody hard it is to find pickling lime, which used to be in any store with a seasonal canning section. Ball (Bernardin in Canada) no longer makes it because some people evidently got botulism from improperly processed lime pickles. Good candidates for the Darwin Award -- if you don't rinse basic chemicals off before putting the food in acid, it will neutralize the acid enough to allow botulinum to get going if you're water-bath canning. Not correcting processing time for altitude will do that, too.

For pickles calcium chloride works just as well. The idea is to get the calcium into the cucumber to keep it crunchy; the "other half" of the chemical is rinsed away. There is research into using calcium salts to nixtamalize corn. Having read into it pretty deeply I can say that it really looks like a corner-cutting measure for large-scale manufacturers. Calcium salts do not dissolve the hemicellulose in the corn pericarp. Nixtamal made with lime is rinsed to remove the sludge that used to be the pericarp. Not having to rinse it off (because you can't) would save some time, money and water. The researchers had to mill the masa twice; once in production and once again after drying it to masa harina, in order to break up the sticky clumps with a hammer mill.

I've made nixtamal with calcium salts. It's almost exactly like Bob's Red Mill, which I think may be significant. Having the entire kernel in the masa makes a really sticky masa because the gums and proteins are still all in there. Sure, it'll make a tortilla but I far prefer to do it the "right" way.

Hey, can you say, "rabbit hole?" :001_rolle

O.H.
 

Old Hippie

Somewhere between 61 and dead
A couple of days ago an Amazon driver screeched past the gate to Maison Casa Hippie House and fired a package over the top of the "Beware of Dog" sign. My copy of Jorge Gaviria's new book "MASA" has arrived.

Folks, I gotta lotta cookbooks. Chinese, Japanese, Indonesian, Indian, North American Indigenous, German, Italian, French, Biker, Cowboy, Scottish, Hungarian, Mexican, New Mexican, Norwegian, Burmese, Persian, Vietnamese...

A quick read through to get the lay of the land and I'm really intrigued. Like Peter Reinhart's The Bread Baker's Apprentice it digs into the history as well as what's happening on a molecular level. Also like Peter, Jorge doesn't get prescriptive needlessly. Oh, sure, some things have to happen in certain ways. But there's none of that "if you ain't doin' it this way you're wrong" stuff.

As a good foodie read I recommend it highly. As an inspiration and guide I recommend it highly. And hey, like an ATT X1 razor it's the only one of its kind out there at the moment. That's also an attraction.

O.H.
 
I used masa harina for years, and still have it around. Most of my Latin friends around here use Maseca, kind of like the Kellogg's corn flakes of masa; meaning it's easy to find and makes an acceptable product but everyone says how starting with corn kernels is so much better. I've tried Bob's Red Mill version, but it's coarser than Maseca and I think I've identified where they're cutting some corners.

One interesting little wrinkle I came across this year is how bloody hard it is to find pickling lime, which used to be in any store with a seasonal canning section. Ball (Bernardin in Canada) no longer makes it because some people evidently got botulism from improperly processed lime pickles. Good candidates for the Darwin Award -- if you don't rinse basic chemicals off before putting the food in acid, it will neutralize the acid enough to allow botulinum to get going if you're water-bath canning. Not correcting processing time for altitude will do that, too.

For pickles calcium chloride works just as well. The idea is to get the calcium into the cucumber to keep it crunchy; the "other half" of the chemical is rinsed away. There is research into using calcium salts to nixtamalize corn. Having read into it pretty deeply I can say that it really looks like a corner-cutting measure for large-scale manufacturers. Calcium salts do not dissolve the hemicellulose in the corn pericarp. Nixtamal made with lime is rinsed to remove the sludge that used to be the pericarp. Not having to rinse it off (because you can't) would save some time, money and water. The researchers had to mill the masa twice; once in production and once again after drying it to masa harina, in order to break up the sticky clumps with a hammer mill.

I've made nixtamal with calcium salts. It's almost exactly like Bob's Red Mill, which I think may be significant. Having the entire kernel in the masa makes a really sticky masa because the gums and proteins are still all in there. Sure, it'll make a tortilla but I far prefer to do it the "right" way.

