Honing Setups

[richmondesi]

Two questions. What is your best setup in terms of getting a razor shave ready? From bevel setting to polishing.

Also, what kind of loupe/microscope do you use to monitor your progress?

Thanks!

 

[SavantStrike]

I'm still a newbie as well, and I have no plans to buy any hones other than the ones I already have, but I've had good luck with the following:

DMT 1200 grit for bevels (I don't think I would enjoy an 8k grit DMT, but for a bevel, this thing is FAST)
Norton 4k/8k for most of the work on the edge (you could substitute a lot of different stones for these)
Chinese 12k for final polish.

Maybe something super fine for an even more ridiculous edge, but IDK that it's really necessary.
If I did it all over I might get a Naniwa 12k instead because they are supposed to be a lot faster. A spyderco UF would be awesome, but lapping them is another story .

For magnification, I use a 10x/20x loupe most of the time, and I have a Rat Shack 100x pocket scope that I can break out if the need arises. I actually use the loupe now, I tried a blade without it that went fine, but another one didn't go so well .

 

[Thebigspendur]

Everyone has their favorite routines and gear. I use a Norton 1K and 4K for restoration work and the 8K for finishing and either a Coticule or Escher for final polish.But I have some other hones and pasted strops for use when appropriate.

I have a Zeitz magnifier about 30x which is enough though I have a Stereo Microscope-low power I can also use but I didn't buy that for razor work its way overkill.

 

[English]

I use a Naniwa 800/3000 combination superstones to set the bevel and sharpen the edge. I use a 10x Belomo loupe to inspect the bevel.

I then put a mirror finish with a Japanese 8000 grit synthetic stone called an Akatsuki.

I fine tune the edge with a natural fine grained awaseto hone from Honyama quarry near Kyoto. First I use a natural nagura stone to create a paste on the hone and then I finalise with just plain water on the hone.

Finally I strop the edge until it feels sticky sharp and will smoothly shave against the grain. I use a horse hide strop.

I have found that the razor is at its best after the second stropping. I think the resting of the metal for 24 hours after the honing session allows the metal to settle and it becomes even smother.

This succession works for me but as Thebigspender says there are many successful ways to hone a razors edge.

I have found that shave ready means the same thing to most men.

 

[Sticky]

• DMT E 1200
• DMT EE 8k
• One of 4 or 5 favorite barber hones, or one of 2 Thuringians (one "red", one gray); depending on razor preference. Sometimes used in combination.
• a Spyderco UF lapped and "polished"; backup in case a razor doesn't like any of the previous finishers.

I have some ChromeOx on leather, but don't like pastes for my personal use.

I use a small B&L 15x Coddington loupe, only during the bevel-setting stage; to see when the black marker is completely gone (I'm farsighted).

 

[Utopian]

My most common go-to hones at the moment are the Naniwa Superstones. Bevel setting is done with the 1k, and it quickly became my favorite bevel setter. I drop down to 220 or 400 if needed. After the 1k, I go through the 3k, 5k, 8k, 10k, and 12k. I finish on a Nakayama Asagi or Namito.

I use a Zeiss stereomicroscope which ranges in power from 8x to 64x. Most of my viewing is done in the 20x range.

 

[professorchaos]

Setting bevels: DMT D11F and/or a Blue Mountain Stone (DMT for razors that effectively have no bevel, Blue Mountain for everything else as well as removing scratch marks from the DMT)

Progression 1 (artificial):

• Takenoko 6K or Naniwa 6K
• Naniwa 10K

Progression 2 (natural):

• Unknown type/mine Japanese, approximately 10K
• Nakayama Iromono (suspected, not certain), approximately 20-30K
• Nakayama Kiita, approximately 50K

or​

• Maruichi Maruka Nakayama, approximately 50K

Progression 3 (natural):

• Dalmore Blue
• Tam O'Shanter

- Wanted: Water of Ayr (looking, very hard to find!)​

Overall, I'd say that the Japanese natural progression is my favorite. It can be a little tricky to use, especially with razors that have a heavier grind. Very rewarding once you get the hang of it. After that, the artificial progression is great. Pluses: fast, easy to use, obscenely smooth edges. Minuses: edges require some refinement on diamond pastes. Cannot rank the third progression since it is incomplete.

