Men you didnt ;-)
Post 14 Shaveden, Posted by Imperia La Roccia...
Read also the test result from HolyRollah at the End
Imperia la Roccia
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Men you didnt ;-)
Post 14 Shaveden, Posted by Imperia La Roccia...
Read also the test result from HolyRollah at the End
What if after purchasing the stone, you found out that you had already bought one previously that was just called something else?
I went back and checked both guys on eBay. Neither one was selling a private label stone prior to the ILR. One of sells watches.
Sebastian may have linked the wrong thread. Post no. 18 here, where Imperia la Roccia writes: "The slabs that I get come out of the Imperia region of Italy (hence the name)."
As for Bushdoctor's posts, here's the thread from Il Rasoio: pagina 22, and SRP, post 24.
The issue for me isn't the quality of the stone, but where it comes from. If it is claimed or implied to be from Imperia, or nearby, and isn't, then that is misleading.
I'm not saying it isn't where it claims to be from, but that others have questioned this; so further confirmation from another source or further information from the one source making this claim and selling the stone would be helpful.
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This character is beginning to make me suspicious as well. I'm always suspicious of those who are newly registered and vigorously cheerleading/defending something being discussed.
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+1. Could be the two guys in the video.
Why? Because I'm more interested in how the stone performs than where it's from? If I wanted a geology discussion I could easily join a geology forum.
I've known for a long time that companies can often be a bit creative in their marketing. I see ingredients on food that says "natural flavorings". Beaver urine is often used as a "natural" raspberry flavor.
One poster here said that he's not interested in the quality of the stone. He's interested in where it's from. Sounds to me like someone that wants to stir the pot with nothing constructive to add or gain.
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Thanks for the cites. On December 14, of last year "Biggreg" evaluated the Imperia la Roccia for SRP. His experience was similar to mine.
"Biggreg" states: "The stone became almost like glass (when wet) as I finished with the W&B.
First Hone
I took a Doubl Duck razor that was already sharp and in my rotation.
I made about 50X strokes (almost no pressure) and stropped, this mornings shave was more comfortable and closer and the razor had a soft feel.
Bottom Line
This hone works well as a final finisher. It will take a little bit to lapp and polish, but it delivers a really nice soft finish and feels like glass to the touch. It cuts faster than the C12K and delivers as good or better results.
Big Greg"
It's not about where the stone is from. Nobody here gives a flying fark about where a stone comes from, only how it works. But being dishonest or misleading about where a stone comes from is a different story. That I don't like.
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Interesting. At the risk of making myself "suspicious" to eKretz, he seems to be proclaiming that those new to the forum should be seen and not heard. They ought not to "defend something being discussed" without his direct invitation? When do new posters get to leave the kid's table? When eKretz says so?
One gets the impression you were bullied as a child. Now you get to try and create your own caste system from the relative safety of your keyboard. Was there a real argument you wish to make? Or do we just get a list of those "suspicious" (folks who disagree with you) and those who are free to join in (those who agree with you?) A little tyrant with big dreams and old scores to settle.
Awesome FIRST POST!
What you need to do, if the product you are raving about is indeed good, is please list a comparison of other stones you are undoubtedly familiar with. Please list your preferred JNats, or at least your honing progression with synthetic stones you favor. Clearly you know quite a bit about honing and natural stones, so I'm eager to see how that knowledge can translate to information we can all benefit from. So far all I know is you like the video and you have disagreed with several established members who know quite a bit about the subject. I look forward to your valuable input!
You're insuating that someone that doesn't have $1000's tied up in stones doesn't know how to hone.
I'm at least a little curious as to why (if you don't believe these stones to be any good) you would put them in the same race. Not saying they wouldn't preform well, but, then again, they're only $40 not $600.
No he just asked if Gar1 has some comparisons made to possibly other stones "he might" own or even not....
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im very interested in this thread. i have this stone, and purchased it based on reviews i read on SRD that basically said "meh, not bad, totally works". but i am now wondering if i should invest in a "better" stone or if its not worth the expense at this point. . im brand new to honing. if anyone has legit comparisons that would indeed be helpful. the imperia is literally the only stone i "know".
Buy it...actually all information available on the boards was posted here, no more Threads are available....just one on Razorandstone. So isnt that enough to decide ?!?
Actually thats the point i still did not bought one of those because i havent seen one of the "active" members buying and testing one of those....for me not enough information to say "yeahh buy it"
Not knowing how experienced Holy Rollah is, i dont like that the result of the comparison between Imperia La Roccia and C12k....
That was cited from HolyRollah and it was the bottom Line missing before:
"Bottom line: I truly cannot detect any perceivable difference between the razors off the 'Italia Rocca' or the Chinese 12. Both cutting in similar fashion, requiring a significant number of laps, and more importantly, both stones feel identical (the tactile feedback of the grit) on all the lapping strokes.
If I were blind-folded (not recommended while honing
), I guarantee I couldn't say which stone was which, they are that similar. You'd almost think they were from the same quarry. The final edges off both stones were both quite sharp (popping arm hairs), so either will provide a decent shave. For me, I now have essentially two virtually identical fairly-slow cutting finishers.
Since acquiring an Escher—which has a vastly different silky 'feel' than either of these stones, I don't foresee either of these other naturals getting as much use as I originally anticipated."
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Fair enough. But I haven't really "raved" about anything. Please be fair and do not misquote me. I am here to learn not really teach. Sometimes it feels like entering a cult though, with its own self serving secret handshakes. I think it would be cool to be talented enough to hone a blade to a soft edge with only two stones. But 1) I don't have that kind of talent yet; and 2) I really love a J-NAT pre polisher I bought from Maksim some time ago. A beautiful Aiiwatani Nashiji Kiita. It prepares the blade for a thuringian or coticule in a way I don't think I could ever get from a 1K bevel setting stone. It is the one J-NAT I have that a child could use--that easy.
