Making lather with a large Silvertip Badger Brush

[South Dakota Guy]

I recently purchased a West Coast Shaving Silvertip 26mm brush and I am looking for tips from those who use large Silvertip brushes. All of my brush experience has been with synthetic brushes so a natural hair brush is new to me. I soak the brush in hot water while I am in the shower. This brush seems to hold a large amount of water. When making a lather should I shake and squeeze out the excess like I do with my synthetics or should I just roll with the water in the brush. Also, it seems to me that a lot more soap/cream is necessary to make the lather? Tell me how you do it. I have some comparison photo's of my three brushes. Simpson T2, Yaqi 24mm Synthetic and WCS 26mm Silvertip.

As you can see the WCS Silvertip is about 4 times larger than the T2. It is very dense and feels great on my face as the tips are very soft. It is fun to use but getting this large brush completely covered in lather is going to take some practice.

 

[EclipseRedRing]

I soak the brush for a few minutes then squeeze out the water so the brush is just damp. Then I load the brush from the dry or slightly damp puck for about twenty seconds and start to face lather with the pasty soap. I dip the tips of the brush in water to add hydration until the lather is how I prefer it. I like a wetter lather for a straight or AC shave than for a DE shave. I use hard soaps almost exclusively and my technique never changes regardless of the exact soap or the brush I am using. It works every time with every soap but that may be more due to the soft water where I live than to my technique.

 

[Contact_vs_Feedback]

I recently purchased a West Coast Shaving Silvertip 26mm brush and I am looking for tips from those who use large Silvertip brushes.

View attachment 1216077

View attachment 1216078

As you can see the WCS Silvertip is about 4 times larger than the T2. It is very dense and feels great on my face as the tips are very soft. It is fun to use but getting this large brush completely covered in lather is going to take some practice.

I'm going to watch this thread because I'm hoping to receive a Chubby 3 Best Badger and this might provide me with any additional information I might need.

I'm currently using RazoRock Beehive (28 mm knot, 63 mm loft) in Plissoft knot, and I've almost dialled the consistency of lather with sticks and Italian soap.

I've yet to be brave enough to use the huge brush with Hallows and Midnight Dreary.

 

[nemo]

I don't feel there's any need to soak badger brushes, YMMV. Badger doesn't take on water like a boar. Not sure of your soaps but with my triple milled I load with a slightly damp brush (shaken) and a little water on the soap. Wet the tips, swirl on soap, and add water slowly as necessary. Experiment, it'll change a bit between products, just pay attention to your lather.

 

[South Dakota Guy]

I don't feel there's any need to soak badger brushes, YMMV. Badger doesn't take on water like a boar. Not sure of your soaps but with my triple milled I load with a slightly damp brush (shaken) and a little water on the soap. Wet the tips, swirl on soap, and add water slowly as necessary. Experiment, it'll change a bit between products, just pay attention to your lather.

For some reason I was under the impression that badger brushes needed to be soaked. It sounds like I can pretty much use it like I do my synthetics then. Thanks!

 

[xiletero]

Here is what I have found, and I will guess this is for face shaving?
Comparing middle synth brush to the badger: soak in warm not hot water, I squeeze the water out, the loading time: double what you have done with your synthetic. You probably will need to add water 3-4 times (a little at a time) while generating lather be it face or bowl.
It just doesn't generate the same amount of lather or it vanishes.
If you are doing head and face....most of the times, one heavy load will not be enough for 3 passes of face+head.
Those $15 brushes are hard to beat!

 

[BigJ]

I prefer smaller to medium sized brushes, so take this with a grain of salt (at least)! My largest is 26 mm.

With larger brushes, you can load your brush well, then place your fingers around the base of the knot to produce a knot size and flow-through that is optimal!

 

[South Dakota Guy]

I just used it with some T&H shaving cream and I used a generous quantity. It is definitely easier to lather with cream. I had a blast using it today, swirling painting etc. with lots of warm lather from my scuttle. I will need to work on my lathering from soap though to get the volume of lather that I am looking for.

