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High Mpg Vehicles

This morning on the news I heard them talking about the "Big Three". GM Ford and Chrysler...They were discussing the woes of the automakers's sales. The comment was made pertaining to them making the "vehicles people want"...

I don't understand this statement...I understand that the big three does not have the cars that perhaps Toyota, Honda, and Nissan has. But what they have had is a line of vehicles that have been selling very well until the price of gas jumped up. Consumers can be so fickle in a heartbeat. Thier tastes can change in a blink of an eye and a manufacturer can be left out in the cold.

I understand that they make more money on the bigger trucks/suvs and so forth, but wouldn't you ?

Today I had lunch at the local cattle auction. I didn't see one hybrid pulling a 40 foot cattle trailer. All around me were TRUCKS BIG TRUCKS...DIESEL TRUCKS....

Down the street from me is a camping trailer place...some of these rigs could be pulled by 1/2 ton trucks and maybe a smaller vehicle if it was just pop up trailer type of camper....but most of the camper are huge with multi slide outs and they need to be pulled by big trucks or suburbans...

These guys were enjoying record sales of campers until the price hike of gas. I have seen many campers for sale, too. But all the local campgrounds are full !!!!

So once again, "build vehicles that America wants"....does everybody want a hybrid ???

I would be interested in your comments...

mark the shoeshine boy
 
I'd never buy a hybrid, but outside of a few trucks, I am not a a fan of American design. The fit and finish just aren't up to par.
 
I own 2 cars... A Chevy 2500 Suburban with an 8.1 litre (454) engine with a tow hitch and a trailer. I need it to get around in the winter and move stuff.

The rest of the time, I drive my Honda Insight and am averaging 60 mpg + and have never had a single problem with it.. in fact it is pretty damn fast and maneuverable... great little car.

It's great to get the awesome gas mileage, but I can't possibly live without the truck. The Honda, on the other hand, probably has paid for itself already with the money I have saved on gasoline....... :biggrin:
 
I will be looking at new cars shortly but none will be from GM, Ford, or Dodge. They have no appeal to me. My car will probably be German.

How does that saw go?

French wines, German cars, and Italian Operas.
 
Sorry but I despise large vehicles unless you actually NEED (not want, not look good in, not feel more comfortable in, not feel safer in [as if you actually were ha!]) the larger vehicle. I don't own a car currently, but when/if I need to buy a vehicle I can almost guarantee that I'll be looking at the Japanese imports for the sole reason that they actually produce affordable ($10-13k starting pricetag vs. $15-20k pricetag for a domestic sedan) small coup/sedan. IMO GM, FORD, and Dodge are all marketed too expensively, are obsessed with bigger=better, and are horrendous with quality control ( I know of plenty of Hondas and Toyotas that are running around with 200k+ miles and have had very little mechanicle issues, you nearly never see that with the current domestics). But then as always YMMV. And yes, I know, I am very opinionated on the issue.
 
jduffy said:
I will be looking at new cars shortly but none will be from GM, Ford, or Dodge. They have no appeal to me. My car will probably be German.

How does that saw go?

French wines, German cars, and Italian Operas.

Can we keep going?

Cuban cigars,Jamacian Coffee,HBS soaps................pile on
 
For Me, the only American vehicles I would consider are trucks, not SUV's, trucks. Even then, since I would not need to do any really heavy hauling or towing, I may still end up choosing the Toyota over the Americans.

I have worked in the service department of a few different car dealershhips that sold both foreign and domestic vehicles. There is no comparison to the quality. The Japanese cars, and even (over the last few years) the Korean cars, are much less likely to be in the shop for repairs.

Granted, all cars reach an age where things start to break and this is true of all automakers, but the Asian automobiles will spend alot less time in the shop up until that point. The part that makes the Asian cars especially appealing is that they do not rust and fall apart like they used to.

As for European cars I have very little experience, but I have heard they might be more prone to problems than the average consumer would like to experience.
 
In repsonse to the "Cars America wants" statement. Apparently America wants Japanese cars.
 
I would most certainly drive a hybrid/dork mobile. The fact of the matter is - very few of us drive on gorgeous uninhabited roads on a daily basis, and honestly - what good is a big ole truck, or even a 505hp Corvette Z06 in heavy traffic? For boring daily driving to/from work, moving around the family, etc - why not use a VERY quiet, reliable, affordable, comfortable Japanese Hybrid?

