Connie, how is the Floral almost 10 grams lighter in weight?
Guide to American Button Company Pocket Edition Sets: Part One - Razors
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Connie, how is the Floral almost 10 grams lighter in weight?
Beats me!
It's this one. Notice the set has what I believe is the oldest case design with the hinged latch.
View attachment $ABC Gold Floral.jpg
This ABC Floral razor with the Gillette case weighs 52.5 grams.
Thanks! I have updated the wiki page.
I wonder about that too: almost 20% lighter. If it does not appear to be smaller in any dimension, maybe it was made from a different base metal than the others? The difference in specific gravity between sterling silver and brass would be about right, I think. Maybe most were gold-plated silver and this lighter one was gold-plated brass?
Is all of the weight difference there in the handles or are the heads on their own different weights?
If it's entirely in the handles I would think the only possible explanations, assuming that they are as identical as they appear from the pictures, is that either the composition of the metal is different, or the hole in the neck was cast/drilled out deeper on the lighter one.
If it's entirely in the handles I would think the only possible explanations, assuming that they are as identical as they appear from the pictures, is that either the composition of the metal is different, or the hole in the neck was cast/drilled out deeper on the lighter one.
Not to muddy the waters here but I weighed my silver two-ring shell model today and it came in at 57 grams. That's the whole razor, no blade installed. I'd be glad to weigh just the handle tomorrow when I can get back to the digital scale, if that might help clarify anything.
Lots of fine work putting this all together! Thanks guys.
Lots of fine work putting this all together! Thanks guys.
I just weighed the the individual pieces of the two Florals and numbers are as follows:
Gillette Case Floral Razor: Handle = 33.6 grams, Cap = 9.4 grams, Guard = 10.1 grams
ABC Case Floral Razor: Handle = 23.9 grams, Cap = 9.6 grams, Guard = 9.9 grams
The short answer is, yes the difference is in the handle. The hole in the handle of the light one is 65mm deep to the other ones 36mm.
The Gillette Case Floral is on the left in these pictures.
Oddly, the Gillette Case Floral has an earlier serial number.
Here are some of mine that I could get to easily. (In pulling these out I realized I may have something of a problem with Canadian Pocket Editions...)
| Razor Description | Serial | Weight |
| Scroll, silver, standard guard plate | B103910 | 56g |
| Double-ring Shell, silver, saw-tooth guard plate | B317732 | 55g |
| Double-ring Shell, silver, saw-tooth guard plate | B367649 | 54g |
| Empire, gold, standard guard plate | B654814 | 51g |
| Single-ring Shell (second variation), gold, standard guard plate | C233339 (one or two of those '3's might be partially struck '8's) | 59g |
So the problem is the numbering?
C233339
(one or two of those '3's might be partially struck '8's)
ABC 10 grams lighter........what gives?
So why not make them all the same?
Thanks, that helps clear it up. Drilling the handle almost twice as deep would remove some material, and even without that it might have been a little underweight.
If the weight difference is mostly from the deeper hole, then it might have been an accident. If the metal is different, it could have been an attempt at cost reduction or maybe a material shortage.
Not sure what "problem" you're talking about. I was just saying that I think that serial is C233339, but it might be something like C238339 with an incompletely struck '8' looking like a '3' in there.
You must have missed this part:
Has anyone seen patent number 1,065,898 (US1065898) on a case or shipper?
It was assigned to ABC, filed in 1910 and issued in 1913. It covers stamping out the subdivisions at the bottom of the case or in a separate tray, instead of using cardboard or wooden dividers. The idea was not exactly rocket science, but I am curious if it was used in production.
It was assigned to ABC, filed in 1910 and issued in 1913. It covers stamping out the subdivisions at the bottom of the case or in a separate tray, instead of using cardboard or wooden dividers. The idea was not exactly rocket science, but I am curious if it was used in production.
I received my razor this morning and took some digital photos which seem to confirm a partial stamp of an A.
Length is 82mm and weight of entire razor is 52gms with the handle only weighing 33gms.
Comparing the handle with those shown on Page 1 it would seem that it is another variation.
What do you think?
Length is 82mm and weight of entire razor is 52gms with the handle only weighing 33gms.
Comparing the handle with those shown on Page 1 it would seem that it is another variation.
What do you think?
A little more research has revealed this set on Mr Razor:
It seems to have the same handle but with scroll work. I acquired my razor from an elderly genleman who emmigrated from Wales about 45 years ago so perhaps my razor handle is an English variation of the Shell handle..??
It seems to have the same handle but with scroll work. I acquired my razor from an elderly genleman who emmigrated from Wales about 45 years ago so perhaps my razor handle is an English variation of the Shell handle..??
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Interesting... I hadn't looked at that patent before, but that is exactly how the tray inserts for the Pocket Edition cases are made. The pieces that create the dividing walls between the compartments are cut from the tray itself and bent up before the tray is covered with fabric.
It's interesting, too, that it wasn't filed until 1910. I wonder if they had to (or wanted to) revise the filing at some point there, since they would have been well into production at that point. Also, I wonder whether Gillette had to license that patent when they continued to make their own cases...
I don't know why I've never noticed this before but I guess all of the ABC sets I have all have blunt studs on the cap where the Gillette from the same time have a more tapered stud. Any who here are the ones that are easy access for me:
1. Scroll - silver - standard guard plate - #B919173 - 41 grams
2. 2 Ring Shell - silver - standard guard plate - #B888904 - 53 grams
3. 1 Ring Shell - silver - standard guard plate - #C515082 - 58 grams
4. 2 Ring Shell - gold - saw teeth plate "ENGRAVED GILLETTE CAP" #A898656 - 51 grams
5. Empire - silver - saw teeth plate - #A981287 - 51 grams
1. Scroll - silver - standard guard plate - #B919173 - 41 grams
2. 2 Ring Shell - silver - standard guard plate - #B888904 - 53 grams
3. 1 Ring Shell - silver - standard guard plate - #C515082 - 58 grams
4. 2 Ring Shell - gold - saw teeth plate "ENGRAVED GILLETTE CAP" #A898656 - 51 grams
5. Empire - silver - saw teeth plate - #A981287 - 51 grams
Thanks Porter, i did overlook that part....a very important piece of info too.
That Schroll sure is lighter than others.
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