Fly Tiers, Give Us a Hand!

[jzuzphreek]

I know there are several of you here, who are quite adept at tying your own flies for fly fishing. It would be swell if any of you would take it upon yourself to share any advice, tips, tricks, or step-by-step instructions you may have developed. I'm aiming at starting a contest in the spring, and I would love for any and all experience levels to feel like that could compete. All I ask is that you not just post a link to another site with instructions. Let's build the valuable content here at B&B, that keeps folks coming back for more.

Some questions to consider:

1) How does a noob get started?

2) What materials and tools are critical? Which are not necessary, but make things easier?

3) What distinguishes materials as "better" than others? Also apply this question to sources of materials (shops, online stores, etc).

4) What are the different kinds of flies, and how are they used?

5) How can a noob become a successful fly tier?

Feel free to add to these questions based on your experience. I look forward to seeing what our talented membership can come up with!

 

[jzuzphreek]

Ok, Now, I know there are a bunch of you out there who tie their own flies. Anybody? Bueller?

 

[roadki11]

What kind of files you'll be tying and how serious you want to get into tying will all factor into what materials and equipment to get. I personally love my Renzetti tying vice, but there are cheaper ones that work as well. The basic materials you'll need to tie are a vice, hooks, material, thread, and good scissors. From there on, there's unlimited supplies that you can get. I recommend a whipping tool and good desk light as well as everything else mentioned.

What kind of flies you're tying will determine your materials and size hooks. If you're in NOLA, will you be hitting the gulf for reds or freshwater for bass and trout? For saltwater look up anything tied by Bob Popovics, Clouser Minnows, and a crab pattern. A good light cured acrylic helps (Tuffleye is the safest since it's not UV), and start with clouser minnows and surf candies. For fresh water a good start would be wooly buggers, foam poppers (bass love these), a crayfish pattern, and you'll eventually need some dry flies and nymphs if you're going for trout.

Some of my personal favorite places to find stuff online is through Bears Den or Whitewaterflies, but I always try and support local shops if I can. Local shops are always willing to help you find exactly what you'll need for you area, and lots have tying clubs that are a great source of information. These clubs are the best way to learn the basics, but there's a plethora of youtube videos for tying any sort of fly you want.

If there's anything else you want more information on just let me know. I may not know everything, but I have some friends that do. haha

 

[jzuzphreek]

Thanks Roadkill!! To be perfectly honest, I have very little interest in fly fishing. My wife says I already have too many hobbies, and my son and I are still trying to learn "regular" fishing.

But I do think Flies are the bees knees! And I think it'd be very fun to learn to tie them. I think it'd be even more fun to stage a Great Outdoors competition!

 

[one cut]

I think you are going to have to go to a fly fishing forum. I know I hate leaving B&B myself.
I tied one fly in school. Friend of mine was a cook and fly fisher.

So what I remember is, You need to collect Feathers keep them in zip lock bags and separate from each other.
a spool of black thread and a fly tying vice.

 

[roadki11]

Thanks Roadkill!! To be perfectly honest, I have very little interest in fly fishing. My wife says I already have too many hobbies, and my son and I are still trying to learn "regular" fishing.

But I do think Flies are the bees knees! And I think it'd be very fun to learn to tie them. I think it'd be even more fun to stage a Great Outdoors competition!

Haha, awesome. My wife tolerates most of my hobbies,... kind of. Fly tying is like wet shaving, you can spend your life savings on it in a weekend if you aren't careful. I am always looking on flytyingforum and others for new ideas. A competition would be cool, but it's so diverse in what you can tie that it would be difficult to judge. Some nice spun deer hair flies or bright salmon flies are almost too pretty to fish with. We have some mounted in shadowboxes just because my wife likes the way they look.

 

[cottontop]

I have been tying flies for many years. Your best bet might be to go to a fly tying supply company web site, and there are many. A beginners "kit" might be a good idea. You will need a good fly tying vise, a few spools of various colors of thread (though just a spool of black in a small diameter will do), a supply of various sizes of hooks, a bobbin, small cuticle scissors, hackle pliers are a must, and some neck hackle (feathers), channelle (sp?), and yarn in several colors. Also, some lacquer head cement, though I have used clear nail polish with good results. A book on fly tying that lists some of the more popular patterns is a good idea. Depending on what kind of flies you want to tie, you can add or subtract materials on that basis. Have fun.
cottontop

 

[oldbluelight]