 

[South Dakota Guy]

Here is what I have found, and I will guess this is for face shaving?
Comparing middle synth brush to the badger: soak in warm not hot water, I squeeze the water out, the loading time: double what you have done with your synthetic. You probably will need to add water 3-4 times (a little at a time) while generating lather be it face or bowl.
It just doesn't generate the same amount of lather or it vanishes.
If you are doing head and face....most of the times, one heavy load will not be enough for 3 passes of face+head.
Those $15 brushes are hard to beat!

I love that Yaqi brush. Best brush you can buy for less than $15. I ordered the Yaqi brown synthetic with the rainbow handle and 26mm knot the other day for less than $15 on AliExpress. I expect a long wait for delivery.

 

[Steve_in_CT]

I have a Yaqi 26 mm two band badger brush that appears to be about the same size as your WCS brush. I also have a 24 mm WCS silvertip. With both of those brushes I soak them but I do not squeeze out the water. I shake the brush a bit and then start loading. That means I start off with more water than @xiletero and add less water while I'm loading. I don't think it matters which way you do it. With the 26 mm brush, you have to load longer and you may find that it helps, while lathering, to push the lather out of the brush with your fingers. I do this with all brushes by swirling the brush lightly in the crook between my left thumb and index finger and then painting that lather from the back of my hand onto my face. It sounds a bit complicated and awkward, but it's a technique that I picked up from an old Italian barber many, many years ago.

 

[mahenryak]

Interesting read. I'm afraid my eyes may have been a little too big for my stomach with my recent purchase of a Shavemac brush:

Quality and Size ==> 30 mm Silvertip 2-Band
Knot Shape ==> Bulb Shape
Hair length ( Loft) ==> 58 mm

We shall see how I adapt to a larger brush. I am still awaiting shipment.

 

[sugardaddy]

For some reason I was under the impression that badger brushes needed to be soaked. It sounds like I can pretty much use it like I do my synthetics then. Thanks!

Whether or not to soak a badger is subjective: user preference.

I like to soak mine for a few minutes because I tried it both ways and I like soaked better than unsoaked. Try both ways yourself if you want.

I would not soak in hot water. Hot causes the glue disc to expand, which can eventually cause shedding, and/or the knot to fall out, because of the expansion and contraction of glued surfaces.

Your silvertip probably doesn't pick up soap from the puck as quickly as a synthetic, so you may need to load for a little longer.

You can play around with how much water is in your brush right before you load up. Some like to shake out only a small amount, and go to the soap with a very wet brush. I prefer shaking most out, but I'm a bowl latherer, which may be different from you.


(Sent from mobile)

 

[South Dakota Guy]

Interesting read. I'm afraid my eyes may have been a little too big for my stomach with my recent purchase of a Shavemac brush:

Quality and Size ==> 30 mm Silvertip 2-Band
Knot Shape ==> Bulb Shape
Hair length ( Loft) ==> 58 mm

We shall see how I adapt to a larger brush. I am still awaiting shipment.

I hate to be the one to break it to you but your brush is going to be quite large. The loft on mine is 56mm according to WCS. I really enjoy using it on my face but I think loading it from my triple milled (DRH) and quadruple milled (PDP #63) is going to take some practice. I will still probably use my synthetics more but it good for a change up. I have really come to enjoy larger brushes and larger handles. MY Simpson T2 will most likely end up Piffed to a newby along with an extra Gillette ball handle Tech

 

[mahenryak]

I hate to be the one to break it to you but your brush is going to be quite large. The loft on mine is 56mm according to WCS. I really enjoy using it on my face but I think loading it from my triple milled (DRH) and quadruple milled (PDP #63) is going to take some practice. I will still probably use my synthetics more but it good for a change up. I have really come to enjoy larger brushes and larger handles. MY Simpson T2 will most likely end up Piffed to a newby along with an extra Gillette ball handle Tech

That's okay. I knew it was going to be a large brush, so no surprise there, but I am wondering how much of a challenge it might be. One thing in your post that reveals yet another void in my knowledge, though, is your reference to triple and quadruple milled soaps. I have not shopped for soaps with milling as a parameter to keep in mind, before. I'm going to have to read up on this.

