- Thread starter
- #201
Why forum hop when you can get them all here.
You're not kidding.
I learn more about everything here.
How to sharpen a knife
- Thread starter ouch
- Start date
You're not kidding.
I learn more about everything here.
thanks for all of the great suggestions!
i have been thinking of a cleaver for some time now.
chris- good to hear that those two tojiros handle most things. i will probably get the shorter gyutou and the shorter petty from them.
ian-arent these speciality forums horrible on the pocket book? i have gone from one forum to the next aquiring new ads.
so a question on the chinese cleaver- would a inexpensive one from a asian store work ok since the edge isnt necessarily sharpened to the same degree as the japanese knives?
cheers!
ryan
It depends on what you're looking for, if you're looking for a slicer, you may want to spend a little more money, if you're looking for a chopper, there's no need (in my humble and limited experiece) to spend big bucks. I've not seen a lot of cooks in Chinatown wielding expensive cleavers - most of the cleavers they use can be found in the local Asian stores. I've had one of the solid stainless cleavers (cost me about $15) and it took a reasonably good edge and a ton of abuse.
perfect chris! thanks for the input... again.
picked up a $15 jobbie today. i will hone it up tonight and give it a spin.
cheers,
ryan
i am counting down the days until the korin sale.
Finally watched all the videos Nice Job Ouch!
I know this thread was started along time ago but is one of my favorite subjects and often way over complicated. Here is some reading from some one I agree with.
http://www.knifecenter.com/knifecenter/sharp[URL="http://users.ameritech.net/knives/Juranitch1977Feb.htm"]http://users.ameritech.net/knives/Juranitch1977Feb.htmen/instruct3.html[/URL]
http://beast.voltztech.com/~razoredge/pdf/ax.pdf
http://beast.voltztech.com/~razoredge/pdf/sharp.pdf
His book is priceless and will teach you how to sharpen anything.
http://www.knifecenter.com/knifecenter/sharp[URL="http://users.ameritech.net/knives/Juranitch1977Feb.htm"]http://users.ameritech.net/knives/Juranitch1977Feb.htmen/instruct3.html[/URL]
http://beast.voltztech.com/~razoredge/pdf/ax.pdf
http://beast.voltztech.com/~razoredge/pdf/sharp.pdf
His book is priceless and will teach you how to sharpen anything.
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I picked up a Spyderco Sharpmaker recently that I am very happy with.
I just thought I'd revive this thread - great advice for those wanting this info.
The reason for the bump is that I've been working on my free-hand sharpening technique on some of my less expensive Western knives and am quite pleased with the results - its really much easier than people think it is.
Also, I've just used some of the stones I have for my razors - Norton 220/1000, Norton 4,000/8,000, a no-name 1,000/4,000 waterstone and my Norton flattening stone.
It took me about 45 minutes to re-profile the edge and bring it up to a mirror 8,000 (which is completely overkill for a kitchen knife). Future sharpenings will take much less time since the bevel is nicely established.
While I like my sharpmaker, I find the results I'm getting with my stones to be even better.
The reason for the bump is that I've been working on my free-hand sharpening technique on some of my less expensive Western knives and am quite pleased with the results - its really much easier than people think it is.
Also, I've just used some of the stones I have for my razors - Norton 220/1000, Norton 4,000/8,000, a no-name 1,000/4,000 waterstone and my Norton flattening stone.
It took me about 45 minutes to re-profile the edge and bring it up to a mirror 8,000 (which is completely overkill for a kitchen knife). Future sharpenings will take much less time since the bevel is nicely established.
While I like my sharpmaker, I find the results I'm getting with my stones to be even better.
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I bought too many sharpening gizmos before I realized that none are as versatile, easy to use, and give better results than plain, old stones. I grew up using oilstones, but switched to waterstones in the past couple years. I learned how to sharpen in Scouts, another skill that has served me well throughout life.
Sure, learning to sharpen with stones takes practice, but once mastered, one can pretty much sharpen anything.
Sure, learning to sharpen with stones takes practice, but once mastered, one can pretty much sharpen anything.
Thanks for reviving this thread it has made some great reading and fun to see Ouch's videos.
My sharpening hobby is what led me to wet-shaving. It seemed very natural to progress to sharpening razor blades, since I already had the equipment.
I've given up on the women in my life, though. What can you do with someone who prefers dull blades? I've always felt a dull knife is MUCH more dangerous, but women (at least in my family) are the opposite.
I've given up on the women in my life, though. What can you do with someone who prefers dull blades? I've always felt a dull knife is MUCH more dangerous, but women (at least in my family) are the opposite.
- Thread starter
- #211
When I read that Chris sharpened his knives, I had to redo several of mine, even though they didn't really need it. Such is the nature of this hobby.
Sharpening is weird- more often than not, I feel as if I didn't do as good a job as on my previous attempt. Yet, I notice an overall progression in the results acheived over the years. Much like brewing a cup of tea or whipping up a bowl of lather, when you reach the point where you do it without thinking you are finally at the stage where your technique can truly improve.