I have been tying flies for many years. Your best bet might be to go to a fly tying supply company web site, and there are many. A beginners "kit" might be a good idea. You will need a good fly tying vise, a few spools of various colors of thread (though just a spool of black in a small diameter will do), a supply of various sizes of hooks, a bobbin, small cuticle scissors, hackle pliers are a must, and some neck hackle (feathers), channelle (sp?), and yarn in several colors. Also, some lacquer head cement, though I have used clear nail polish with good results. A book on fly tying that lists some of the more popular patterns is a good idea. Depending on what kind of flies you want to tie, you can add or subtract materials on that basis. Have fun.
cottontop

I'll agree with just about all you mention cottontop. But I'm skeptical about fly tying kits. I sold fly tackle and fly tying materials for several years and most of the beginner kits that I saw were simply collections of tools and materials that couldn't be sold any other way. In fact we were so disappointed with what was on the market we put together our own kit using a popular tying manual, good quality tools and materials from our regular stock. Our kit sold for a significant multiple of the price for most other beginner kits but we took the time to talk to a prospective customer and show them that the difference was real. We used Skip Morris's "Fly Tying Made Clear and Simple" as the core of the kit and included all the tools and materials needed for the instructional flies in the book. That's a good plan for getting started. Pick an instructional book, Morris's if it's still in print, and start with the basic tools and materials for the first flies. When you master them buy another round of materials for the next flies. That spreads the cost over time.

 

[Doc4]

1) How does a noob get started?

Get a basic set-up (see #2) and some materials, and start experimenting. If you have a mentor who can get you started, so much the better.

2) What materials and tools are critical? Which are not necessary, but make things easier?

You need a good vice (that will hold the hooks securely ... cheap ones can have the two halves of the pincers misalligned, so only parts of them touch the hook rather than the whole surfaces coming together all at once.)
You need a good pair of small scissors, and a bobbin (it holds the thread ... a good one has enough tension to not let the thread spool out on its own, but you can still wind thread and it spools out under your pressure)

You need hooks. The general difference is between "wet" and "dry" fly hooks, the wet ones being thicker and heavier. There are also "salmon hooks" with the upturned eyes like traditional Scottish flies have ... those are the "lookers" for bigger flies.

You need "head cement" or some sort of lacquer to harden up the "head" of the fly when you are done. You need some wax, to add to the thread to make it stickier, if and when you want to "dub" on some fur.

Materials ... um ... big subject.

3) What distinguishes materials as "better" than others? Also apply this question to sources of materials (shops, online stores, etc).

How much money you spend.

Well, some stuff does have "quality grades" that mean something. Guys will pay a lot for a really good rooster cape, and notice a difference that makes the extra money worthwhile. Spending extra on good thread (thin yet strong ... won't break under normal tying, won't bulk up the flies ... can be money well spent.)

4) What are the different kinds of flies, and how are they used?

The basic difference is between "wet" and "dry" ... the wet ones fished under the water surface, and the dry ones fished on top of it. There are lots of further distinctions.

5) How can a noob become a successful fly tier?

Practice, practice, practice ... and learn the basic patterns. It's fun to just whip up a new fly on the fly (heh ... heh ... heh) but the tried and true patterns work for a reason; there's a wealth of experience/results-based knowledge out there about what flies 'work' and what flies 'don't'.





If you have an idea of what sort of flies you want to tie ... even images you got from the web "something like that", if you don't know if it's trout flies or salmon or bass or salt water or ... ??? ... then that can help direct you toward the best materials to get.

 

[oldtrout]

Vise, bobbin, scissors, fur, feathers, hooks.... Don't do it, your better half will not be on your case to "clean up that mess!"

 

[jzuzphreek]

Vise, bobbin, scissors, fur, feathers, hooks.... Don't do it, your better half will not be on your case to "clean up that mess!"
View attachment 607472

My better half won't be off my case till I'm dead.

 

[Doc4]

My better half won't be off my case till I'm dead.

"That can be arranged ..."

--SWMBO

 

[jzuzphreek]

Yeah.... my better half is WAY hotter than that.

 

[roadki11]

Vise, bobbin, scissors, fur, feathers, hooks.... Don't do it, your better half will not be on your case to "clean up that mess!"

Haha, my wife was having a girls night at the house last night and I got a lot of funny looks when I can up from the basement covered in a rainbow of colored deer hair shavings. My tying bench looked like the cast of the muppets exploded on it.

