Ketogenic Diet?

[Chango]

@Doc4 I just tuned into MCT oil recently and finally ordered a bottle. I've been relying on coconut oil until now (cooking, in the coffee, in the fat bombs) as well as avocados. For the past few months I've been blessed to have an uncle and a friend with avocado trees.

Avocados and spinach are my go to greens and give me the soluble and insoluble fiber I really need. When I first started I had a problem regulating myself. Pardon the TMI, but when it came to the potty I was either the Sahara Desert or the Exxon Valdez. Avocados seem to keep my insides at a happy medium. And I had no idea that they have more potassium than a banana.

Yeah I got cheese all over the fridge!! And almonds are my nuts of choice. I never had almond flour and coconut flour in my house until now too.

It's been a great journey so far. I feel great!! Good energy. My waist is 5 inches smaller, I feel more agile at work and I'm comfortable taking my shirt off at the beach. My joints feel better and my cardio is Improving. My 12hr fasting BGL is a low-normal levels and my BP is consistently 1teens over 70s. I don't have the ability to check cholesterol at home so I have to wait for the doc appt.

 

[Doc4]

I just tuned into MCT oil recently and finally ordered a bottle.

Cool.

There are two kinds generally available: regular (a clear liquid oil) and "emulsified" (a white and usually flavoured liquid.) I put a shot of the regular kind in my bulletproof coffee every morning. I put a shot of the emulsified in my coffee at work or on the road (where I don't have ready access to butter and a blender.) I don't cook with MCT oil though ... if memory serves it doesn't do well with cooking. When I cook it's with ghee (clarified butter) and when SWMBO cooks it's with coconut oil (the solid stuff in a tub.)

Bulletproof coffee ... I don't use the "official" products from the actual Bulletproof company, but I do mix coffee, MCT oil and butter in the blender for a great morning energy drink. I now add a scoop of this to my coffee blender, and get a great chocolate-coffee drink. Mmmm!

When I add the emulsified MCT oil to my coffee at work, I also often give it a shot of this, and end up with a tangy orange-flavoured coffee.

 

[oc_in_fw]

Does she like photography, he asked him knowingly.

 

[dangerousdon]

Man...you guys are giving me some great info to chew on...thanks! I realized after I posted this in the Mess Hall it probably should go somewhere else. I will likely start a new thread in The Clubhouse. But I will put a link here of the other thread I start. Thank you so much for all the great comments!

 

[Doc4]

I realized after I posted this in the Mess Hall it probably should go somewhere else. I will likely start a new thread in The Clubhouse.

PM a mod and he can move the thread for you.

 

[dangerousdon]

PM a mod and he can move the thread for you.

Touche

 

[Phog Allen]

I have a nephew who started this a month or so ago. 38 pounds down already. Just over a month. I can hear the detractors now. You cannot lose weight that fast! Yes you can. I took off 40 pounds in four months a little over a year ago and didn't even follow a 'diet' plan. I just ate much less of everything I was eating and made a continued effort to avoid fast foods(really no effort since I can barely tolerate it anymore). I also cut WAY down on pastry. This last Christmastide was as usual a let down of sorts but I put on no weight as of today. I have taken off a total of 60 pounds in one year. As of 15 July, 2017.

Which brings us where? Well even though I am maintaining the lost weight I still feel like my diet is out of sorts. At times i am starving myself of vital nutrients. I know this because I will lift weights(don't get me wrong. There is no great weights here but much more than I was able in the beginning) and feel week as a kitten sometimes. A fairly hearty meal is the cure sometimes. I do intend to stay more conservative on the carbs after pies, cakes, and cranberry sauce. And perish the thought of canned sauce. It had port and orange juice in it. Still, you get the drift. You only get lucky for so long.

I don't know if I will go keto but I will be consulting with the nephew about his experiences. And I do agree that many physicians are going to give you a very generic CYA answer or suggestion. I just don't honestly know of I can give up bread. Both in loaf and liquid form.

Edited; You diabetics are well advised to research ANY dietary manoeuver. Diabetics respond to different things in wildly unpredictable ways sometimes. And as an added thought, I also believe weight loss is not as simple as calories in/out. It is a huge part but not all of of it. You have to reeducate your body at times.

 

[Alacrity59]

Guys I've been reading like a mad thing. My wife and I will be joining you. I think the science it there for this idea.

 

[Member357]

I'm 2.5 months in, and down 13kg (from 88 to 75).
It's the easiest thing I've done in my life, and I say this as someone who loved chocolate, chips, bread, beer....
I'm never hungry, energy levels are stable, great blood pressure readings now, and my previous several days a week headaches have all but gone. Also no migraines since I started. I did it because at the age of 43 and with two very young kids, I wanted to be healthy enough to stick around and watch them grow up. I'm a convert for life.
Just make sure you get enough potassium, sodium, and magnesium, and drink plenty of water.

