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Llyn Idwal/Grecian/Charnley—A Outstanding Finisher-And Looks As Good As It Hones

These two stones are so similar it's insane. One slate, one novaculite both pretty similar traits but with the traditional processes for each. I'm me to the Vermont and I've had the llyn idwal for a while but I think the LI still has a lot of secrets to offer up. I've not resurfaced(minor buffing with a worn 1k plate) the stone, ever, just degreased it.. these stones seem pretty interchangeable. I've never really used any type of slurry on the LI(or any novaculites aside from normal washita shedding) but grain and feedback are insanely similar.
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Going to revive this thread. I won an auction for a Llyn Idwal and hopefully it will be a here soon. It's coming coming from Canada
 
Going to revive this thread. I won an auction for a Llyn Idwal and hopefully it will be a here soon. It's coming coming from Canada

Ah nice one :). Look forward to hearing your thoughts.

Idwals are the best of all the UK stones I’ve had. They’re magic!
 
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Ah nice one :). Look forward to hearing your thoughts.

Idwals are the best of all the UK stones I’ve had. They’re magic!

This is the only one I’ve seen for sale in North America. About as rare as chicken lips around here.
 
Sellers Photos, but I bought this one off of eBay, and it’s on the way…green Llyn Idwal Yellowlake Oilstone! It’s 9x2x1.

Fingers crossed that it’s good for razors!
View attachment 1429746View attachment 1429747


Very nice! Some other people here eyeing that one up too I think... ;) Assuming those white dots aren't any random inclusions I think you should be onto a winner. Because of how hard they are - a good proportion of Idwals seem to be in razor finishing territory.

I found that box very interesting, could it be original? AB Salmen used an 'S' on it's own as a logo on some stones...
 
Very nice! Some other people here eyeing that one up too I think... ;) Assuming those white dots aren't any random inclusions I think you should be onto a winner. Because of how hard they are - a good proportion of Idwals seem to be in razor finishing territory.

I found that box very interesting, could it be original? AB Salmen used an 'S' on it's own as a logo on some stones...

I know one person that was eyeing it up LOL. Oh well I did just win a Yellow Lake oil stone from across the pond. Giving @Matt O the credit , he turned me on to it.

FC04E002-D70A-465A-BCA8-F1B9B9858FBF.jpeg
 
Very nice! Some other people here eyeing that one up too I think... ;) Assuming those white dots aren't any random inclusions I think you should be onto a winner. Because of how hard they are - a good proportion of Idwals seem to be in razor finishing territory.

I found that box very interesting, could it be original? AB Salmen used an 'S' on it's own as a logo on some stones...
Thanks!

I don’t know about the original box…once it arrives, I will look to see if there are any other clues!

Yes…razor finisher…fingers crossed! I am partial to green slate, and for the price it was worth taking a shot.

Vr

Matt
 
Thanks!

I don’t know about the original box…once it arrives, I will look to see if there are any other clues!

Yes…razor finisher…fingers crossed! I am partial to green slate, and for the price it was worth taking a shot.

Vr

Matt


Look forward to hearing your impressions!

If you've not had one before - Idwals are a type of novaculite. Though they often have some slate-like foliation or cleavage to them, you'll find it more similar to a hard ark than a slate. Occasionally you see people saying they aren't novaculites, but that's not really true - they're just not a very pure ones, with SGs significantly higher than translucent or black arks (2.75 ish).

Quite apart from their composition, the main reason it's not true is that Idwals are in fact the original novaculites. When the term was coined by Richard Kirwan in the late 18th century, the stone he describes in his Mineralogy is clearly the Idwal stone, even down to its flaty and fplintery fracutre:

Screen Shot 2021-06-22 at 11.30.32 PM (1).png


Screen Shot 2021-06-22 at 11.30.52 PM (1).png
 
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Legion

Staff member
Look forward to hearing your impressions!

If you've not had one before - Idwals are a type of novaculite. Though they often have some slate-like foliation or cleavage to them, you'll find it more similar to a hard ark than a slate. Occasionally you see people saying they aren't novaculites, but that's not really true - they're just not a very pure ones, with SGs significantly higher than translucent or black arks (2.75 ish).

Quite apart from their composition, the main reason it's not true is that Idwals are in fact the original novaculites. When the term was coined by Richard Kirwan in the late 18th century, the stone he describes in his Mineralogy is clearly the Idwal stone, even down to its slaty and splintery fracutre:

View attachment 1430365

View attachment 1430366
Very true. And further, I would say my Glanrafon, though technically a slate, might be somewhere between the two.
 
Well it arrived today, and boy what a pain to lap flat! I should have probably just used SiC and the glass plate…but too late now!

It was greasy and dirty!
8A6187D5-AA76-4AA2-8144-72AF1A017043.jpeg
1D59CE77-BC56-481F-9755-F83B301040D4.jpeg


Nothing that an hour and a nano plate couldn’t fix…
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It’s very very smooth to the touch, despite its appearance. I ran a test razor on it with water for about 8-10 minutes, just doing light laps…the feedback was a somewhat velvety delight. Under the loupe, the edge looked fine, and the scratch pattern very light…negligible. I will test my big slate tonight or tomorrow, and then try this one next.

Do you guys think it would give a better final edge with some WD40, or water?