Hey, can you say, "rabbit hole?" :001_rolle

O.H.
Take a look around. There's bound to be a Mexican market in your town, maybe. Ask for "Cal". That's the word that worked in my local Mexican market because "calcium hydroxide" didn't penetrate the language barrier. Alternatively, if you've been burning any of that that wood you chopped before winter use the ashes to make lye. Just trickle some of that chopped water through the ashes. That's probably the way inland Mesoamericans without access to seashells to burn for calcium hydroxide nixtamalized their corn. I recall several YouTube videos about nixtamalizing corn with lye produced from wood ashes. Anyway, good luck.

I used masa harina for years, and still have it around. Most of my Latin friends around here use Maseca, kind of like the Kellogg's corn flakes of masa; meaning it's easy to find and makes an acceptable product but everyone says how starting with corn kernels is so much better. I've tried Bob's Red Mill version, but it's coarser than Maseca and I think I've identified where they're cutting some corners.

One interesting little wrinkle I came across this year is how bloody hard it is to find pickling lime, which used to be in any store with a seasonal canning section. Ball (Bernardin in Canada) no longer makes it because some people evidently got botulism from improperly processed lime pickles. Good candidates for the Darwin Award -- if you don't rinse basic chemicals off before putting the food in acid, it will neutralize the acid enough to allow botulinum to get going if you're water-bath canning. Not correcting processing time for altitude will do that, too.

For pickles calcium chloride works just as well. The idea is to get the calcium into the cucumber to keep it crunchy; the "other half" of the chemical is rinsed away. There is research into using calcium salts to nixtamalize corn. Having read into it pretty deeply I can say that it really looks like a corner-cutting measure for large-scale manufacturers. Calcium salts do not dissolve the hemicellulose in the corn pericarp. Nixtamal made with lime is rinsed to remove the sludge that used to be the pericarp. Not having to rinse it off (because you can't) would save some time, money and water. The researchers had to mill the masa twice; once in production and once again after drying it to masa harina, in order to break up the sticky clumps with a hammer mill.

I've made nixtamal with calcium salts. It's almost exactly like Bob's Red Mill, which I think may be significant. Having the entire kernel in the masa makes a really sticky masa because the gums and proteins are still all in there. Sure, it'll make a tortilla but I far prefer to do it the "right" way.

Hey, can you say, "rabbit hole?" :001_rolle

O.H.
 

Old Hippie

Somewhere between 61 and dead
Take a look around. There's bound to be a Mexican market in your town, maybe. Ask for "Cal".

A good idea, but it didn't work out. Our local Mexican shop makes fresh salsas and has tortillas, chips, etc. They don't make their own masa, though. I also caught them passing off what they admitted were "imported" tortillas and chips repackaged in their own branded packs. They have Maseca, but only one variety of it. The last time I looked they had some past-date Bob's Red Mill also. I've asked about getting some ingredients I need, or better equipment than the cheap stuff they have, but all I get is a blank look. It's for Canadians who want "Mexican-ish." It's OK; they're upfront about it.

The local Latinx all use Maseca. Taste of home, I guess, like Budweiser and Wonder Bread. Or "KD" if you're Canadian.

That's the word that worked in my local Mexican market because "calcium hydroxide" didn't penetrate the language barrier. Alternatively, if you've been burning any of that that wood you chopped before winter use the ashes to make lye. Just trickle some of that chopped water through the ashes.

Can be done. I've got fruitwood and a whack of cured alder. We have options, just not terribly convenient ones. First World problems. I also have some harvestable juniper for making ashes to mix in Piki batter, a subset of nixtamalization and another foodway I'd like to explore.

That's probably the way inland Mesoamericans without access to seashells to burn for calcium hydroxide nixtamalized their corn. I recall several YouTube videos about nixtamalizing corn with lye produced from wood ashes. Anyway, good luck.

Thanks! I'm having fun. Also making the best tortillas I've ever made. We're a bit limited on corn varieties, but there are tonnes of the yellow dent around and it works. Better the thing that works and you can get instead of whining about how great you could be with something you can't get. :)

O.H.
 
The local Latinx all use Maseca. Taste of home, I guess, like Budweiser and Wonder Bread. Or "KD" if you're Canadian.
There's another brand that seems to be popular here:

1664229533608.png


Ingredients​

WHITE COOKED CORN, WATER, LIME, NO PRESERVATIVES ADDED.