Sent from my XT1685 using Tapatalk

 

[JimP]

UPDATE: Just got my bloodwork back from eating Keto for about 8 months now. EVERYTHING is good with the exception of my LDL (it is slightly high (14% over range)). This is a HUGE improvement; my cholesterol has been high for years. My triglycerides are good; HDL is good (has been horrid for years); ratio is excellent and puts me at 1/2 the average risk.

Now - the big picture:

- My blood pressure is ideal.
- My cholesterol initially spiked a bit. I talked to my Doc at about the 2 month mark and he told me that it would take a couple more months to regulate. It has and is now very good. The best I've had in over 20 years.
- My energy is great. I intermittently fast (don't eat breakfast and I work out at noon before I eat) and I do HIIT (high-intensity interval training) with weights. I'm a big believer in "get in, get out" of the gym. None of the younger military cats will train with me as I wear them out.
- Someone alluded to increased "other" benefits and I can attest to that as well. "Relations" are much more frequent and satisfying. I attribute this to the loss of fat and better blood profile. The loss of fat reduces the aromatase conversion of testosterone to estrogen. That means we have less estrogen and more useable testosterone. This is just MY opinion (although look to the increase of estrogen and the decrease of Test as we age science as fact). The reduced fat percentage carries over to improved biology in your chemistry.
I am also endeavoring to reduce overall inflammation response as I am (again, just MY research) a big believer that insulin production and spiking is a big contributor to systemic inflammation and over-all disease. So far, I am very happy with how I am feeling and the bodies response.

I need to incorporate more stretching into my physical regime and will start once al the holiday company has left.

Once again - try it for 30 days....STRICT. If you don't like it, you can always go back to eating like crap.

 

[Doc4]

You cannot lose weight that fast! Yes you can.

In part, it also depends on how overweight one is when starting.

I still feel like my diet is out of sorts. At times i am starving myself of vital nutrients. I know this because I will lift weights(don't get me wrong. There is no great weights here but much more than I was able in the beginning) and feel week as a kitten sometimes.

Supplements (vitamins, minerals, &c) can help, as well as eating the best of the "leafy greens" AKA crunch-iferous vegetables.

I don't know if I will go keto but ...

Certainly at least investigate it.

I also believe weight loss is not as simple as calories in/out

Totally true.

Yes, nobody will lose weight on a 5,000 calorie per day diet, but ... your body reacts to different foods differently, some in a much more beneficial way than others. Best to find the foods that work best and eat those.

It's the easiest thing I've done in my life, and I say this as someone who loved chocolate, chips, bread, beer....
I'm never hungry, energy levels are stable, great blood pressure readings now, and my previous several days a week headaches have all but gone. Also no migraines since I started. I did it because at the age of 43 and with two very young kids, I wanted to be healthy enough to stick around and watch them grow up. I'm a convert for life.
Just make sure you get enough potassium, sodium, and magnesium, and drink plenty of water.

Great news!

This is a HUGE improvement

Kudos!

 

[dangerousdon]

I have to say that I am overwhelmed by the number of members that are in support of keto or at least in support of researching it. When I first started looking into it I really thought this was a fringe diet that no one can really do. I am finding that there is so much information out there and many who have changed their lifestyles. I just want to thank all of you for your support.

 

[Rusty Blade]

This thread has been an interesting read. I am intrigued by the idea...and just might give it a go. The one thing that bothers me is that the diet just seems counterintuitive. Maybe the years of "don't eat fat" brainwashing has been too effective with me. And the keto diet seems heavy in fats...albeit good fats. I need to read more about it...and we need to finish off the Xmas goodies first! I think if I stayed off alcohol, bread and sugars I would lose a few pounds easily.

 

[Phog Allen]

In part, it also depends on how overweight one is when stsrting

Doc, a very valid point. I was a good four and a half stone overweight when I started. At least sixty pounds. So yes, I had a lot of 'free weight' to shed.

I never felt like I was starving or out of sorts bioligically. No weird rashes, hair loss, or joint pain. I am also of the belief that just about everything we've been taught the last fifty years about nutrition should be viewed with highly sceptical eye.

I suggest folks watch a funny-ish documentary titled 'Fathead'. The information there is sobering. And unkike some wannbe gurus, the guy does not claim to have all the answers. Only some that worked for him.

 

[JimP]

This thread has been an interesting read. I am intrigued by the idea...and just might give it a go. The one thing that bothers me is that the diet just seems counterintuitive. Maybe the years of "don't eat fat" brainwashing has been too effective with me. And the keto diet seems heavy in fats...albeit good fats. I need to read more about it...and we need to finish off the Xmas goodies first! I think if I stayed off alcohol, bread and sugars I would lose a few pounds easily.

This^^^^ is what "gets me" as well!! I had a HUGE issue with wrapping my head around the concept that INCREASING fat intake leads to the loss of weight and better blood profiles. All I can say is that it worked for me....for now. There is a youtube video out there that explains the science of how it lowers blood pressure but about ten seconds into it my head hurt as it was obviously produced for biologists or Med Docs. I was skeptical until my bloodwork came back the other day. I can't argue with success. So, although I miss eating pasta and regular pizza, I'll continue this as I like how I feel and I like what it has done to my body.

