Going Straight. Help me sort out what I have and need.

[ouchyfoot]

I’m preparing for the big leap to straight razors.
This thread will probably be ongoing as I gather and order what I need, and will be asking for advice at each step.
I’m always rooting for the underdog and the downtrodden, so my razors will probably be older used razors that need work.
I'm waiting for my first rusty neglected German razor as I speak.

Okay! I’m going to show you what I have available right now. Some may be more appropriate for my folding knives than straight razors, so let’s get me sorted out. What is usable, what is not and what else do I need.

What I Have
Naniwa Chosera Whetstone 3000 grit
Naniwa Super Stone 8000 grit

DMT Diamond Bench Stones
-Extra-Coarse 8" Dia-Sharp Diamond Stone
-Coarse 8" Dia-Sharp Diamond Stone
-Fine 8" Dia-Sharp Diamond Stone
-Extra-Fine 8" Dia-Sharp Diamond Stone
Spyderco Ultrafine Ceramic

Board mounted leather treated with green oxide

That’s what I have available. What else should I get? Are DMT stones any good for straights?
I know I’ll need a strop, and I’m pretty sure I’ll order an Illinois strop. It looks like a good quality starter strop that I’ll probably slice to pieces learning the moves.
10,000 or 12000 grit stone?

 

[Eastcoast30]

I have been learning on eBay beaters. They have chips, funky grinds and mistakes from previous owners, etc. There is no better way to learn. It's good you are not starting with an expensive razor. To start, you will need a 1000 grit stone to set the bevel. And you need a way to flatten the stone. With knives, you can work with a dished stone. Razors require the stone to be VERY flat. You will flatten several times as you hone.

But you need to read the newbie compendium before you start working. So go here and say hello to Slach McCoy:

Newbie Honing Compendium

I find myself often linking just a few threads rather than give a long winded explanation that takes me 15 minutes to type on my phone. So, here are my favorite threads to suggest that newbies read if they are interested in making their razors sharp. Lapping film, try it. Setting the Bevel...

www.badgerandblade.com

 

[Zig the Pirate]

PM me and I'll send you a few items you'll need. But when it comes to advice, listen to @Slash McCoy because he's better at this than me.

 

[ouchyfoot]

I have been learning on eBay beaters. They have chips, funky grinds and mistakes from previous owners, etc. There is no better way to learn. It's good you are not starting with an expensive razor. To start, you will need a 1000 grit stone to set the bevel. And you need a way to flatten the stone. With knives, you can work with a dished stone. Razors require the stone to be VERY flat. You will flatten several times as you hone.

But you need to read the newbie compendium before you start working. So go here and say hello to Slach McCoy:

Newbie Honing Compendium

I find myself often linking just a few threads rather than give a long winded explanation that takes me 15 minutes to type on my phone. So, here are my favorite threads to suggest that newbies read if they are interested in making their razors sharp. Lapping film, try it. Setting the Bevel...

www.badgerandblade.com

I’m thinking the DMT stones might be good for initially repairing the edge and setting the bevel.

 

[ouchyfoot]

I’m already getting frustrated. I was thinking of an Illinois’s strop to initially practice on, now I’ve been reading negative things. Im limited because of being in Canada so many affordable products can get out of hand once shipping is included. Most the razors I look at on eBay cost less than the shipping.

 

[Kaldane]

Welcome to the world of straight razors. I'm looking forward to hearing what you've found on the "What did you use today?" thread.

Sounds like you've spotted the main gaps - a finisher and a strop. And you're right - it's worth starting with the assumption you'll cut the strop and considering it a consumable item for the first few months. And Eastcoast30 has mentioned keeping the stones flat : the DMT plates would work for initial removal of metal, but it looks like they might take a bit of watching to ensure they're flat enough for bevel setting - counterintuitively, you might be better off with something narrower.

I'm a newcomer myself, only getting into this when I had a bit more time on my hands without the morning commute - the honing pages are where the real expertise lives.

Between 20 and 50 shaves you'll probably have a lot of "is it me, or is it the edge?" moments - I know I did. [Spoiler - it's likely to be both.]. It's worth having at least one razor with a reasonable edge for comparison - whether that means something old or new and genuinely shave ready (careful who tells you that), or something that's been sharpened and finished by someone you trust - and who uses straight razors on a regular, ideally daily, basis.

Only one thing better than a good straight razor shave, and that's a good straight razor shave with an edge you made yourself. I'm keen (see what I did there?) to hear how it goes.

 

[ouchyfoot]

the DMT plates would work for initial removal of metal, but it looks like they might take a bit of watching to ensure they're flat enough for bevel settin

Hmmmmmm. The main reason I was thinking of the DMT for bevel setting is because the Diamond grit is mounted on huge slabs of solid nickel that are as flat as flat can be.

 

[Kaldane]

Hmmmmmm. The main reason I was thinking of the DMT for bevel setting is because the Diamond grit is mounted on huge slabs of solid nickel that are as flat as flat can be.

There's metal plate flat, and there's lapped stone flat.