They even have a blue corn masa that is a little more difficult to find.
 

Chef455

Head Cheese Head Chef
A couple of days ago an Amazon driver screeched past the gate to Maison Casa Hippie House and fired a package over the top of the "Beware of Dog" sign. My copy of Jorge Gaviria's new book "MASA" has arrived.

Folks, I gotta lotta cookbooks. Chinese, Japanese, Indonesian, Indian, North American Indigenous, German, Italian, French, Biker, Cowboy, Scottish, Hungarian, Mexican, New Mexican, Norwegian, Burmese, Persian, Vietnamese...

A quick read through to get the lay of the land and I'm really intrigued. Like Peter Reinhart's The Bread Baker's Apprentice it digs into the history as well as what's happening on a molecular level. Also like Peter, Jorge doesn't get prescriptive needlessly. Oh, sure, some things have to happen in certain ways. But there's none of that "if you ain't doin' it this way you're wrong" stuff.

As a good foodie read I recommend it highly. As an inspiration and guide I recommend it highly. And hey, like an ATT X1 razor it's the only one of its kind out there at the moment. That's also an attraction.

O.H.

Not to derail... but what, may I ask, is considered Biker cuisine?
 

Old Hippie

Somewhere between 61 and dead
Not to derail... but what, may I ask, is considered Biker cuisine?

I have an answer! Well...several answers...

I was thinking of Bill Hufnagle's cookbooks Biker Billy Cooks With Fire and Biker Billy's Freeway-A-Fire. Just like Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance ain't really about motorcycles, Biker Billy is/was a vegetarian in contrast to the usual image of the biker as someone who agrees with the old saying, "A meal without meat is just a snack." Good, rib-stickin' vegetarian cooking with extra hot peppers. What's not to like?

When we owned a small ranch between Rapid City and Sturgis we used to host about 60 of our closest friends for a couple weeks of ridin', drinkin', ridin', eatin', ridin', wrenchin', drinkin', racin', ridin' and ridin'. :) We cooked for the crowd every night, had two shops open with tools, three-keg cooler, and a drag strip right out the gate. One of our signature meals was rattlesnake and buffalo black bean chili, fresh cornbread, and six or seven kinds of pie. That's another answer.

O.H.
 

Ad Astra

The Instigator
If that's the stuff I'm thinking of, we use it to make 'arepas,' a very tasty fried corn cake.

Super simple: just add water, make a patty, paint with olive oil, sprinkle with spices, throw in the air fryer.

Cleans up easier than white flour, too.


AA
 

Old Hippie

Somewhere between 61 and dead
If that's the stuff I'm thinking of, we use it to make 'arepas,' a very tasty fried corn cake.

I'm told arepas are usually made with a non-nixtamalized corn dough. Which is not to say they can't be made with masa! In fact as Jorge Gaviria says, they're even better that way.

O.H.
 

Old Hippie

Somewhere between 61 and dead
I was playing around with it in my cornbread and other yeast breads for a little while, but I never got very far with that. I might want to pick that back up.

Bumping this one back into the discussion...

I've got a couple of sourdough hearth loaves in process with a masa addition. "Process" is the word, for sure. But I've got it bulk-fermenting at the moment and I will take it as far as shaping and retarding tonight and bake it tomorrow. While all that was working through today I also finished a couple loaves of "Lowfah" bread, our daily eat.

Mrs. Hippie's also been asking for a batch of bagels. I will probably put that off a week to eat down some of this...

O.H.
 
I'm told arepas are usually made with a non-nixtamalized corn dough. Which is not to say they can't be made with masa! In fact as Jorge Gaviria says, they're even better that way.

O.H.
That's right. There are products similar to masa harina, but made with standard corn. PAN is a common brand. More of a refined product, compared to masa harina which is normally made with whole grain corn. I think it's been precooked and ground very fine.

1664663489288.png
 

Old Hippie

Somewhere between 61 and dead
There were a couple points of process where I didn't have a strong experiential foundation, but things didn't turn out too bad. Here's the crumb-shot...

IMG_0665[1].JPG


I'm amused that it tastes exactly like a loaf of sourdough hearth bread with a batch of tortillas mixed in. Kind of a Third Wave Masa take on Anadama Bread. Tasty.

O.H.
 
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