My next car will more than likely be a Toyota Prius or the like. Don't get me wrong, I'll have a second car for fun - like a modern sports car, or perhaps a classic muscle car, and most certainly a high performance 1000CC Sports Bike, but for the daily grind a hybrid would prove to be both economical, and more comfortable than a "big bad American car/truck."

I rather like Mama Bears setup..... big bad 454 burban for the snow, and a quiet, reliable, economical hybrid for daily use... and when the weather is right, and the mood is such - fire up that Harley of hers and tear up some country roads.

Wow.... life sounds pretty amazing at the Mama Bear Ranch.... soaps galore, cars, trucks, motorcycles..... hmmm - got room for one more :biggrin: :thumbup1:
 

ouch

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I have a '05 Prius. This past week I was on vacation in Niagara Falls and Toronto, and I have to say that driving from NYC to Canada on eight gallons of gas is nothing to scoff at.

I've had quite a few cars over the years (and many bikes), but this is far and away the niftiest vehicle I've ever owned.
 
I think the Prius would be a great saving in stop start traffic but for the open road a diesel is more efficient.
 
ouch said:
I have a '05 Prius. This past week I was on vacation in Niagara Falls and Toronto, and I have to say that driving from NYC to Canada on eight gallons of gas is nothing to scoff at.

I've had quite a few cars over the years (and many bikes), but this is far and away the niftiest vehicle I've ever owned.

Toyota Land cruiser = I cannot get over the GW bridge on 8 gallons of gas!:mad3:

75.00 every 320 miles:w00t:
 
When my father had his stroke I drove from Northern Illinois to Boston, traveled around locally for 1 1/2 weeks and drove back home stopping to visit friends in Ohio.

I used a total of 4 tanks of gas... one of those tanks was only a half tank actually and the tank holds 10 gallons of gas. So, less than 40 gallons of gas and I drove for 2 weeks....

I usually fill up about once a month... that's all. There is no way that you could pry this Japanese car out of my cold dead fingers. Not the way that gas is priced lately.....

I am thinking seriously about trading the Suburban in on a hybrid truck or SUV also... but am not sure if a hybrid will pull my trailers or not... this is a huge selling point to me on the Suburban. But at 8 mpg... who can afford to go anywhere??

On a side note, the Honda Insight gets twice the gas mileage that my Harley does!

Sue
 

ouch

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Goosemeplease said:
Toyota Land cruiser = I cannot get over the GW bridge on 8 gallons of gas!:mad3:

75.00 every 320 miles:w00t:

Canada and back- 1040 miles, 18 gallons, a/c on for the entire trip.
 
I sell Hondas on the Internet. We have/had 3 hybrids. The Insight, Civic and Accord. At this point in time, I believe the only reason to buy a hybrid is for the environment. The Insight is an exception, and it looks like 2006 is the last year for that car. Most folks buying hybrid cars do NOT get the excellent fuel economy they expect. It's mainly because of driving habits. When customers tell me they want a hybrid, I ask the most powerful question in the world. "Why?". IF it is for fuel economy, I recommend they buy the standard gasoline version of the car. With the upfront cost of the Civic and Accord hybrid being about $4,000 bucks, and with the average American wanting to trade cars every 39 months, the savings will never be realized. Remember, I am speaking of averages. The Insight is a useless car in Utah, where families are large, and the car seats two people. I believe that hybrids are a coming thing, but we aren't there yet.

Randy
 

ouch

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rtaylor61 said:
I sell Hondas on the Internet. We have/had 3 hybrids. The Insight, Civic and Accord. At this point in time, I believe the only reason to buy a hybrid is for the environment. The Insight is an exception, and it looks like 2006 is the last year for that car. Most folks buying hybrid cars do NOT get the excellent fuel economy they expect. It's mainly because of driving habits. When customers tell me they want a hybrid, I ask the most powerful question in the world. "Why?". IF it is for fuel economy, I recommend they buy the standard gasoline version of the car. With the upfront cost of the Civic and Accord hybrid being about $4,000 bucks, and with the average American wanting to trade cars every 39 months, the savings will never be realized. Remember, I am speaking of averages. The Insight is a useless car in Utah, where families are large, and the car seats two people. I believe that hybrids are a coming thing, but we aren't there yet.

