How To Use a Pasted Balsa Strop

[Southbound1]

Your 5k hone should work nicely for removing any fin or wire edge created by that same stone. When you first notice feedback in the form of stiction or just a general change in the feel of the honing action, reduce your pressure to minimum. Hone in hand for better pressure regulation, if you normally bench hone. Work it on out, max out the 5k edge, and then apply pull strokes. I started a thread on Pull Strokes that is worth looking at, I think. Anyway, pull strokes do a nice job of stripping artifacts from the edge. After the pull strokes, retouch the edge with extremely light regular laps. You shouldn't have any fin edge after that.

Very stubborn fin edge might call for honing in slurry on the 5k, or a few light laps on the next coarser stone in your progression. Slurry as you know from your natural honing, is the mortal enemy of fin, wire, burr, etc. It also places a limit on peak sharpness, which you must keep in mind, and requires a followup with thinner slurry and then a clean stone and clear water. You could raise a slurry on the 5k with a DMT card or plate, maybe. Or here is an idea... how about a slurry stone that you already use on a coticule or jnat?

I generally counsel against the use of coarser diamond on balsa. I believe that in midrange, it is important to preserve a nice flat bevel. The resilience of the balsa can work against that. I HAVE honed a couple of razors start to finish on balsa. I was surprised to find that it actually does work fairly well. As good as keeping to lapping film, or very flat stones up to the finish stage? TBH I am not sure yet, but intuitively I have to say that it is probably a mistake to use balsa with coarse abrasives when film or a well lapped stone is available. YMMV. Now the 3u lapping film is generally regarded as close to an 8k stone. The 9u film, somewhere between 2k and 3k depending on the grit scale used. So 5u film should be somewhere within striking distance of your 5k stone. However, diamond paste on balsa behaves differently, because the diamond particles are not on the surface, but are instead embedded in the balsa with only the tops sticking up. So, scratches for the same grit size are a bit shallower. And so, you would have to experiment but I would guess that 9u paste properly applied to properly lapped and backed balsa would maybe be a good starting point if you want to experiment with this. Really though, it is I think a job better suited for film or stone. Once you start on balsa, you are sort of committed to seeing it through to the finish. That is a lot of extra balsa strops to prepare.

Most of us do not thin the paste. We simply dot it around and rub it in, then remove excess with an old tshirt, which seems to work best for that. You really do not want that much, BTW. A pea size amount is quite a lot! Half that much is plenty for a 12" x 3" balsa. You do not want a coating. You want to embed the diamond in the balsa. If it seems like you have enough, you have waaaaaaay too much, and your results will suffer from it. Too much will cut faster, but will not give you as much sharpness.

The pull strokes work great on the 12k Naniwa, too. Try to strip your edge nice and clean on it before hitting the balsa. 1u diamond is just a bit finer than the 12k, but pretty close. However, embedded in the balsa it is less aggressive than the same size grit in a synthetic stone matrix. Nevertheless, most of us do not follow 12k stones with 1u diamond on balsa. Usually from the stone we go to .5u diamond on balsa, then .25u and finally .1u. Always in hand, of course. In fact, I hold my balsa vertically, so that the full weight of the razor does not bear down on it. YMMV. Fin edge cannot form if pressure is too light to deflect the edge. Just in case, I add a few pull strokes to all three stages.

CrOx has been used for generations, discussed and cussed heartily. The biggest problem with CrOx is that it is simply used wrong. CrOx properly applied in the proper amount to a properly lapped and backed balsa plank performs much better than on a leather paddle or loom strop, or worse, a hanging strop. Another difficulty with CrOx is that it is basically only available, due to crystal size, in one size. Or I should say, in one size RANGE. It can be called .5u or .3u grade, and either one is about as appropriate as the other. So precision wise, it does not play well with others. Or even with itself. I once experimented with Chromium Oxide and Iron Oxide on balsa, using the exact same method as with diamond. In theory it should work, though the jump between nominal .5u CrOx and nominal .1u Iron Ox is rather large. What I found is that to get the same approximate results as diamond, I had to go about 500 extremely light laps on each. I could maybe have gone less, with the CrOx but the FeOx is, as I said, a big jump. Definitely not worth it for an edge equal to the diamond edge. For the same work, green and red paste give a usable but definitely noticeably inferior edge. So even though CrOx "works", when anyone asks if it is "okay to use CrOx" instead of diamond, rather than beat around the bush I tell them no, no, no, don't even bother. Because it doesn't matter. They will do it anyway.

Guys who choose to enter the world of Shaving in the Manly Way, with a straight razor, are usually go it alone, stubborn, try it and see type guys. So telling them the right way of doing things is like herding cats. Give them the books and they just chew on the covers. They just do their own thing anyway, and usually only after countless failures they come back and ask again for guidance and then maybe follow it. That's just the way we are. So Long drawn out explanations of the shortcomings of CrOx from me are not common. Better save this one LOL! And I am not at all surprised that you are disillusioned with CrOx. However, I am surprised that you were not able to make it remove your burrs. It should work sort of okay for that, if a mediocre level of sharpness is good enough. Unless those burrs were raised on a much coarser medium.