Vr

Matt
 
Well it arrived today, and boy what a pain to lap flat! I should have probably just used SiC and the glass plate…but too late now!

It was greasy and dirty!
View attachment 1431222View attachment 1431223

Nothing that an hour and a nano plate couldn’t fix…
View attachment 1431224View attachment 1431225

It’s very very smooth to the touch, despite its appearance. I ran a test razor on it with water for about 8-10 minutes, just doing light laps…the feedback was a somewhat velvety delight. Under the loupe, the edge looked fine, and the scratch pattern very light…negligible. I will test my big slate tonight or tomorrow, and then try this one next.

Do you guys think it would give a better final edge with some WD40, or water?

Vr

Matt

So let me ask you about the color. Based on what I see here and what I have noticed from that seller. Do you think the colors in his photos are enhanced? I noticed all his stones look harder and shinier than they should plus the color really pops in his pics while looks much more muted in yours. Is it really as green as his pics made it look? I have just noticed this seller can make a sand stone look like the hardest Novaculite.
 
So let me ask you about the color. Based on what I see here and what I have noticed from that seller. Do you think the colors in his photos are enhanced? I noticed all his stones look harder and shinier than they should plus the color really pops in his pics while looks much more muted in yours. Is it really as green as his pics made it look? I have just noticed this seller can make a sand stone look like the hardest Novaculite.

I do not have the expertise to comment on enhancing colors.

Did it look more green…yes…but it was covered with oil/light grime, and in a different natural light, I am guessing that could account for the difference.

I didn’t really have any expectations and I don’t have experience with this type of stone, so I am not disappointed. Running the test razor on it…it was a very nice velvety feedback with no toxicity despite it looking like pebbles in the surface.

Vr

Matt
 

Legion

Staff member
Well it arrived today, and boy what a pain to lap flat! I should have probably just used SiC and the glass plate…but too late now!

It was greasy and dirty!
View attachment 1431222View attachment 1431223

Nothing that an hour and a nano plate couldn’t fix…
View attachment 1431224View attachment 1431225

It’s very very smooth to the touch, despite its appearance. I ran a test razor on it with water for about 8-10 minutes, just doing light laps…the feedback was a somewhat velvety delight. Under the loupe, the edge looked fine, and the scratch pattern very light…negligible. I will test my big slate tonight or tomorrow, and then try this one next.

Do you guys think it would give a better final edge with some WD40, or water?

Vr

Matt
Oil, for sure. I’m not that partial to the feel of slates with water, but oil makes them much nicer.
 
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Legion

Staff member
So let me ask you about the color. Based on what I see here and what I have noticed from that seller. Do you think the colors in his photos are enhanced? I noticed all his stones look harder and shinier than they should plus the color really pops in his pics while looks much more muted in yours. Is it really as green as his pics made it look? I have just noticed this seller can make a sand stone look like the hardest Novaculite.
Ive bought a couple of oiled up SIC stones because they looked green in the pics. Not saying the sellers do it on purpose, but…
 
Ive bought a couple of oiled up SIC stones because they looked green in the pics. Not saying the sellers do it on purpose, but…

I've been burned by this multiple times, so frustrating! The most devious was a queercreek that I swear was dunked in green coloring or green grease....
 
So let me ask you about the color. Based on what I see here and what I have noticed from that seller. Do you think the colors in his photos are enhanced? I noticed all his stones look harder and shinier than they should plus the color really pops in his pics while looks much more muted in yours. Is it really as green as his pics made it look? I have just noticed this seller can make a sand stone look like the hardest Novaculite.

Interesting point / question.
 
Well it arrived today, and boy what a pain to lap flat! I should have probably just used SiC and the glass plate…but too late now!

It was greasy and dirty!
View attachment 1431222View attachment 1431223

Nothing that an hour and a nano plate couldn’t fix…
View attachment 1431224View attachment 1431225

It’s very very smooth to the touch, despite its appearance. I ran a test razor on it with water for about 8-10 minutes, just doing light laps…the feedback was a somewhat velvety delight. Under the loupe, the edge looked fine, and the scratch pattern very light…negligible. I will test my big slate tonight or tomorrow, and then try this one next.

Do you guys think it would give a better final edge with some WD40, or water?

Vr

Matt

Oil definitely for Idwals imo.

Yours looks like it might have some similar white quartz bits that a recent one of mine had, which I felt were screwing it up a bit for razor edges. Fingers crossed not tho!
 
I bought an unknown stone lot from england that arrived 2 days ago. I asked @cotedupy his guesses while in transit and impressively he guessed correct on all 5! One was an oil synthetic,
one nice purple welsh slate, and the other 3 I believe are my first Llyn Idwals!

Before lapping including the purple slate:
20220331_171216.jpg


Unfinished face big one:
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After alot of elbow grease and SiC:
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Probably idwals alone:
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These are very nice sharpening stones! The feedback is somewhere between arkansas and slate, chalky? Fortunately for me the large one is softest as I needed to lap a good ways down, it makes a surprising amout of grey swarf with knife pressure! The other two are about the same hardness but the bluer one is a finer polisher and put an almost perfect mirror on my razor bevel! I measured g/cm3 density of largest at ~2.7 and other two at ~2.76. Happy to have three different types in a range from medium to extra fine to play with. Now I just need a charnley to compare them to...
 
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