Edit:
Okay. Maybe over simplified but generally speaking the higher number of mills the better potential for rich lathering, if I read this right?

 

[South Dakota Guy]

That's okay. I knew it was going to be a large brush, so no surprise there, but I am wondering how much of a challenge it might be. One thing in your post that reveals yet another void in my knowledge, though, is your reference to triple and quadruple milled soaps. I have not shopped for soaps with milling as a parameter to keep in mind, before. I'm going to have to read up on this.

Edit:
Okay. Maybe over simplified but generally speaking the higher number of mills the better potential for rich lathering, if I read this right?

Triple and quadruple milled soaps are very dense, hard and long lasting. Users frequently cover them in water to soften them up prior to loading the brush as it makes it easier to load them on a brush. Most artisanal soaps are softer and easier to load onto a brush.

 

[Chan Eil Whiskers]

I soak the brush for a few minutes then squeeze out the water so the brush is just damp. Then I load the brush from the dry or slightly damp puck for about twenty seconds and start to face lather with the pasty soap. I dip the tips of the brush in water to add hydration until the lather is how I prefer it. I like a wetter lather for a straight or AC shave than for a DE shave. I use hard soaps almost exclusively and my technique never changes regardless of the exact soap or the brush I am using. It works every time with every soap but that may be more due to the soft water where I live than to my technique.

I do much the same thing but only shake out the water and do not squeeze the knot at all.

There are many ways to skin a cat.

I use badgers which nominally measure up to 30 mm and actually measure at the exit with my calipers 33 mm. They are certainly not too large as I think of knots.

A 24 mm badger knot is just medium sized according to me.

To the OP: Use warm water to soak the brush (not hot). You can soak just the tips in somewhat hotter water for a few seconds right before lathering, but water that's too hot is a very bad idea for your badgers. If it's too hot for your hands and face it's too hot for your brush. Triple milled soaps are okay, but they just have less water. Nothing magic about them. I prefer Italian soft soaps which are much the same consistency as putty.

Vitos Red (cocco) 30 mm MS three band silvertip​

That is one big knot, but it's not too big. I like it a lot.

Happy shaves,

Jim

 

[never-stop-learning]

If you face lather, try the 'Marco Method':

Lately I've seen that some B&B members are having issues regarding how to create a good lather with Italian soft soaps. And I have personally received several PMs regarding this subject, with many asking me what kind of lathering technique I actually use. Here is a simple tutorial for new wet shavers or for those who just are unable to get satisfying results with soft soaps.

1. Italian soft soaps like brushes with soft tips and great backbone. You can use a quality boar or badger brush of your choice with the above specs. I prefer boars, as in the old Italian barbershop tradition.

2. Run your brush under hot water (or simply soak it) for at least 30 seconds.

3. Turn your brush upside-down WITHOUT shaking it. Allow only the gravity water to fall down and move your brush carefully, since it has to be kept full of water.

4. Start making swirls on the surface of the soap. You have to proceed slowly, without pressure on the brush. Remember that it's very wet.

5. Heavily load your brush for about 45/60 seconds making around 100/120 swirls. Please keep in mind that the loading time and number of swirls also depend on how big your brush is and how much water it can retain.

6. Move the brush onto your face and face lather. Again, be careful, you'll have a LOT of lather to handle.

7. While face lathering add, slowly and progressively, a few drops of water per time to your brush. Or, alternatively, lightly wet the tips of the brush. I personally prefer to add drops of water to the brush because I have a better control of the soap/water ratio.

8. You bring the lather to the right consistency.

*** The main concept to always keep in mind is simple: a lot of water + a lot of swirls + a lot of soap = a lot of great, thick, slick and effective lather. ***

I learned this technique from an old Italian Master Barber with over 40 years of experience and I've been using it with great results for almost 16 years.