I have a loupe that I can use to inspect the edge. Don't use it often. I find it is more beneficial to rely on the TNT, TPT and observe how the edge behaves on the hone. Pay attention and there is no mistaking when a razor is ready to move onto the next hone.

 

[Chimensch]

I have the following hones:

Norton 4K/8K
BBW/Coticule combination
Coticule bout
Vintage coticule (very fine)
Charnely Forest
Honyama Awaseto with Nagura stone
4-sided paddle strop with 4 pastes (Dovo red, Dovo black, CroX and 0.25-micron diamond paste)

Since May, I've been using a 7-day set of LeGrelots and experimenting with the best method of honing/maintaining them. The best hone progression for the LeGrelot in terms of the comfort and durability of the edge is Norton 4K -> Norton 8K -> BBW -> Coticule. It's not very fancy or exotic but its simple, quick and does a really good job.

 

[ambrose]

DMT 6 or 1200 for bevel setting on a junker ?

 

[English]

Dalmore Blue
[*]Tam O'Shanter[/LIST]

- Wanted: Water of Ayr (looking, very hard to find!)​

Cannot rank this third progression since it is incomplete.

You could try using a Charnley Forrest instead of the Water of Ayr. They are easier to find and from all I have read, give a finer finish.

The Charnley is up there with the Japanese finishing stones but the final edge is just as sharp but not quite as smooth. Its like the difference between an edge off Chromium oxide paste or diamond paste.

I have beauty in a beautiful antique mahogany case. I will be unlikely to use it any more as I use the Japanese progression. I paid £70 for it and of course cleaned and made the surface flat. I put some photo's up in a recent thread on the subject of Charnley Forest hones. You are welcome to buy it if you will pay my purchase price and the shipping costs. Uninsured airmail is £21 and surface mail is £12. Insurance is another £5.70. The hone and box weighs 1.8kilo's. Its a beautiful big hone.

 

[FloppyShoes]

I generally use one from every bracket after 1k. Specific progression depends on my mood, the razor and the customer's wishes. They are in decending order of preference for each bracket. We're talking just hones here.

• DMT 11C, Norton 220, 220 wet/dry on glass
• DMT 11F, Norton fine diamond hone
• DMT 11E, Naniwa 1k, Norton 1k
• Norton 4k, Naniwa 3k
• Norton 8k, DMT 8EE, Shapton 8k
• Naniwa 12k, Spyderco UF, Chinese 12k, Barber Hones (various)
• Nakayama Maruichi, Shapton 16k

I normally finish on a little CrOx pasted bench strop, but it isn't always necessary.

As you can see, I favor the DMT's in the low grits, ceramics in the mid range, and naturals in the high range.

 

[SavantStrike]

I generally use one from every bracket after 1k. Specific progression depends on my mood, the razor and the customer's wishes. They are in decending order of preference for each bracket. We're talking just hones here.

• DMT 11C, Norton 220, 220 wet/dry on glass
• DMT 11F, Norton fine diamond hone
• DMT 11E, Naniwa 1k, Norton 1k
• Norton 4k, Naniwa 3k
• Norton 8k, DMT 8EE, Shapton 8k
• Naniwa 12k, Spyderco UF, Chinese 12k, Barber Hones (various)
• Nakayama Maruichi, Shapton 16k

I normally finish on a little CrOx pasted bench strop, but it isn't always necessary.

As you can see, I favor the DMT's in the low grits, ceramics in the mid range, and naturals in the high range.

How much more do you like the Naniwa 12k than the Spyderco UF, and how much more do you like it than the C12k?

 

[richmondesi]

I'll just throw this out there to see what you guys think. I've got a lot of cash that I can throw at this. Is the Shapton set up worth the money? Or should I just get a couple a DMTs and a Japanese finishing stone?

Right now, all I have is a Norton 4/8k. I'm about to get a finishing hone, and if I go with the Shapton setup, I'll get the lapping plate and pond.

Within $2000, money isn't a consideration. So, what route should I go? Just get a DMT 325, 1200 and then a Japanese stone and ChromOx. I realize that the best stones in the world won't help until I learn what the heck I'm really doing, but I want to get a "dream" setup.