Randy

I'm a long time Honda fan, and have always maintained that they are the best small engine producer in the world. My favorite car was my old '85 CRX, a little rocket that got close to 40mpg. It had the old world charm of an MG, surprising performance, and was as reliable as a refridgerator. Why they replaced that with the ill-conceived Del Sol is beyond me, and remains one of that company's few blatant gaffs.
 
rtaylor61 said:
I sell Hondas on the Internet. We have/had 3 hybrids. The Insight, Civic and Accord. At this point in time, I believe the only reason to buy a hybrid is for the environment. The Insight is an exception, and it looks like 2006 is the last year for that car. Most folks buying hybrid cars do NOT get the excellent fuel economy they expect. It's mainly because of driving habits. When customers tell me they want a hybrid, I ask the most powerful question in the world. "Why?". IF it is for fuel economy, I recommend they buy the standard gasoline version of the car. With the upfront cost of the Civic and Accord hybrid being about $4,000 bucks, and with the average American wanting to trade cars every 39 months, the savings will never be realized. Remember, I am speaking of averages. The Insight is a useless car in Utah, where families are large, and the car seats two people. I believe that hybrids are a coming thing, but we aren't there yet.

Randy

I believe that the Japanese had the intelligence and foresight to know what American's were going to need. The Insight was almost prophetic in that it solved problems that did not actually occur untill years beyond it's manufacture. In addition I have to give them kudos for knowing what we were going to need before we needed it. This to me was one of those really intelligent decisions that did not get overid by the ongoing attitude.

The Insight was a car before it's time in so many ways. It continues to be so and it continues to be copied... but this is a car that has it all... and was offered to the public at a reasonable price. Supposedly this car cost 80k to build.... it was sold for 20k. Nothing has come close to it as far as a hybrid is concerned during or since.

I am a truck girl. Have been for many years and probably always will be.. there is enough country in me that I realize the need for a vehicle that does more than pull you around.

But on the other hand, there is a part of me that will always believe that I saw that the Japanese were being much more farsighted than ourselves.. and I will treasure my Insight probably way beyond it is fashionable to do so. It was a first... and the resulting vehicles do not match up to the potential of this car. not by a long shot...

I had a guy at a stop light today ask me if this was a solar powered vehicle.... How absolutely amazing. We have a long way to go in order to catch up with technology.. I only hope that we do before resources are so depleted it, that it is a moot point.
 

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Mama Bear said:
The Insight was a car before it's time in so many ways. It continues to be so and it continues to be copied... but this is a car that has it all... and was offered to the public at a reasonable price. Supposedly this car cost 80k to build.... it was sold for 20k. Nothing has come close to it as far as a hybrid is concerned during or since.

Terrific post, but I do have to take exception with this small passage. Although both of our cars share the "gay spaceship" look (not that there's anything wrong with that), the similarity ends there. The Prius is a far more significant technological acheivement. Why? For one, you can practically put an Insight inside a Prius.

Making a tiny, high mileage vehicle is relatively simple- just trim off lots of weight, squeeze it into a tiny footprint, give it a puny engine, and you're halfway there. It's another thing altogether to make a real world vehicle that fits the bill. Although the Prius appears rather small from the outside, when you sit in it you quickly realize that it has the cabin of a typical midsize car. There is ample head and leg room for five adults, and it will hold a two day's supply of shoes for the missus, roughly 700 pairs. By contrast, the Insight is as utilitarian as a Ferrari. Yes, the Insight will squeeze out a few more miles per dead dinosaur, but for transporting human beings the Prius is a far more capable performer. It's continuously variable transmission alone makes it a wonder. It's engine management systems and level of computerization are remarkable.
Philosophically, it is the superior design. Most hybrids are gasoline engined cars assisted by an electric motor. The Prius is the reverse- it is primarily an electric car that is assisted by a gas engine which charges the batteries (along with various energy regeneration schemes) and adds extra oomph. This capitalizes on the electric motors most endearing quality- it produces maximum torque at zero rpm. The seamless integration of the systems is quite amazing. and it's a kick to glance at the monitor and see that you're going 70 (or stopped at a light) with the engine off. You can drive 100 miles, open the hood, and put your hand on the engine: it will barely be warm.

Don't get me wrong. I want to buy an Insight too, because I love tiny cars. But for those who don't, the choice is clear.
 
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