 

[Curious Adventurer]

Jessica, I have tied flies for more years than I care to remember and taught fly tying classes for Trout Unlimited, Project Healing Waters, adults and kids. I have had to think through each step for clarity whenever I teach and express these steps clearly to promote learning. I had a remarkable experience several years ago when a Project Healing program put out a call for experienced fly tiers to tie flies for its program. It would be a full day of grinding out flies. I don't recall how it came up, but one of the organizers asked me if I would teach fly tying to some of its members instead of tying dozens of flies. Some were disabled and some were staff members in support of the program. None had ever tied but wanted badly to learn. I surveyed the level of understanding and discovered the most students were absolutely bewildered about fly tying tools, basic materials, and techniques. So, I decided to modify my instruction to explain the tools normally used as well as their qualities and value and how to use them. That portion of the instruction took quite awhile. Later, I had them practice with these tools and attempt to tie a basic fly. I used the tools I had collected over the years, which would be too pricey for a beginner. However, I explained how to select a quality tool and best buy. I steered the students to places where they might be able to advance their fly tying skills, e. g., Trout Unlimited, fly tackle shops that offer beginner classes, and on-line fly tying forums, and a couple of books for beginners. I modified my handouts to reflect basics to know before beginning. Later feedback revealed the class was a huge success. Most students remarked it was the first time an instructor took the effort to explain the basic tools and materials. I'll keep this post short by answering your questions.

1. "How does a noob get started?" Learn from experienced tiers. Trout Unlimited holds monthly meetings, which are open to the public. Usually, these chapters are nearby where you live and hold fly tying classes. Ask a TU member who else teaches classes for beginners. Some fly tackle shops offer beginner classes as well. Inquire whether these classes supply the tools and materials and explain them as part of the instruction and find out Take as many classes for beginners as you can, but keep an open mind about the instruction. Remember, many experienced tiers can tie, but few teach well. You'll soon learn who teaches well. There are a number of books available for beginners. One poster in this thread mentioned Skip Morris. Others may be the late Chris Helm, Jacqueline Wakeford, Dick Talleur, John van Vliet, the late Helen Shaw, and Charlie Craven. Read, read, read!

2. "What materials and tools are critical? Which are not necessary, but make things easier?" Tools that are critical would include a vise (stationary or rotary, C-clamp or pedestal), scissors, a bodkin (a needle with a handle one can make by implanting a doll needle into a wine bottle cork), bobbin holder (or simply bobbin, which holds spools of thread), whip-finisher (a tool that fashions a whip finish, but can be done by hand without a tool), and tweezers. Others such as a dubbing tool, magnifier, lamp, etc. may be purchased a bit later as you discover the need. The vise is the priciest of the lot. I would wait awhile until you become familiar with different vises before you make that purchase. Always remember that the most important feature of a vise is that it holds a hook without slipping no matter what else it can do. A well-appointed fly tackle shop normally has a vise or two on display. Test them. After a hook moves ever so slightly after adjustment, move on to the next one. I won't recommend a particular vise, since that is something for you to discover. I own a number of different vises, each has a feature or quality that excels. My travel vise is a vintage Renzetti Traveler because it holds a hook like grim death and, except for the vise head, is made of aluminum to reduce weight. Some of my bench vises and vises for classes are the stationary HMH and Regal (the least adjustment of the all the vises), Dyna-King, Thompson, and Peak. Don't be overly impressed with a rotary vise over a stationary vise. I know master fly tiers who prefer a high end stationary vise. Many started out with a modest Thompson Model A vise and tied professionally on it for many years. The worst vises I've seen are sold in fly tying kits, which are just plain junk. A lot of bargain vises from overseas are usually no bargain.

Hold off buying hooks and materials until you've read enough to understand what you'll need and how they are applied. Probably the first item you'll buy is thread. The market is flooded with fly tying thread. More than likely you'll first buy will be black thread for the range of hook sizes you'll mostly use. At some point soon in your reading, you'll know the properties of nylon, polyester, mono, gel-spun polyester, kevlar, the sizing (the old ought size, e. g., 6/0, vs. denier size), flat vs. bonded or semi-bonded, and break-strength. A recipe for a fly will normally list the type of hook and size range, thread, and other materials. A good instructor will explain the thread he will use and why. Fur, feathers, wire, ribbing, weight, sparkle, body materials should be purchased at first in very small quantities based on what you expect to tie. Think value. As with fly tying tools, the market is loaded with gadgets and gimmicks. I also try to support my local fly tackle shop, but more often I use mail order and there are many to choose. I usually order from J. Stockard, Feather-Craft, and Whitetail Fly Tieing (sic) Supplies based on their inventory, pricing, and service, but I order from others as well. You might consider shipping and handling fees along with the cost of supplies. Watch for sales.