I really appreciate the input. I've enjoyed seeing what you guys that know what you're doing use

 

[ambrose]

A few naniwas and a natural japanese polishing stone along with custom TM strops, I find this to be a dream set which I have

 

[Chimensch]

I'll just throw this out there to see what you guys think. I've got a lot of cash that I can throw at this. Is the Shapton set up worth the money? Or should I just get a couple a DMTs and a Japanese finishing stone?

Right now, all I have is a Norton 4/8k. I'm about to get a finishing hone, and if I go with the Shapton setup, I'll get the lapping plate and pond.

Within $2000, money isn't a consideration. So, what route should I go? Just get a DMT 325, 1200 and then a Japanese stone and ChromOx. I realize that the best stones in the world won't help until I learn what the heck I'm really doing, but I want to get a "dream" setup.

I really appreciate the input. I've enjoyed seeing what you guys that know what you're doing use

As far as I can tell, the only thing that matters is the last hone or paste that touches the razor. It doesn't matter which 1K, 4K or 8K hones you use so long as the razor gets sharp and you finish it on something you like. For me it's a coticule, for someone else it may be CrOx or a Japanese natural stone. I don't think that you will need to spend all your $2,000 on hones.

 

[English]

Lets not forget, many guys get a perfect edge using a pasted paddle strop.

Some guys get a perfect edge with just a good quality Belgian coticule.

Money helps but it is not the solution, you really need to feel a hone to know what it does and if it works for you. If you buy a set of Shaptons which are a touchy feely type of hone, you may either love them or hate them. They will do a fine job in the right hands. Naniwas on the other hand IMHO can be used by anyone. You just progress up the grit scale and bingo, your razor is sharp.

You should see if one of the guys from the forum with a few different types of hones is near bye and can give you a demo. It may save you wasting money.

Hope this helps.

 

[professorchaos]

I'll just throw this out there to see what you guys think. I've got a lot of cash that I can throw at this. Is the Shapton set up worth the money? Or should I just get a couple a DMTs and a Japanese finishing stone?

Right now, all I have is a Norton 4/8k. I'm about to get a finishing hone, and if I go with the Shapton setup, I'll get the lapping plate and pond.

Within $2000, money isn't a consideration. So, what route should I go? Just get a DMT 325, 1200 and then a Japanese stone and ChromOx. I realize that the best stones in the world won't help until I learn what the heck I'm really doing, but I want to get a "dream" setup.

I really appreciate the input. I've enjoyed seeing what you guys that know what you're doing use

Find out what you like in a razor's edge. As English said, some guys love the edge off the Coticule, others off of the pastes. If I were going to do it all over again and already had a Nortono 4K/8K, I'd get something to set bevels and something to finish.

For setting the bevel, I prefer something that cuts rather aggressively. It allows you to start with a finer hone and not spend forever working on the edge. DMTs are superior in this role.

A finishing hone is where you have a ton of choices. You could go with an artificial hone in the 10K-12K range, then onto the pastes and end up with a very smooth, very sharp edge. Instead of the pastes, you could choose a Japanese natural (they produce edges with different feels, even among stones taken from the same quarry). Or the classic Coticule/Thuringian set up.

The point is that in order to make an informed decision, you should spend sometime figuring out what you like.

 

[richmondesi]

Just to be clear, I have no intention of spending $2k on hones. I was just saying cost isn't really an issue. I really appreciate the fact that I have to determine what I want, but it's really difficult because all of you guys know that everyone has different preferences. That makes everyone seem very unwilling to say "you should buy X, X & X hones".

So basically the novice just needs to embrace is HAD, and get busy I guess.

 

[SavantStrike]

Just to be clear, I have no intention of spending $2k on hones. I was just saying cost isn't really an issue. I really appreciate the fact that I have to determine what I want, but it's really difficult because all of you guys know that everyone has different preferences. That makes everyone seem very unwilling to say "you should buy X, X & X hones".

So basically the novice just needs to embrace is HAD, and get busy I guess.

Darn straight .

I would make the argument that if you do enough research though, you can actually end up with a set of hones you're really happy with from day one. I know I'm going to get strung up for saying this, but the way I see it is that as long as they perform at all as expected, you won't know you're missing anything if you don't have anything to compare your results to. Yeah, it's crappy logic. Especially since you'll still be wondering if a different hone could make things a bit better...

 

[tg16]

Norton 1k if needed
Norton 4/8
Kitayama 12K (rarely used anymore)
Spyderco UF
Balsa with chromium