Hindostan Info/Photos/ID Thread

[ErieSurfer]

Griswold wrote this on page 74:

I've wondered for a while on how to differentiate the hindos I've got. I'm thinking that @cotedupy 's stone and the IGS stone are 'washita finish' hindos. I don't think I've seen hindostan examples that were any whiter.

'Buff' seems to mean different things to different people, but 'white' seems to be broadly understood.

Color aside, I don't understand the lack of layering in either stone.

 

[cotedupy]

reminds me of an unused Queer Creek

Interesting you say that; there's not much of that blue colour on the stone, but the bit there is does indeed look very QC like. And in fact the stone acts a little bit like a cross between a QC and a Hindo. If it's a Hindo it would definitely be at the soft and coarse end of the spectrum.

Attached is a photo I took at the IGS of a Hindostan that doesn't have the obvious sedimentary layering that most do. It also has some brown spotting similar to yours. So I'm inclined to think that your stone is similar to this one as pictured.

As for the fabled Magog stone, quarrying of those stopped in 1850. The labels of the two "Canada" stones appear to be of a much later vintage.

Yeah that does look pretty similar, I haven't had one with no lines visible at all, until this one (possibly).

I'm not certain AB Salmen even existed in 1850, I think they might have started more toward the end of the c.19th. So yeah - if the Magog stone wasn't quarried after the middle of it then that would rule that out.

'washita finish'

I'd missed this part of Griswold, but AlumOP mentioned seeing the same colour grading mentioned when he was in Indiana in the summer. And yep - the 'Canada Oilstone' is probably one of the two lightest coloured ones I've had, though the other was a quite a fine stone from memory, and more the kind of normal level of hard, whereas the CO is really quite soft. And actually also has a very low SG @ 2.14

I still think it's probably a slightly odd Hindo, though wouldn't rule out it being something similar but from north of the border.

 

[RobbyC]

A little addition to this conversation

I bought this a couple of years ago, it came with a bunch of NOS military issue hard arks and was in a crows foot stamped box which had white washita written in marker on the lid (washita finish hindo maybe)

A fully NOS hindo, it was incredibly porous, and very soft.
The orange lines are part of the natural colour of the stone

I ended up giving it to a family member who is in the Forces as I couldn’t bring myself to use it
I’ll ask him for some photos in a few months to see how it had changed now it is being used

 

[cotedupy]

A little addition to this conversation

I bought this a couple of years ago, it came with a bunch of NOS military issue hard arks and was in a crows foot stamped box which had white washita written in marker on the lid (washita finish hindo maybe)

A fully NOS hindo, it was incredibly porous, and very soft.
The orange lines are part of the natural colour of the stone

I ended up giving it to a family member who is in the Forces as I couldn’t bring myself to use it
I’ll ask him for some photos in a few months to see how it had changed now it is being used

View attachment 1553469View attachment 1553470View attachment 1553471View attachment 1553472

Very pretty Roberto!

I think I noticed you had one of the AB Salmen Canada Oilstones atm too (?) What do you make of it...?

 

[sydres]

I think this one is a hindo, fine grained almost waxy finer than my soft arks but not translucent, and appears to have layering on edge up close probably still some oil on it after degreaser.

 

[cotedupy]

I think this one is a hindo, fine grained almost waxy finer than my soft arks but not translucent, and appears to have layering on edge up close probably still some oil on it after degreaser.View attachment 1555623View attachment 1555624

Yep... looks about as Hindo as they come! Nice one

 

[sydres]

Thanks for the confirmation on the stone I picked it up today along with some other stone that's much wider that one is still in the degreaser I'm not sure what that one is but guessing a queer creek

 

[duke762]

Really cool stone RobbyC! As I sit here and look at it, I wonder what mineral or material is deposited to cause the different coloration's in the different examples.

I would figure that the reddish or orange layers or orange staining is most likely from some sort of iron compound. So what would black layers indicate shown in some stones?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Hindustan's are a type of sandstone, as is the Ohio Blue stone (Queer Creek) and the original mine, on the White River is about 25 miles away from the Empire Pit and not even close to the Hindustan on the current map. The Empire Pit is the quarry for all the limestone for the Empire State building. It seems like the Hindustan's sandstone deposits sits on top of the Indiana limestone layers.

This area is also known for it's geodes. By using Google Earth or Google maps, you can examine the route 37 Harrodsburg cut, which is cut through a limestone hill, just North of the Empire pit, and you can see geodes in the rock face with Google earth or Maps.

 

[cotedupy]

I would figure that the reddish or orange layers or orange staining is most likely from some sort of iron compound. So what would black layers indicate shown in some stones?

Yep, I would imagine the reddish colour is from Iron Oxide.

If you have black layers in a Hindo (which I've not seen myself); then the most common reasons for dark coloured sands is from the presence of Pyroxenes or Basalt. I would've said Pyroxene was more likely as they're one of the most common minerals in the earth's crust.

However... if the area is also known for geodes; they I believe are normally formed under volcanic conditions, as obviously is Basalt. So dark layers could well be Basaltic.

(Coincidentally I happened to be reading about the geological and chemical causes of black sands a couple of days ago. I don't just know random stuff like that generally!)