Which brings me to perhaps the most important part of sharpening- the coarse stage. Of the arato, nakato, and shiageto hones (coarse, medium, and fine; there is also a kongosa, or ultra-coarse) it is considered de rigueur to advise the novice to concentrate on the medium and fine, and to avoid the coarse altogether. There is good reason for this- you can get in a lot of trouble with a coarse stone, whereas you can polish away all day with a fine stone without fear of damaging your blade. It's a very good idea for the rookie to master the required muscle memory by first establishing a decent bevel with a medium stone, the refining it to his heart's content with a fine.
The trouble is, almost all of the important work is accomplished at the coarse level. That shiny 5-30K edge will disappear quickly, and if it hasn't been applied to a properly prepared edge, your blade may look great but not be very sharp. An edge that has been perfectly ground with a 220 stone and nothing more will be a more useful tool.
The breakthrough comes when you have mastered adequate technique and developed sufficient confidence to tackle the coarse stage, with grits of 500 and below.
[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8F1MNRmTs-U[/YOUTUBE]
Sharpening is weird- more often than not, I feel as if I didn't do as good a job as on my previous attempt. Yet, I notice an overall progression in the results acheived over the years. Much like brewing a cup of tea or whipping up a bowl of lather, when you reach the point where you do it without thinking you are finally at the stage where your technique can truly improve.
Which brings me to perhaps the most important part of sharpening- the coarse stage. Of the arato, nakato, and shiageto hones (coarse, medium, and fine; there is also a kongosa, or ultra-coarse) it is considered de rigueur to advise the novice to concentrate on the medium and fine, and to avoid the coarse altogether. There is good reason for this- you can get in a lot of trouble with a coarse stone, whereas you can polish away all day with a fine stone without fear of damaging your blade. It's a very good idea for the rookie to master the required muscle memory by first establishing a decent bevel with a medium stone, the refining it to his heart's content with a fine.
The trouble is, almost all of the important work is accomplished at the coarse level. That shiny 5-30K edge will disappear quickly, and if it hasn't been applied to a properly prepared edge, your blade may look great but not be very sharp. An edge that has been perfectly ground with a 220 stone and nothing more will be a more useful tool.
The breakthrough comes when you have mastered adequate technique and developed sufficient confidence to tackle the coarse stage, with grits of 500 and below.
[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8F1MNRmTs-U[/YOUTUBE]
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Ok, I just got back from the woodworking store with my new 800/4000 water stone. It cost $28 + tax. I can't wait to get started.
Tim
Tim
I have a few questions about using my new water stone.
It says to soak it in water prior to use. How long should I soak it?
This also implies that it holds water. How long do I need to dry it before storing?
Besides the flattening advice given earlier in this thread, what else do I need to know?
Thanks,
Tim
It says to soak it in water prior to use. How long should I soak it?
This also implies that it holds water. How long do I need to dry it before storing?
Besides the flattening advice given earlier in this thread, what else do I need to know?
Thanks,
Tim
- Thread starter
- #214
A general rule is the coarser the grit, the longer the soak. Ten minutes is usually more than enough for medium/coarse to medium/fine stones. I have a Suehiro 220 that dries the second you remove it from the water- it seems that no amount of soaking is enough. Other fine stones may only need a 1-2 minute dip. Ceramic based Shaptons don't need soaking at all- give the a spritz and fire away.
You'll definately want to put them away dry. Again, this varies from stone to stone. It may take a few hours on a hot summer day or several days during the winter. Adding a bit of bleach to the soaking tub before drying them will prevent mold. Keep them out of the sun, too.
Good choice- an 800/4K is a single stone that can give you a very good edge.
Thanks, very much. I am on my way to getting started.
Tim
Tim
I've been reading a lot about sharpening lately and stumbled upon this thread. Just read through it as I'm going to get myself into sharpening. Lots of good info here. Just ordered a combo stone. Bumpity bump.
To the horror of many in here, I'll simply state that I found this electric sharpener.
It uses a wet 220 stone that's about 2 inch wide, spinning at a low speed allowing to work the edge very nicely.
I've been using it on my german and japanese steel knives after testing it out on a few cheapies and was able to obtain a very nice edge that slices through paper better than a paper cutter.
I don't plan to shave with my kitchen knives; I aim for sharp enough that I can slice through a ripe tomato easily without more than the weight of the blade, and this machine does it very well in about 15 minutes per knife.
I wish that they'd make other grits for it, but even getting a replacement for the wheel appears to be fairly difficult. So to compensate, it's a question of going very lightly and working the blade across on a constant manner and maintaining a good angle.
It uses a wet 220 stone that's about 2 inch wide, spinning at a low speed allowing to work the edge very nicely.
I've been using it on my german and japanese steel knives after testing it out on a few cheapies and was able to obtain a very nice edge that slices through paper better than a paper cutter.
I don't plan to shave with my kitchen knives; I aim for sharp enough that I can slice through a ripe tomato easily without more than the weight of the blade, and this machine does it very well in about 15 minutes per knife.
I wish that they'd make other grits for it, but even getting a replacement for the wheel appears to be fairly difficult. So to compensate, it's a question of going very lightly and working the blade across on a constant manner and maintaining a good angle.
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You definitely don't need an expensive setup for kitchen knives, I've put an edge on a £10 cleaver that will shave arm hair using a £2 oil stone (200/600ish grit) and a honing steel
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