[Had a lecturer at college who would talk about this at length in the dimensional measurement lab while showing us the granite tables - hardness is more desireable than strength, and after local impact something brittle will leave a smooth surface with a hole, while a stronger (tougher) material will deform in "waves" around the point of impact.]

You'd want to watch a stone "stone" as well, but the assumption is that they would be lapped using motion against another abrasive surface on a regular basis, so the surface would be freshly smoothed.

 

[ouchyfoot]

Yikes....wait til my first rusty razor arrives. This stuff will all get figured out one step at a time.
12,000 grit Shapton Kuromaku ceramic whetstone vs 12,000 grit Naniwa Super Stone for a finisher. Would one be just as good as the other?

 

[Zig the Pirate]

I'd prefer the 12k Shapton. But I know a few will disagree.

Honestly, I'd do the restorations myself and save the money I would have spent to buy more razors. I'm the guy who will spend 6 hours working on a $9 Gold Dollar.

 

[ouchyfoot]

I'd prefer the 12k Shapton

No soaking involved before use. A little less messy too. Lots of things to think about when you live in an apartment and work on your dining table.

 

[Eastcoast30]

Others may chime in, but I think the diamond plate will be too rough for setting a bevel. A 1k Naniwa or Shapton will feel like glass to your hand. And you need to raise a slurry. A diamond plate will not create its own slurry. With respect to the strop, get a cheap one to start. Some people strop on denim and some strop on their forearm. I spent about $160 on a cordovan strop from Griffith. But I've been stropping knives, so I know I won't ruin it. The Illinois is a good bet. There is always someone that will post something negative - it's usually the user and not the tool at fault.

 

[ouchyfoot]

diamond plate will be too rough for setting a bevel

Actually,I was more worried about the DMT being too agressive on the spine, but I have already been scoping out the 1000 grit whetstones. DMTs might be good it there’s a lot of deep divots to be flattened out.
Right now I’m just thinking and talking. I really need to get an actual razor in my hand. As Mike Tyson said “ everybody’s got a plan until they get punched in the mouth”. I’m sure every razor will need its own peculiar plan.

 

[JohnEzra]

Diamond plates are notorious for leaving very deep scratches. An Atoma 1200 will leave much deeper scratches than a Naniwa or other brand 1K. I would be VERY hesitant to recommend that a beginner use a diamond plate for anything other than lapping stones. Also, it will leave a TON of cleanup work that I really don't think the Chosera 3K would really be a great choice for.

Honestly given what you have, I would recommend setting the bevel on the 3K, it will take a bit longer to do, but it'll take less time than trying to clean up the scratches from a diamond plate on the 3K, and you won't be at nearly an much of a risk of being too aggressive and significantly wearing/damaging the razor. For what it's worth, I start most razors on a Shapton Ha No Kuromaku 2K or Naniwa Pro 3K. I only drop down to the Naniwa Pro 1K if there is significant damage/work to be done.

TL;DR, In my opinion you're better off starting a bit higher in the grit range and spending more time on that stone than going with something like a diamond plate that will be way too aggressive and require tons of cleanup down the line.

 

[ouchyfoot]

Thanks.
I’ll be playing it by ear. Will have to see how the 3k chosera makes out before I decide if I need to buy a 1k Whetstone. The razors I plan to work on may be in pretty bad shape edgewise and may need a lot of metal removed. I suppose the first job I’ll be doing when a razor finally arrives in the mail will be front to back, top to bottom rust removal.

 

[jj_sharp]

I believe you have all the stones you need. My intuition says that that the Spyderco could prove useful. You may wish to tell us how the Spyderco works on your razor, I am curious about this.

 

[ouchyfoot]

My intuition says that that the Spyderco could prove useful. You may wish to tell us how the Spyderco works on your razor, I am curious about this

I’m curious too. I’ve never used it on carbon steels. It’s mostly used as on edge polisher on all my super hard super steel folding knives, and I find it to be a hindrance on cutlery steel, but could be useful in the flat, guided type of sharpening employed on a razor.

 

[Ravenonrock]

My only experience is with Naniwa super/specialty stones, 1,3,8 and 12k. I feel I’m getting good results and have worked on some challenging projects. It was a good way to get started for me, simplified things. I know other guys have preferences, but this was a good way for me to get up and running. I’m lapping on slate slab on sandpaper. So far so good.

 

[trentr]

I’m already getting frustrated. I was thinking of an Illinois’s strop to initially practice on, now I’ve been reading negative things. Im limited because of being in Canada so many affordable products can get out of hand once shipping is included. Most the razors I look at on eBay cost less than the shipping.

I got frustrated trying to make a decision. Razor? Stones? Strop? Film? What ever. Pretty much gave up as I could not find something definitive on what I actually needed. Wife bought me a flea market vintage. So I had to do something. Just bought some stuff and never looked back. I went cheap and simple. May be lucky, but I get good edges. I get good shaves. I could not be happier to be in the SR world. Do your research, I aint saying not to, but do not get frustrated. You will get there and it will be great.

 

[jj_sharp]

I have used spyderco triangle rods on a razor. I don't recall how that worked out. I remember which razor, but I don't remember if it was the final stone used.

I have a razor that needs honing, perhaps I should take one for the team and try the spyderco triangle rods and report back.