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Making Hai Karate

I have something of a Hai Karate fixation. Ever since I was a teenager in the 90s i have been after this elusive relic. Somehow I got it in my mind that it was the most pimp-tastic fragrance around, something everyone from John Shaft to Elvis would have doused themselves with and strutted around in a cloud if self-assuredness careless of whether anyone liked it or not. However, in 2018, I just can't bring myself to pay $75 for it.

Why? Because I know myself. I would hoard it and only wear it on special occasions, depressed in spite of myself at the dwindling levels of juice left in the bottle.

So I came up with a solution. I got a sample vial from ebay for $12.00, and put all of my brainpower into decoding its secrets. It wasn't difficult, because the scent itself is extremely derivative of two other fragrances. In essence, Hai Karate is a cheap knockoff of two other fragrances: Canoe and Jade East.

So I followed my nose and mixed these two colognes. I put 2/3rds modern Canoe into a bottle and 1/3 modern Jade East, both available on the internet. Then I smelled the mixture side by side with Vintage HK. I had matched the scent somewhere in the neighborhood of 90%, the only difference being a slightly less potent drydown.

That's it. Very simple.

I also bought the imitation roll on oil sold on ebay as well as Masters "focus" aftershave, itself a knockoff of HK. All of those in combination makes a fragrance even more potent than the original vintage HK.

So now I have an almost unlimited source for Hai Karate and can wear as much as I want whenever I want. It's amazing!

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my uncle still has a small shelf with a few half used bottles of the typical 70s and 80s era scents. I've taken splashes here and there over the last few months since i've become more interested in shaving....my face always feels awful after messing with that vintage crap, all his bottles have the same ultra perfumey alcoholy kinda smell and i know 100% they are original authentic stuff that hasn't been opened in over 20 years.

i know alotta people here like old colognes and aftershaves but i think that everything has to have an expiration date at some point, it's doesn't seem right splashing liquid that's 40 years old onto your skin, especially after a shave when you need something really cleansing and healing. Also i'd feel really weird using someone else's aftershave from ebay or a thrift store, how the heck do ya know what's really in there or what it's been thru or how the ingredients have morphed over the years?

Last week in the back of a cabinet, i found a bottle of my dad's Old Spice fresh scent that came in the clear glass bottle from the early 1990s, the bluish greenish concoction still smells kinda like i remembered it, but it has globules of a weird oily black ooze from the X-Files floating around in it, so i definitely won't be using any of that. I showed it to my dad and he said - i'm sure it's still ok to drink it. LOL

If you have a modern alternative that you're happy with then that's awesome and probably much safer for your health, don't drive yourself nuts looking for vintage hai karate, it's not worth the trouble
 
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just wanted to add/clarify...i'm not knocking hai karate or the other vintage scents, i agree those were great in their time, that's why they were so popular ...i just worry that these old juices have probably turned slightly over the decades and probably aren't very good for anybody to use anymore and we should all be looking for more modern alternatives and it's great that found you one. My personal soft spot is for the vintage shulton old spice original, and my uncle's bottle of that even smells a little off to me from my memories of when it was new.
 
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That is an excellent point, Jay. If I knew more about chemistry I could probably point out some chemical reaction that would occur over time. But most people know that nothing ever stays the same forever, and I am sure it can turn.

My only vintage that I actually wear from time to time is Brut Actif Blue. I have never had a problem with it. It's also not from the 1960s!

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I scored this a few months ago, it's absolutely fantastic.. leather, lemon and sandalwood..

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i know alotta people here like old colognes and aftershaves but i think that everything has to have an expiration date at some point, it's doesn't seem right splashing liquid that's 40 years old onto your skin, especially after a shave when you need something really cleansing and healing. Also i'd feel really weird using someone else's aftershave from ebay or a thrift store, how the heck do ya know what's really in there or what it's been thru or how the ingredients have morphed over the years?

