So I just purchased a 2019 Rocnel Sailor, and the base came off handle. I pressed down the bases spring bottom and it released off of the handle... Now I can't seem to get the sturdy handle to base connection unless I screw down the top cap. If I dont screw on the top cap the base can rotate 360 degrees... Is this normal? I thought it was supposed to be 2 piece razor not a 3 piece.
Help! 2019 Rocnel Sailor DE users
- Thread starter Gatts
- Start date
Hmm... I don't think that is supposed to happen.
I heard the handles may be fused with industrial epoxy, but I can't be certain of that.
You may want to reach Murat himself:
[email protected]
I heard the handles may be fused with industrial epoxy, but I can't be certain of that.
You may want to reach Murat himself:
[email protected]
And yes, you are correct, it is supposed to be a 2 piece razor.
- Thread starter
- #4
Ah okay, I was wondering about that or if it was press fitted because the handle is smooth with no grooves. Thank you for the info
Does look like some sort of residue at the bottom of the base. So the handle may actually be glued to the base? Seems an unusual manufacturing method for an otherwise precision-fitted metal razor, and potentially not exactly permanent (glue tends not to age well over the years in basically a marine environment, particularly metal-to-metal). Possibly why the "don't dissassemble" injunction. Would be interesting to know if any other modern (or even vintage) razors are glued together.
- Thread starter
- #6
I did notice a black residue which I thought was grease, but wasn't positive. I find it strange if it's glued...(due to that not being good for longevity like you said) Not sure if I want to send this back to Murat, or try some jb weld or steel stick.
I would personally try to get a hold of Murat first and see what he says.
- Thread starter
- #8
Well I guess I will give that try first.. We shall see if a 3rd party purchase will become an issue or not.
Honestly I don't think it's so much the epoxy. Failures directly from these glues are very rare (less than a fraction of of a percent). They are molecularly bonded, metal to metal, presuming if the prep work to remove any surface debris or grease is done properly before hand.
I would speculate it may have suffered a drop before your purchase, that may have contributed to a weakening of the bond. Again, this is purely speculation.
I would speculate it may have suffered a drop before your purchase, that may have contributed to a weakening of the bond. Again, this is purely speculation.
If you're going to remove the epoxy and DIY, this might come in handy on how to remove the the epoxy:
www.loctiteproducts.com
Remove epoxy from metal—turn messy into shiny again
If you know how to remove epoxy from metal, then you’ll never be without projects and friends to keep you busy. It’s a valuable skill.
- Thread starter
- #11
I soak my razors for 5 minutes in rubbing alcohol when I first get them (plus I believe it was 91% isopropyl). Might have something to do with the epoxy failure
Resin chemistry has certainly come a long way, and a very strong bond can be created metal-to-metal with modern epoxies. The downfall of resins however, are temperature and moisture, the common environment of shaving, and not least of which is expanding and contracting metal with temperature change at a dissimilar rate to the cured resin. In addition to organic solvents and anything else affecting the chemistry of the polymerized resin, as well as the very specific requirements for its initial application and setting - perfectly clean surface, correct temperature and humidity, correct pressure, correct homogeneous mix, correctly prepared interface, correct thickness, correct curing time - a flaw in any of which can weaken the bond. A threaded or even a swaged joint is arguably easier in production, and potentially longer lasting and more dependable, although not necessarily initially stronger. Hence the question about why even use it in razor construction, although there have not notably been a rash of failures reported for Rocnels. That said, aging is a factor in resin failure (polymerization continues throughout the life of the resin), and the variables of temperature, stress and humidity will shorten the life of the bond.
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Murat has apparently confirmed that the head is indeed epoxied to the handle, so any organic solvents (alcohol, benzene, acetone, toluene, et al) could definitely affect the bond. I would also avoid ultrasonic or sonic cleaners, or any disinfectant soaks. Should be an easy thing to re-epoxy, and I'm guessing if you reached out to Murat he would repair it.
ERS4
My exploding razor knows secrets
I can understand adding resin to avoid the trouble of accidental disassembly.
But I am very surprised that the base plate and handle of this "two-piece razor" are purely bonded by resin only, and there is no thread or any structural fixation. Especially the boutique razor.
But I am very surprised that the base plate and handle of this "two-piece razor" are purely bonded by resin only, and there is no thread or any structural fixation. Especially the boutique razor.
I would have never guessed epoxy was used to hold an expensive SS heavy razor together.
I'm not sure how I feel about that on a $500 and up razor.
I'm not sure how I feel about that on a $500 and up razor.
Yep, the heads are epoxied on. I think Murat recommends Loctite 480 and only a very small amount to reattach. I agree this is a very odd choice for razor assembly. Loctite 480 is expensive as well.
EclipseRedRing
I smell like a Christmas pudding
I am quite sure how I feel about it and it is not good, not good at all.
That's understandable and I can't blame you on that one at all.
Did it get banged around when it came apart?
- Thread starter
- #20
No i did give it a bath in rubbing alcohol for 5 minutes..... Like i do with any used de's I purchase. No blemishes or drop damage marks that I can see
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