Yeah , i just thought edge trailing on a firm strop would create wire burrs, because it's basically sharpening with trailing strokes. I was reading on the science of sharp blog and he mentioned edge trailing will cause burrs. In mind I aways thought stropping with pastes or compunds would remove and fin, because knife people use it to remove burrs all the time with excellent results. Venheven or what ever his name was removed burrs from steel with polishing compounds.

 

[Slash McCoy]

Yeah , i just thought edge trailing on a firm strop would create wire burrs, because it's basically sharpening with trailing strokes. I was reading on the science of sharp blog and he mentioned edge trailing will cause burrs

Before accepting that theory as fact, you may want to put it to the test, with a controlled experiment. Intuitively it seems like it would be so. You are sort of pulling on the steel, toward the apex, after all. But I have not found it to be a problem. So the thing to do would be to examine a fresh balsa edge made with no pull strokes after leaving film or stone for balsa, and examine the edge closely under a strong microscope. Both before and after stropping and before and after shaving. Compare pics with a razor that never received the balsa treatment.

Remember, pressure promotes a burr, which develops into a fin or wire edge. The balsa is used with microlight pressure. If you start with a clean edge you should end up with a clean edge, and if you are concerned about it, you can always add some pull strokes to each stage.

 

[Southbound1]

Thanks for the tips! Makes sense. The method on the balsa with the half a pea sized amount and then thoroughly working it in until it embeds into the balsa, just enough for the tips of the diamonds to be exposed, then it would act finer and less aggressive if it was just slather on. I would say the reason that a burr is created on a stone using edge trailing motions is because the 'stone' is all one solid matrix abrasive. Were as on a balsa strop it's mostly balsa contacting the edge and apex and very little diamonds, therefore making the edge trailing here less aggressive and probably more effective in removing a wire edge that creating one, probably even on a 3 micron pasted balsa strop.

 

[Southbound1]

I have almost read this entire thread - Lol. About the concentration, I see you recommend less is better for even distribution on the balsa. The place (hi- tech diamond)I am looking into buying only sells 50%. So would this work, 'if' I dilute/thin down? If so how would one go about it? Would you squeeze half a pea sized amount of diamond slurry in a bowl/container, then add a couple of drops of mineral spirits and thoroughly and then distribute it with a small brush, then work I with hands and when it dry one could wipe down with a teashirt? Or could one put the mineral spirits in one of those 3 oz. Spray bottles, then spray the balsa with a light mist, then get a half a pea sized amount and work it into the slightly dampened balsa that was misted with mineral spirits?

 

[Slash McCoy]

I have almost read this entire thread - Lol. About the concentration, I see you recommend less is better for even distribution on the balsa. The place (hi- tech diamond)I am looking into buying only sells 50%. So would this work, 'if' I dilute/thin down? If so how would one go about it? Would you squeeze half a pea sized amount of diamond slurry in a bowl/container, then add a couple of drops of mineral spirits and thoroughly and then distribute it with a small brush, then work I with hands and when it dry one could wipe down with a teashirt? Or could one put the mineral spirits in one of those 3 oz. Spray bottles, then spray the balsa with a light mist, then get a half a pea sized amount and work it into the slightly dampened balsa that was misted with mineral spirits?

Nah. Just dot it on and rub it in. Nobody dilutes. If nobody else does it, don't do it, until you have made your bones. Once you have some experience, THEN feel free to experiment. The Method is not just some random stuff. It is what has been proven to work really really good. Unproven = bad, when you are just starting out.

The secret to success with The Method is to do it exactly so, no freestyle stuff.

The higher concentration will still work. The important thing is that none is left on the surface of the balsa.

 

[Southbound1]

Nah. Just dot it on and rub it in. Nobody dilutes. If nobody else does it, don't do it, until you have made your bones. Once you have some experience, THEN feel free to experiment. The Method is not just some random stuff. It is what has been proven to work really really good. Unproven = bad, when you are just starting out.

The secret to success with The Method is to do it exactly so, no freestyle stuff.

The higher concentration will still work. The important thing is that none is left on the surface of the balsa.

So as I was telling you earlier before going to naturals I stop at 5k synthetic. I like to remove any fin if they are any. I know you mentioned the pull strokes, I will experiment with that too, but would a 3-4 micron paste be of any help of removing bits of fin?


Gotcha no freestyling, if it ain't broke then don't fix it! I just maybe figured that 50% might clump up and not get distributed less uniform it not thinned a little?

 

[Southbound1]

I got everything glued down. I had to settle for the flattest 3x12 tile at Lowe's, and it ain't true!! No matter how much the balsa is lapped it will never be true, because the balsa was formed to the tile base, and as I said the 3x12 tile ain't true.. I am able to put accurate straight edge and slide a piece of paper in the center

 

[Slash McCoy]

Nah. You just keep lapping til the balsa is flat. Don't use too much pressure. The plate SHOULD be flat but doesn't have to be, since you lap after assembly.