I tried the la Roccia and it was unusual in that it was harder than a Thuringian or a Dragon's Tongue (much harder); but very fine as well. As the SRP reviewer noted, it was like honing on glass. I think it was actually cutting longer than I thought it was with clear water. It's just an unusual stone, at a more than fair price, and I wanted a fair shake and a fair discussion.
I am far from a honemeister. But since I don't do this for a living I can take my time, a lot of time, at getting things right. Not sure how it would help to know but since you asked I have for some time now preferred Naniwa Choseras, until a J-NAT pre polisher and then a Thuringian. Although of late I am beginning to understand why the Coticule guys are such zealots. If one has the time for it, I truly learned what a soft edge is from a Coticule. But I am still testing, picking and choosing and I would rather experiment then defend some unspoken, almost religious rigidity set by a cadre with financial motives. I haven't really disagreed with established members here. I have only responded to personal attacks and unprofessional asides from the few who clearly are less interested in expanding our knowledge than trashing people they do not know who wish to try new methodologies. What else is this forum for?
As for paper cutting; hard to explain but there is something very cool about testing the entire edge with a consistent, predictable process that works. The somewhat hysterical and knee jerk "but it will permanently damage the blade" is silly at best. I know it is SR Orthodoxy (for which I may be tarred and feathered) but the HHT has somtimes seemed to me to be a cool parlor trick. It tests almost none of the edge. Paper cutting revealed to me that I have a problem setting the heel down squarely on the hone and I am beginning to learn when that "whisper" through the paper means I'm ready for the J-NAT.
That's it for now. I still have miles to go...thanks for asking.
I appreciate the invitation for a real dialogue. I really do.
I tried the la Roccia and it was unusual in that it was harder than a Thuringian or a Dragon's Tongue (much harder); but very fine as well. As the SRP reviewer noted, it was like honing on glass. I think it was actually cutting longer than I thought it was with clear water. It's just an unusual stone, at a more than fair price, and I wanted a fair shake and a fair discussion.
I am far from a honemeister. But since I don't do this for a living I can take my time, a lot of time, at getting things right. Not sure how it would help to know but since you asked I have for some time now preferred Naniwa Choseras, until a J-NAT pre polisher and then a Thuringian. Although of late I am beginning to understand why the Coticule guys are such zealots. If one has the time for it, I truly learned what a soft edge is from a Coticule. But I am still testing, picking and choosing and I would rather experiment then defend some unspoken, almost religious rigidity set by a cadre with financial motives. I haven't really disagreed with established members here. I have only responded to personal attacks and unprofessional asides from the few who clearly are less interested in expanding our knowledge than trashing people they do not know who wish to try new methodologies. What else is this forum for?
As for paper cutting; hard to explain but there is something very cool about testing the entire edge with a consistent, predictable process that works. The somewhat hysterical and knee jerk "but it will permanently damage the blade" is silly at best. I know it is SR Orthodoxy (for which I may be tarred and feathered) but the HHT has somtimes seemed to me to be a cool parlor trick. It tests almost none of the edge. Paper cutting revealed to me that I have a problem setting the heel down squarely on the hone and I am beginning to learn when that "whisper" through the paper means I'm ready for the J-NAT.
That's it for now. I still have miles to go...thanks for asking.
I appreciate the invitation for a real dialogue. I really do.
Sorry Will but just had to Quote this.....
Probably a lot of guys posted here are very active on the Boards, they exchange Information, they write to each other, they read a lot, the stay up the night long here and many are experienced honers.
Most of them tried out a lot of stones, some of them own many many stones.....and yes its difficult to say that a stone is not good without testing it...
But we all know what has been in the past and it wasnt "that often" that new Stones were brought to the market or the forums or cheap stones have been established as high end stones, thats a fact...
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Buy it...actually all information available on the boards was posted here, no more Threads are available....just one on Razorandstone. So isnt that enough to decide ?!?
Actually thats the point i still did not bought one of those because i havent seen one of the "active" members buying and testing one of those....for me not enough information to say "yeahh buy it"
Not knowing how experienced Holy Rollah is, i dont like that the result of the comparison between Imperia La Roccia and C12k....
That was cited from HolyRollah and it was the bottom Line missing before:
"Bottom line: I truly cannot detect any perceivable difference between the razors off the 'Italia Rocca' or the Chinese 12. Both cutting in similar fashion, requiring a significant number of laps, and more importantly, both stones feel identical (the tactile feedback of the grit) on all the lapping strokes.
If I were blind-folded (not recommended while honing
The final edges off both stones were both quite sharp (popping arm hairs), so either will provide a decent shave. For me, I now have essentially two virtually identical fairly-slow cutting finishers.
Since acquiring an Escher—which has a vastly different silky 'feel' than either of these stones, I don't foresee either of these other naturals getting as much use as I originally anticipated."
I read that post by HolyRollah. I found it to be quite informative. I've always been the type of person, though, who wants as much information as possible when making a purchase. Also, I'm on a limited budget. Spending the kind of money on high-end rocks isn't in the foreseeable future. So, I'm left with a choice. Which of my options is going to give me the best results?
I've looked at the prices of Eschers and Thuris and synthetics and coticules and Arks and the C12k and the ILR.
Maybe this topic has been discussed before. What should that matter? This forum doesn't seem to mind rehashing old discussions on the "established" stones. Why not this one?
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