frustration with straight

[Noebie]

okay guys - i could really use some encouragement (or discouragement, as the case may be) here

i've come to the conclusion that my razor simply isn't sharp - after only half a dozen shaves or so away from the honemeister

i strop per instructions between every shave - and have also been doing a few laps with the pasted side this past couple of times prior to the regular stropping

after another typically crappy, uncomfortable, stubbly shave i tried to cut the hair on the back of my arm as a test and the razor glides smoothly, but comes off clean - i can actually watch it move past individual hairs with no effect at all - like a butter knife

out of frustration today, i got out my barber's hone, wet it good and did 150 laps - again, according to the intructions everywhere i've seen (on this site and elsewhere)

same test on the back of my arm - same result

stropped again - 10 laps on the pasted side - 30 on the other side

same deal

i'm tempted to send it back to ken - he'll do touch ups for free for a few months - but if i can't keep a blade sharp for longer than a couple weeks myself, then this is just WAY too much trouble

i would have already ditched it since i get exceptionally fine shaves with my gillettes - but now my stubbornness is setting in - i hate for anything to get the better of me

any ideas appreciated

 

[Thebigspendur]

Its hard to give advice because as a rookie there are several things that can be the cause. Of course its possible it was never sharp enough to begin with, its possible you dulled it when you stropped,its possible your technique needs honing vis a vis your blade angle or pressure your applying.

So all those things need to be looked at. However just remember that in the end at one time this was the only way to shave so if you think your licked and can't hack it your saying you can't do something just about everyone in the world was able to master.

 

[Leche]

Hey Frank, don't give up. Ken is known for his edges so I'm curious if you are trashing the edge while stropping. Is the strop being held taunt, you haven't rolled on the edge, you aren't applying any pressure. Stropping can be quite difficult. What paste are you using and 150 laps is way to many for a barbers hone. Most recommend about 5. Try putting the strop on a hard flat surface and learn to strop that way.

 

[leighton]

Whatever it was when you first got it, its definitely dull now. That many strokes on the stone should have made the razor sharp. Some people just aren't cut out for honing, don't feel bad. That said, the razor could have gotten so dull that the barber's hone wouldn't cut it anyway.

If you really want to master straight shaving, I would buy another razor from someone else, and send that one out. If you don't have the cash for that, I might have a "try it out" straight that is not being "tried out" (because I'm too lazy to make a thread) that you can borrow until you get that one back.

 

[Noebie]

okay - since i'm confident that ken's initial edge was keen, then i must have dulled it somehow - likely incorrect stropping when i first got it

so it sounds like i either need to send it back to ken for a touch up, or ditch it

as far as not being able to master something that everyone who shaved once did as a routine, i can live with that if that's what it comes to - this couldn't be less about that for me

 

[Noebie]

Whatever it was when you first got it, its definitely dull now. That many strokes on the stone should have made the razor sharp. Some people just aren't cut out for honing, don't feel bad. That said, the razor could have gotten so dull that the barber's hone wouldn't cut it anyway.

If you really want to master straight shaving, I would buy another razor from someone else, and send that one out. If you don't have the cash for that, I might have a "try it out" straight that is not being "tried out" (because I'm too lazy to make a thread) that you can borrow until you get that one back.

thanks for the offer - but i can stick to my gillettes in the meantime if i send it back - no rush here

 

[spanx]

okay guys - i could really use some encouragement (or discouragement, as the case may be) here

i've come to the conclusion that my razor simply isn't sharp - after only half a dozen shaves or so away from the honemeister

i strop per instructions between every shave - and have also been doing a few laps with the pasted side this past couple of times prior to the regular stropping

after another typically crappy, uncomfortable, stubbly shave i tried to cut the hair on the back of my arm as a test and the razor glides smoothly, but comes off clean - i can actually watch it move past individual hairs with no effect at all - like a butter knife

out of frustration today, i got out my barber's hone, wet it good and did 150 laps - again, according to the intructions everywhere i've seen (on this site and elsewhere)

same test on the back of my arm - same result

stropped again - 10 laps on the pasted side - 30 on the other side

same deal

i'm tempted to send it back to ken - he'll do touch ups for free for a few months - but if i can't keep a blade sharp for longer than a couple weeks myself, then this is just WAY too much trouble

i would have already ditched it since i get exceptionally fine shaves with my gillettes - but now my stubbornness is setting in - i hate for anything to get the better of me

any ideas appreciated

Stubbornness and gumption is what you need to crest the hill.Then you can look back and say"why did I have so much trouble with something so easy".It reads like your making a misstep someware along your routine and just can't spot it.Also send the razor back and have the blade evaluated and touched up.

 

[pedalpowersailing]

Hi

Been there done that. I got the razor sharpenen by a pro and started again. It was definitely me and technique that was the issue.
I broke all the processes down, slowed everything down and practised

18 months later I hone everything myself and shaving is such a pleasure.

Whatever has happened will be simple and correctable. Keep on going

From what you have said rolloing the edge is a big possibility

 

[Noebie]

so, that's at the end of the stropping stroke, yes?