 

[sydres]

Cotedupy not to disagree but most geodes found in Indiana, Kentucky, Tennessee, and that region are found in Mississippian age limestone/shales mostly from mineralization of voids formed from former concretions usually soluble concretions that dissolved away or in fossil voids. Many other geodes are found in basaltic strata but not in that particular region. Black layers in a sedimentary environment would usually indicate either anoxic organic deposits or perhaps heavy sands, or even manganese oxide stains.

 

[ErieSurfer]

Cotedupy not to disagree but most geodes found in Indiana, Kentucky, Tennessee, and that region are found in Mississippian age limestone/shales mostly from mineralization of voids formed from former concretions usually soluble concretions that dissolved away or in fossil voids. Many other geodes are found in basaltic strata but not in that particular region. Black layers in a sedimentary environment would usually indicate either anoxic organic deposits or perhaps heavy sands, or even manganese oxide stains.

Well, with an explanation like that, you are going to have to stick around B&B until I can get a French coticule document translated into English. It is written by a French geologist. There are two major barriers to my understanding of it:

1) I don't speak French.
2) I'm not a geologist.

 

[sydres]

Well, with an explanation like that, you are going to have to stick around B&B until I can get a French coticule document translated into English. It is written by a French geologist. There are two major barriers to my understanding of it:

1) I don't speak French.
2) I'm not a geologist.

To be truthful I'm not a geologist either but I have been collecting rocks and minerals for the better part of 40 years. I know enough to be able to interpret a good bit of geology papers at least those written in English. Speaking of coticule I just bought my second for next to nothing and am waiting for delivery.

 

[cotedupy]

Cotedupy not to disagree but most geodes found in Indiana, Kentucky, Tennessee, and that region are found in Mississippian age limestone/shales mostly from mineralization of voids formed from former concretions usually soluble concretions that dissolved away or in fossil voids. Many other geodes are found in basaltic strata but not in that particular region. Black layers in a sedimentary environment would usually indicate either anoxic organic deposits or perhaps heavy sands, or even manganese oxide stains.

Oh I know sod all about the geology of Indiana tbh, let alone the geode formation there! I was just speculating after what Duke said above, but I'm definitely not an expert.

'Heavy sands' I think would be the product of pyroxenes / a synonym for pyroxene-rich sand...(?)

 

[ErieSurfer]

To be truthful I'm not a geologist either but I have been collecting rocks and minerals for the better part of 40 years. I know enough to be able to interpret a good bit of geology papers at least those written in English. Speaking of coticule I just bought my second for next to nothing and am waiting for delivery.

Double win! Coticule + a low price!

Are you related to @timwcic ?

 

[sydres]

Oh I know sod all about the geology of Indiana tbh, let alone the geode formation there! I was just speculating after what Duke said above, but I'm definitely not an expert.

'Heavy sands' I think would be the product of pyroxenes / a synonym for pyroxene-rich sand...(?)

Yeah pyroxene rich sands are heavy you are correct but pyroxenes are fairly easily weathered to chlorites and smectites so may not accumulate over long periods of time without alteration this would all be dependent on how long the deposit was exposed to weathering agents like water before being relithified

https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/earth-and-planetary-sciences/pyroxene

 

[sydres]

Double win! Coticule + a low price!

Are you related to @timwcic ?

Ten bucks plus a couple dollars shipping got a coticule and some other stone that looks like a barber hone but won't know till it shows. I never find good stones at flea markets

 

[Pack line]

Yep, I would imagine the reddish colour is from Iron Oxide.

If you have black layers in a Hindo (which I've not seen myself); then the most common reasons for dark coloured sands is from the presence of Pyroxenes or Basalt. I would've said Pyroxene was more likely as they're one of the most common minerals in the earth's crust.

However... if the area is also known for geodes; they I believe are normally formed under volcanic conditions, as obviously is Basalt. So dark layers could well be Basaltic.

(Coincidentally I happened to be reading about the geological and chemical causes of black sands a couple of days ago. I don't just know random stuff like that generally!)

We know who to invite to trivia night..

 

[ErieSurfer]

Ten bucks plus a couple dollars shipping got a coticule and some other stone that looks like a barber hone but won't know till it shows. I never find good stones at flea markets

It's hit and miss for most folks. Tim just makes it look so easy, and he's been doing it for years. My flea market finds have also been thin, but this hindo came out of flea market. I nearly didn't buy it.

 

[duke762]

If you have black layers in a Hindo (which I've not seen myself);

In my post on page 1, my binary looking Hindo has black layers. I'm color blind as all get out so I may be mistaken but they look pretty black to me. The pictures don't show as well as in hand.

Most geodes found in this area are ugly, iron stained, calcite. If you are lucky you can find a decent quartz one. I love geodes and will take whatever I can find.

 

[sydres]

In my post on page 1, my binary looking Hindo has black layers. I'm color blind as all get out so I may be mistaken but they look pretty black to me. The pictures don't show as well as in hand.

Most geodes found in this area are ugly, iron stained, calcite. If you are lucky you can find a decent quartz one. I love geodes and will take whatever I can find.

I found a geode in a creek in Kentucky that probably weighed 200# at least multiple quartz lines voids but too big to be dragged back to my car let alone in my car for the drive home.