P.S. This lathering technique works very well even with hard, triple milled soaps. Exactly as described above, with the sole exception that I soften the surface of hard soaps with a dozen drops of water before starting to make swirls.

If you bowl lather (as I now do most of the time), try the 'Modified Marco Method':

Modified Marco Method.

For hard and medium soaps:

1. Soak your brush in medium hot water for a few minutes..

2. Turn your brush upside-down. I usually give a very slight flick of my wrist, but do not shake. Keep most of the water in the brush. You want a nice wet brush.

3. Hold your soap over the Captain's Choice bowl, slightly pointed down. Start making swirls on the surface of the soap.

4. Heavily load your brush.. Please keep in mind that the loading time and number of swirls also depend on how big your brush is and how much water it can retain. Try to aim the overflow so it goes into the bowl.

5. After the brush is loaded, get any excess lather from your puck into the bowl, set your puck down, pick up your Captain's Choice bowl and begin building your lather in the bowl.

6. Add a few drops of water as needed to get the lather consistency dialed in.

7. Apply the lather to your face.

Full attribution: This is taken from the 'Marco Method' originally posted here:

My lathering technique with Italian soft soaps - https://www.badgerandblade.com/forum/threads/my-lathering-technique-with-italian-soft-soaps.199887/

I modified it slightly to suit my bowl lathering preference.

If you are using soft creams or croaps, place an appropriate amount (usually ~1/4 teaspoon) in the center of the bowl. Soak your brush. Partial (small) flick of the wrist. Swirl your wet brush around in the bowl until your lather is the consistency of yogurt.

Hope this helps.

 

[Marco]

If you face lather, try the 'Marco Method':



If you bowl lather (as I now do most of the time), try the 'Modified Marco Method':

Modified Marco Method.

For hard and medium soaps:

1. Soak your brush in medium hot water for a few minutes..

2. Turn your brush upside-down. I usually give a very slight flick of my wrist, but do not shake. Keep most of the water in the brush. You want a nice wet brush.

3. Hold your soap over the Captain's Choice bowl, slightly pointed down. Start making swirls on the surface of the soap.

4. Heavily load your brush.. Please keep in mind that the loading time and number of swirls also depend on how big your brush is and how much water it can retain. Try to aim the overflow so it goes into the bowl.

5. After the brush is loaded, get any excess lather from your puck into the bowl, set your puck down, pick up your Captain's Choice bowl and begin building your lather in the bowl.

6. Add a few drops of water as needed to get the lather consistency dialed in.

7. Apply the lather to your face.

Full attribution: This is taken from the 'Marco Method' originally posted here:

My lathering technique with Italian soft soaps - https://www.badgerandblade.com/forum/threads/my-lathering-technique-with-italian-soft-soaps.199887/

I modified it slightly to suit my bowl lathering preference.

If you are using soft creams or croaps, place an appropriate amount (usually ~1/4 teaspoon) in the center of the bowl. Soak your brush. Partial (small) flick of the wrist. Swirl your wet brush around in the bowl until your lather is the consistency of yogurt.

Hope this helps.

Bravo my friend, bravo.

 

[mahenryak]

Just to follow up, my Shavemac 30 mm Silvertip 2-Band brush arrived.

Link:
Shavemac Brush 30mm

So far, so good. I feel like I am improving on my lathering technique with each shave. Patience, patience, patience.

 

[sexy beast]

I use my 35 mm Thäter two band on hard soap like a Floris shave bowl. A little water on the puck and soak the brush in warm water for about a minute I’m prepping my beard. Then I shake the excess water in my brush and begin to rub back and forth with the brush on the puck until I get a good load up of leather. Then I just face leather until I get a good cushion of foam and start shaving with my straight razor. With this brush I can do multiple passes without even loading up the brush again. It’s becoming my go to brush for hard soaps in a bowl.