Well, you'd have to know what's in it, really. The vast majority by weight of the contents of a bottle of scent in alcohol-based splash or spray format is perfumer's alcohol and water, which doesn't degrade and also kills many of the bugs that might attack the product. Whatever emollient might be in the bottle may or may not degrade, you'd have to check the MSDS. That only leaves the fragrance oils themselves, and you'd think that if they are degrading the scent would be affected also.

Now I wouldn't expect to get a lot of life out of the modern balms with an ingredients list longer than your arm - you should be buying those new - but an alcohol based splash or spray should maybe hold up okay as long as it wasn't exposed to too much heat. TBH, if you are looking for cleansing and healing in your aftershave, an alcohol based splash of any vintage may not be your best choice anyway. :)
 
I got some Hai Karate clone off eBay recently. I never tried the original, it was a little bit before my time.

The clone sample I have smells heavily of ambergris. Hai Karate is classified as a fougere (like Canoe, Clubman or Brut) but the level of ambergris reminds me more of an oriental fragrance, like the types you would see in the middle east.

It's definitely unusual and might actually smell better on a woman than a man, or as what they call an evening fragrance. My S.O. has some Egyptian Musk (which is a unisex fragrance) that I bought her that isn't completely different in character.
 
Hmm, interesting. I have actually tried the original and the clone oil is not exact. But it is very close. I know that clones need to be slightly different to be legal, I wonder if the ambergris is due to that or if it just makes it project better as an oil? I wonder what it is, certainly not real ambergris?

I would say that the real Hai Karate is more like previous formulations of Canoe, with an added musk or amber note. Canoe was originally marketed as a women's fragrance, so that's an argument for it being unisex. I can't help but think of it as masculine due to the association with Clubman.
 
Hmm, interesting. I have actually tried the original and the clone oil is not exact. But it is very close. I know that clones need to be slightly different to be legal, I wonder if the ambergris is due to that or if it just makes it project better as an oil? I wonder what it is, certainly not real ambergris? .........................


I am sure there are differences in legalities in various countries and regions around the world. However, most fragrances would be produced using a trade secret formula rather than filing for some type of patent protection. The name of the fragrance nad packaging design would generally be trademarked, so you could not come up with a similar fragrance and sell it under the trademarked name or package design without running afoul of the law.0

With modern analytical tools like gas chromatography and mass spectrometry, it would be fairly easy to analyze a sample of a fragrance and come up with most of the major components. In designing a clone fragrance, however, it would be common to leave out or substitute for expensive components like ambergris. Ambroxan is commonly used as a replacement for ambergris. Ambergris sells for $20,000 per kilo whereas synthetic ambroxan is closer to $500 per kilo.
 
Hmm, interesting. I have actually tried the original and the clone oil is not exact. But it is very close. I know that clones need to be slightly different to be legal, I wonder if the ambergris is due to that or if it just makes it project better as an oil? I wonder what it is, certainly not real ambergris?

I would say that the real Hai Karate is more like previous formulations of Canoe, with an added musk or amber note. Canoe was originally marketed as a women's fragrance, so that's an argument for it being unisex. I can't help but think of it as masculine due to the association with Clubman.

You could make a clone exact, but it's not easy to do. It's just a matter of reverse engineering. Typically, gas chromatography is used to help figure out what to use. I've tried some clones that smell exactly like the original fragrances.

I can't stand Canoe anymore, just too much tonka bean. Of all the ones you mentioned, Brut is the most sohpsticated/classy.
 
Has anyone tried Lo Haiku from PAA? I'm sure that's a much higher quality HK clone. Avon's Tai Winds isn't a HK substitute. I bought some and it's actually very similar to Clubman Musk or Brut, rather than Hai Karate. The name makes you think it would be, but it's a very tame eau de cologne that doesn't last very long.
 
Has anyone tried Lo Haiku from PAA? I'm sure that's a much higher quality HK clone. Avon's Tai Winds isn't a HK substitute. I bought some and it's actually very similar to Clubman Musk or Brut, rather than Hai Karate. The name makes you think it would be, but it's a very tame eau de cologne that doesn't last very long.

I'll have to give that one a try.

There were lots of good fragrances in the 70's, it seems (I was too young back then). I still wear Jovan Musk occasionally.
 
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