 

[leighton]

Rolled edge feels like a rolled edge. Run your finger down the blade and if it catches on the edge on either side, the edge is rolled. Could use a needle too, either case...

That would be spine to edge, not heel to toe.

 

[Bertilak]

Don't give up.

I went through a period where I started to wonder if all this straight razor talk was a bunch of hogwash. Eventually it all came together for me. (Next step is being able to hone.)

<getting all philosophical mode on. i.e. beware of real hogwash!>

I think it is a good chance that most beginners mess up their blade with poor stropping technique before they get to the stage where they are able to get a good shave from a straight. This leads to real frustration since no matter how much YOU improve the blade is no longer adequate but if you get the blade re-honed you quickly mess it up again.

What's the best thing to do about it? You will need to get good at stropping. This is a physical skill and like all other physical skills it requires practice. By all means read up on it to know just what and how to practice, but it is the practice itself that counts.

There are, I think, two stages to get past: First the ability to strop (verb) without chewing up the strop (noun). The next stage is to develop your technique to the point where the stropping actually maintains the blade and doesn't dull it. This point is harder to recognize, but you are probably there if the action feels easy and natural to you. The advice to flip the blade with only your fingers and not your wrist comes in here, but I think this is somewhat indirect. To do so successfully you need to be able to control the blade with a light and consistent touch and it is that light but controlled action that leads to success.

This is probably the point where a freshly honed razor will make it all work for you.

<getting all philosophical mode off>

Keep at it!

 

[BEAR DEN]

Stubbornness is the only reason I feel comfortable with my str8 razors now. I had a ridiculous amount of CRUMMY shaves, nicks and cuts before it started to come together. For me there was a very steep learning curve...nothing at all like DE and SE shaving. Refuse to give up...and you will eventually be rewarded.

 

[Noebie]

Rolled edge feels like a rolled edge. Run your finger down the blade and if it catches on the edge on either side, the edge is rolled. Could use a needle too, either case...

That would be spine to edge, not heel to toe.

doesn't catch on either side, spine to edge, along the entire length - tried it with my thumbnail as well - no catching or pinging of any sort

how dull could i have gotten this thing after only a few shaves?

also - i haven't had the trouble tearing up the strop that people told me to expect - put one tiny nick in the edge the first day (stuttering at the end of a stroke)

i make sure that the strop is stretched flat - warm it up with my hand before beginning - and i make very slow, deliberate strokes - with both the spine and the edge touching the strop (spine leading) - and i turn the blade properly at the end of laps, making sure that i rotate so that the edge never points down toward the strop

what am i missing here?

 

[Luc]

Don't give up!

I can assume that you did more than 30 laps on the strop post honing? I usually do ~60 and sometimes more.

+1 on using a flat table to strop, I did that when I started and it helped a lot!

 

[OldSchoolYoungin]

+1 to those saying that you most likely trashed the edge somehow.

+1 also to those recommending a flat plane on which to strop. I've been straight shaving for around nine months now and I still do it. I simply feel much more confident doing this and it hasn't steered me wrong yet.

I will make a suggestion to send your razor out again to the honemeister of your choice to sharpen her back up and if you have the cash, pick up another straight with a good edge that isn't quite shave ready and practice your honing with that one. Use the other for shaving and stropping only until you're confident in your honing.

 

[Cheech]

I'm from the government, and I'm here to help.

as far as not being able to master something that everyone who shaved once did as a routine, i can live with that if that's what it comes to

I think it was encouragement. I would first send it back to Ken, and let him touch it up. I've never dealt with Ken, but it sounds like he has a pretty good rep. Whether it was caused by your hand, its hard to say (after all, we're all human). Either way, as your technique improves, so will the life of the edge. But, its important to learn with a good edge. Eliminating variables make it easier to get your technique down.

Personally, I got comfortable shaving before I concerned myself with honing. For me, I focused on one thing at a time. And with a straight, there's a few things going on. Going from a DE is less difficult than coming in from a cartridge (I'm guessing), but there is still a learning curve.

I may have missed this in the thread, but have you read the tutorials, and/or watched Lynn's DVD? They can both be very helpful. I'd say go over them while your blade is out, review them before your first shave with a fresh blade, and take it from there.

 

[mdunn]

definately stick with it, though

 

[Noebie]

i have read the tutorials here and watched vids elsewhere - i wish i could have someone watch what i'm doing to see where the flaw is

thanks to all for the advice to lay the strop flat for awhile - i'll try that

also thanks to leighton, who is sending me another straight to use and compare while mine goes back for touch up

and thanks for the encouragement from everyone - much appreciated

 

[alexo]

I wonder if the razor wasn't honed originally with an electrical tape on the spine so you effectively tried to hone the bevel instead of the edge when you worked on the barber's hone.

 

[Seraphim]

One thing that I did when first starting that wore out the edge quick was to use too steep of an angle when shaving. Keep the spine very low, almost flat against your face (I seem to post this advice on every thread!).

When I first started, i honed up a razor, looked under the scope: mint!

Had a scratchy shave (too steep of an angle feels lousey to boot!), checked teh edge again: looked like caa-caa!

re-hone & Repeat, but with very low angle: check under scope: no visible change.