 

[ruckin]

One thing to consider is that there are basically three kinds of food... no not beer chocolate and icecream They are proteins, carbohydrates, and fats. If you look at things in a percentage point of view and reduce (or eliminate) one of the categories the other two will go up percentage wise. So with a keto diet you basically remove carbohydrates, but you also don't want to go overboard on proteins or you body will make them into glucose too. The amount you need varies based on your lean muscle mass and how much exercise/working out you are doing.

So if I cut out carbohydrates and keep proteins to a modest amount the only other lever here is fat. As a percentage fat goes up. But if you are like me and already have a bunch excess... I do consume more fat than protein or carbs but the total consumption of calories is less because I want my body to utilize some of the excess fat that I have been storing on my body.

Once the body transitions to metabolizing fats as a source of energy rather than being dependent on converting carbohydrates to glucose I find that I don't crave food all the time. As a math guy not a doctor I would describe it as carbs burn faster and hotter while fats provide more of an even slower burn.

Ruckin

 

[OtterLunacy]

From my understanding, the great enemies of good health in general are: grains, grains, a few more grains, processed sugars, and saturated fats. If you are accepting of evolutionary theory, then the (proposed) explanation becomes wonderfully simple: we've only had access to these things in our diet for a few thousand years and our bodies still haven't adjusted to having them compose a significant portion of our diet. So if we eat a diet that better reflects our ancestors' then our bodies should handle it better than all of this "new" junk.

We crave sugar and fat because those tribal ancestors always needed more calories and these "easy" sources were relatively rare "treats." Grains tend to be turned into bread, which is very carb-dense. Carbs are basically entire chains of sugar molecules that your body can break down easily into tons of sugar. Don't believe me? Try putting a little bread in your mouth and leave it there for a little while. Your saliva will start breaking down the carbs into simple sugars and the flavor will noticeably sweeten over time. There's some other research suggesting that wheat gluten and related molecules are actually rather bad for you, almost like an addictive drug, but I'm not too familiar with that or how reliable it is.

Another thing about those three "evil" "foods" is that they are basically only useful as calories to burn; there's no real nutritional value to them. It's like only worrying about putting gas in your car with no thought to oil, radiator fluid, etc. It'll run fine for a while but eventually you'll have a serious problem on your hands!

This^^^^ is what "gets me" as well!! I had a HUGE issue with wrapping my head around the concept that INCREASING fat intake leads to the loss of weight and better blood profiles.

One of the big "revelations" of the past several years is that you aren't quite what you eat. Consuming cholesterol does not mean your cholesterol will be high. Similarly, eating fats doesn't necessarily mean you will be fat. What doctors seem to have forgotten at some point is that the mouth is not a magical portal to the rest of the body; food that goes into the mouth has to be digested. Complex molecules generally either get broken down or pass all the way through the body.

The way it works out, carbs entering the body can often be turned into body fat while fats are often burned as energy--ironic, right? But, as you probably know already, not all fats are created equal and some are significantly better for you than others. There's a bunch more to it but I'm at the limit of my off-the-cuff information; any further and I'll need to start citing research articles!

 

[Doc4]

If you are accepting of evolutionary theory, then the (proposed) explanation becomes wonderfully simple: we've only had access to these things in our diet for a few thousand years and our bodies still haven't adjusted to having them compose a significant portion of our diet. So if we eat a diet that better reflects our ancestors' then our bodies should handle it better than all of this "new" junk.

Personally, I'm not overly keen on the "what our caveman ancestors ate" solution ... I see it as a good starting point for scientific investigation, but I think we should focus on what science tells us is optimal rather than the "this is what I figure cavemen ate so I'll eat it too" Paleo approach. The big-picture stuff like "skip the grains and refined sugars" bit is where the two approaches start, and that's all well and good, but beyond that (and even for that) I go with what science tells me will work best.

 

[OtterLunacy]

@Doc4 Believe me, I'm a science guy and not at all buying into any sort of romanticized "noble savage" BS or anything like that. It just so happens that the Paleo diet is (sort-of) onto something. We should take advantage of the wide variety of food and nutrition available to us. But our biology hasn't changed that much in the past several thousand years. We're still the same species and we are still adapted to eat pretty much the same stuff.

A word of caution: Science doesn't tell you anything. Scientists, and the people who muddle through their research notes, tell you what they think is right. All of these people are human, and prone to making mistakes. And that doesn't even begin to consider people who have ulterior motives.

 

[Rusty Blade]

I've been reading more about the keto diet and one thing is clear to me. Starting with the typical North American diet and switching to a keto diet we would do the following: dramatically decrease the carbs and sugar in our diet, dramatically increase the veggies in our diet, moderately decrease the protein in our diets and change the kinds of fats we eat. I think most of us get plenty of fat now...no need to increase it much more. Still learning about keto...