 

[Southbound1]

Nope it won't, not using much pressure. I only got a 1/4" piece thick balsa - already lapped half of it off. The base ain't true and the substrate 'was a 1/4" balsa - well when I glued it and weighed it down, it formed to the out of true backing. If something ain't straight to start with, and you glue a thin piece of balsa to it - it will stay that shape..

I am using a piece of 1/2" float glass with sandpaper adhesived down perfectly smooth - it's how I lap 'all' of my hones and they come out perfectly true every time.

 

[MO1]

Glue it to something not dead flat, balsa forms after it, then lap. The lapped balsa should be flat now, right? Maybe use more glue at the base so the glue fill in any gaps?

 

[Southbound1]

I have decided to get the taps plastic acrylic/plexiglass. I need some info from you guys who have purchased from them. I don't have any experience with this type of material. Is this stuff as flat and true as glass? Is 3/8 thick rigid enough. Concerning the edges do I need to get routed edges? Or is the rough sawed edges straight enough.

Thanks,
Mike

 

[mglindo]

I have decided to get the taps plastic acrylic/plexiglass. I need some info from you guys who have purchased from them. I don't have any experience with this type of material. Is this stuff as flat and true as glass? Is 3/8 thick rigid enough. Concerning the edges do I need to get routed edges? Or is the rough sawed edges straight enough.

Thanks,
Mike

I got mine off of *bay for $8 each and $7 shipping. 3/4xx3x12 cheap enough and flat enough. Don't need to worry about the edges as you are going to attach balsa to them yes? you can round the edges of the balsa if you care to but I did not. I used rubber cement by the way.

Mike

 

[dsteidtmann]

Okay, so... on the one hand, The Man Himself McCoy says:

"The secret to success with The Method is to do it exactly so, no freestyle stuff."

My success so far has definitely been a testament to the effectiveness of following The Method pretty precisely. On the other hand, I've found one small change to be helpful. To be fair, it might be entirely in my head and not real - things at this level of detail are difficult to quantify exactly.

Here's the small change that I humbly submit for inclusion into "The Method". After shaving, I do about 20 light laps on my clean leather strop. THEN I do 50 to 100 laps on the 0.1um balsa strop, then I wipe the blade with a t-shirt and then I do 30 laps or so on my clean leather strop.

My theory is that by straightening the edge and aligning it a little after shaving, the 0.1um balsa isn't trying to grind off any deformed sections of the edge. It can do its regular job of polishing.

The shaves where I've done this seem to be ever-so-slightly less irritating to my skin. In my head, I imagine it's because the edge is slightly less "toothy" and more smooth.

Either way, I appreciate the help everybody here has given me!

Cheers,
Dave

 

[Slash McCoy]

Once you have created some Method edges, it is perfectly okay to experiment. In fact I encourage it, once you have The Method nailed and know how sharp a razor can be.

Stropping between honing stages is not a new thing. I am sure plenty of guys have done it that way and been happy with the results. Do it like you feel it. Absolutely precisely following The Method is something I will always recommend to beginners seeking their first super sharp edge. It is THE WAY to get it right, BETTER than right, the first time or first dozen times. But there comes a time in the journey where departure from the well marked road is adventure and not just certain folly and failure. Sometimes what you try, doesn't work or doesn't work as well. Sometimes it does, and sometimes it is more enjoyable, and gives you an extra bit of pride in your edge. It's all good. Do it like you feel it, and tell us how it goes.

 

[Southbound1]

I got mine off of *bay for $8 each and $7 shipping. 3/4xx3x12 cheap enough and flat enough. Don't need to worry about the edges as you are going to attach balsa to them yes? you can round the edges of the balsa if you care to but I did not. I used rubber cement by the way.

Mike

I haven't gotten my acrylic back yet, but I was thinking of using 3m/77. Would this work?

 

[Slash McCoy]

I haven't gotten my acrylic back yet, but I was thinking of using 3m/77. Would this work?

The spray adhesive works okay. Spray both balsa and acrylic, let them get about half dry, then stick them together and walah they are stuck.

 

[rbscebu]

An observation on doing the "pull stroke" while using a hanging 0.1 micron balsa strop:

When using my 0.1 micron balsa strop in the hanging position, I find it best to do my pull strokes near the top of the balsa strop about where my fingers are holding the balsa strop. I feel that this gives me better control during the pull stroke.

 

[kohalajohn]

Took a full beard off today. I mean a full, thick beard. Dovo Bismarck blade done on the method.

Super easy. Just one pass wtg and it took it smoothly and cleanly off.

So yeah, it creates a sharp edge.

 

[kohalajohn]

I notice recent posts here about lapping the balsa. Last time, I did something different. I just dropped a full size sheet of 400 grit sandpaper on my granite kitchen counter. Held it down with a couple fingers of my left hand while right hand lapped the balsa.

No glue to hold it and no solvent to remove it.

 

[rbscebu]

Pasted Balsa Strop Storage

I'm handy with a sewing machine so made three "socks" for my pasted balsa strops. The "sock" material is a heavy-duty waterproof nylon.

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