3. "What distinguishes materials as "better" than others? Also apply this question to sources of materials (shops, online stores, etc)."
I may cop out with this question by saying, "Better at what?" Let me mention thread for instance. I still use the venerable Danville Flymaster 6/0 and Flat Waxed Nylon. Both provide a smooth, flat wrap when I need it. Flymaster 6/0 might have one of the lowest break-strengths on the market, but the colors are true, vibrant, consistent and widely available in a bewildering number of colors. It also wraps flat or corded if I merely spin the thread clockwise or counter-clockwise, depending on the need. I also use a lot of the newer polyester threads on the market, e. g., Veevus, because of their amazing break-strength. After you tie with these threads, you'll become savvy about break-strength. Another example is feathers. The highest quality of dry fly feathers is provided by Whiting. But do you need that quality at first and will you tie dry flies? No. You may tie fresh water or salt water flies and do nicely with other less-costly suppliers, e. g., Metz, Keogh, Chinese, or Indian feathers. Be guided by the instructors. Ask questions. Do you need the wide range of sizes in rooster necks (aka: capes) or the limited, but more numerous in these sizes from rooster saddles? Shop based on immediate need at first.

4. "What are the different kinds of flies, and how are they used?" Basically, there are surface (dry flies, some emergers) and sub-surface (nymphs, streamers, scuds/sowbugs, etc.) flies. There are aquatic (anything that lives in the water) and terrestrials (anything that lives on land and falls into the water that fish will eat, e. g., beetles, ants, grasshoppers, mice, etc.). Salt water flies usually imitate baitfish, e. g., Clouser Minnow or Lefty's Deceiver. There are imitators that mimic something fish know as prey (mayflies, caddis, blue wing olives, etc.) and attractors (something that encourages a fish to strike, e. g, Adams, Humpy, Wulff, etc.). You'll soon learn about the four features of flies that catch fish in this order: size, shape, color, and movement.

5. "How can a noob become a successful fly tier?" Practice, practice, practice! Learn fly proportions, learn the limits and features of your tools and materials, learn various techniques. Nail each step completely by repetition and brutal examination. Compare your work with a professionally tied fly. Solicit opinions from advanced tiers. My mentor, a highly accomplished commercial tier, once told me he never considered any new fly he tied as tied well until he had tied a dozen or so and later examined his work critically. Even today I will cut a fly I've tied off the hook if it doesn't hold up to my scrutiny. And after you have tied awhile, learn to tie in a production. A. K. Best wrote a book called "Production Flies." He opined to tie all of the flies you'll need in one step at a time. Not only will you achieve consistency with each step, but you'll tie more efficiently and accurately.

OMG, this post became a tome. Sorry about that. A word of encouragement at the risk of losing my man card or wearing a flame-retardant suit: The best students I have ever taught fly tying or firearms (also I'm an NRA-trained firearms instructor) were females at all ages. (Sorry guys, other instructors seem to agree with me.) So tie one on!

 

[Sir Lurkalot]

For trout, I tie flies using no more than 3 materials: thread, hackle and peacock herl. Sometimes I'll just use thread and hackle. Thread colors are black, grey, red and purple. I do have two spools of Pearsall gossamer silk thread. That stuff is great. Get a good fly tying vise and don't be afraid to spend a little on one. You don't want to waste money on a cheap one and then end up upgrading to a more expensive one. In the vise department "you get what you pay for" is true. Look at the book named "Simple Flies" as well.

 

[Curious Adventurer]

Sir Lurkalot, it's interesting you use silk thread. Have you tied North Country spiders or other wet flies using silk? Last fall I became interested in UK North Country spiders and spent months in research and eventual tying of these simple, elegant patterns. The ties are not complicated, but they are precise. This October I finally had a chance to use them during my first fishing trip to Western North Carolina. They worked just fine, which is remarkable for patterns that originated hundreds of years ago.

 

[Sir Lurkalot]

Curious adventurer, yes I've been tying partridge and orange flies using the silk thread. Also tied a variation of the partridge and orange using red thread as an attractor. I posted a picture of a Gila Trout I caught using the partridge and orange in the "post your catch" thread.

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=609427&d=1445428395

 

[Curious Adventurer]

1) You need a good pair of small scissors, and a bobbin (it holds the thread ... a good one has enough tension to not let the thread spool out on its own, but you can still wind thread and it spools out under your pressure)

You show my favorite bobbin-holder for most spools and I probably have used bobbin-holders from nearly all manufacturers. I believe Umpqua calls it the standard ergonomic bobbin. I seen this marketed from time to time from Metz and Tiemco, but it isn't easy to find readily.

 

[jzuzphreek]

[MENTION=72735]curious[/MENTION]-Adventurer, THANK YOU for the highly detailed response. You speak as someone who is obviously very intimate with your craft. Thanks for taking the time for us. As someone who has never fly fished, and never held a fly before, I feel like I know a little bit more about them now. Of course, now you've got my interest up even more! Doggonit!

I wonder if any of our Fly Tiers can share pictures of works in progress with finished results?